Sweden not in lockdown

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Sweden is still not in lockdown. The schools are open, businesses have continued to work and most public transport is still running. They are relying on people washing their hands, staying at home if they have symptoms and self isolating if they are vulnerable. I wonder if it is working. Would a similar policy have worked in England?

foreignpolicy.com/2020/03/24/sweden-coronavirus-open-for-business/

Ok - I've got the stats from Ireland from yesterday. Bear in mind, they're testing anyone with one symptom i.e. a cough or a fever for e.g.

^The Department of Health has confirmed the deaths of ten more people diagnosed with Covid-19, and a further 255 new cases.
It brings the total number of deaths in Ireland to 19.
To date, 13 males and 6 females with the virus have died. The median age among those is 79.
The number of confirmed cases of Covid-19 now stands at 1,819.
The latest data breakdown of the figures relates to 1,383 confirmed cases recorded up until Tuesday night, 24 March.
It shows there are 66 clusters of the infection, including nine clusters in nursing homes, eight clusters in hospitals and two in "community and long stay environments".
So far, 55% of people with the virus are male, and 45% are female.
Dublin has the largest amount of infections, accounting for 56% of cases, followed by Cork at 11%.
Overall, 23% of all those with the virus are healthcare workers.^

NI - with a smaller population and who have followed the UK model, have more deaths than Ireland.

Sorry - should have put the source of the above www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/0326/1126652-ireland-coronavirus-figures/

So basically, I'd conclude, that you're going to get a higher peak/death rate, the less measures you take.
How that bodes for longer term benefits - who knows.
Italy isn't coping at all where it was allowed to peak rampantly.
Ireland doesn't have a brilliant health service - they're always just behind the UK in terms of stats. They wouldn't have coped AT ALL with a rampant peak, and I suspect Leo Varadkar knew that - hence the early reaction with stringent measures.

I thought NI had had 10 deaths? Proportionally higher but not actually higher.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthcare_in_Europe
Sweden's healthcare system ranks relatively high in Europe - 8th. They can possibly cope better with a peak than the UK for e.g. 16th and Ireland 22nd.

I was a day behind Wetcarparkrain. Two days ago Ireland had 7 deaths. Yesterday, NI had 28 deaths I think. Will try to find figures.

No - I'm wrong - I'm jumbling NI with Wales I think.
10 deaths in NI.

Just ignore my ramblings lol unless I provide you with sources for my figures!!

It would be useful to see death rate expressed as a percentage of the population, rather than a fixed number.

The death rates are going to be proportionally higher in the long term, when the deaths are caused by inability to treat cases due to overcrowding on the health system.

I guess, globally, CV doesn't care whether you're British, Danish, Irish or Swedish - all things being equal - in terms of whether it kills you or not.

Isn't the bottom line that you can better stop it spreading by making everyone stand still, and knowing where it is? Like finding a wasp in the kitchen? So extensive, accessible testing and staying at home. I read that's how South Korea beat it.

The faffing around at the start and not taking it seriously and taking decisive measures has been a lethal mistake. They should have stopped all air travel for three weeks. Then they'd have been about fine probably. Or at least a lot of countries would have.

Just as a ship brought the Plague, so the planes brought this. I know impractical to stop them - but isn't lockdown and people losing lives, jobs, homes as bad or worse?

There will be a new phrase - playing Swedish roulette. It sounds as risky as Russian.

Does anyone know what is the situation in Norway? Curious. I know it’s a completely different country but was traffic between Norway and Sweden comparable to that between Ireland and UK pre measures being implemented?
Norway is capable of throwing the best money in the world at the problem. And my understanding is that they are. Anyone from there or with contacts who are knowledgable? What is their strategy and how affected are they?
Totally different geographical context but similar weather (still wondering how much difference that makes) Iceland. They were exposed to a lot of tourists but are a healthy and active nation. How much difference does that make in the outcome? However, Iceland is not exactly well equipped financially.

They’re not in lockdown but a lot of businesses have closed/told staff to work from home. My boyfriends parents are Swedish and they were both ordered to work from home Tuesday onwards.

Norway is a country that I know nothing about at all!

I come from the UK and I am currently in Sweden. I hear how awful many people are finding lockdown and I wonder if England would have done better to follow the same path as Sweden.

Again, because you seem to have missed it...

We DID do the same as Sweden are doing right now. It didn't work.

The population density in Sweden is 25 per Km2 (64 people per mi2)
The population density in the United Kingdom is 281 per Km2 (727 people per mi2).
Source Worldometer .
Population density is bound to have an influence on an infection that is transmitted by contact/indirect contact/airborne.
Also, Sweden has higher taxes and probably a better health care system.
Not really comparable to the UK, but it will be interesting to observe how things go.

I come from the UK and I am currently in Sweden. I hear how awful many people are finding lockdown and I wonder if England would have done better to follow the same path as Sweden.

Not a Dominic Cummings' plot after all then - unless he has a clone.

We are not going to know which method is best till years down the line when the statisticians are able to crunch all the numbers retrospectively.

Everything at the moment is based on computer modelling, but biological agents don't necessarily act in predictable ways.

Where are the UK in terms of cases/deaths now?

Since the UK are only testing cases which are serious enough to be hospitalised, we just don't know about how many cases we have.

making everyone stand still, and knowing where it is

UK reducing how much people are moving around but neither providing adequate PPE for health care professionals nor testing them routinely means we really.dont.know where it is.

While I accept that figures will be published after the event, my concern is that the UK are avoiding testing exactly so that there are no good data to refute whatever the government wants to publish. Not usually a conspiracy theorist but these are strange times.

I work for a Gothenburg-based company. I'm in the UK and speak to them every morning. Most of them are working from home but they have still been going into the office and attending meetings and business dinners with other companies.

As I understand it, universities and high schools have closed but the primary level schools are considered to be low risk because they are so local, they don't have large catchment areas.

They were quite amused by the UK's lockdown at the beginning of the week but they've gone a bit quiet now.

Meetings and business dinners?
Oh dear.

I don't think it's just primary schools which are open either. Only 6th forms and universities have closed. The equivalent of GCSEs has been cancelled but those teenagers are still going to school.

Norway is in lockdown and have been for weeks with schools closed and closed borders early on. Quarantined all Norwegians entering from abroad and sent people without residence back. The curve seems to be flattening. Health system is amazing. Norwegian citizen here who thought about going home when the crisis started but decided to stay as cold not bring my DH. Terrified of the NHS at the best of time and not the love for it all (the system) so staying isolated as possible. Sweden is also under pressure to lockdown now especially Stockholm. I think they will soon.

Norway is much less densely populated that the Uk, even in normal times the capital city Oslo can sometimes feel like a ghost town compared to London which makes it easier to manage in this situation

Also (like Germany I think) the first round of people to get it were fit skiers who visited Austria and Italy so not some many extreme cases allowing the health service to ramp up

I think the society setup helps - it's more socially conformable here and people are less likely to panic buy as they trust they will be looked after. Although the lockdown started earlier non food shops are (at the moment) still open, people can train and kids can play outside - but again less people and lots of playgrounds

I have wondered about this, and concluded that Löfven (the prime minister) is placing an inordinate amount of trust in the compliance and sense of moral duty and obligation of the Swedish people to follow the basic guidance. Swedes are easily governable and, in most instances, can be relied on to do the right thing for the greater good (a concept drilled into people from early childhood), but I think he's overplayed his hand in this respect. My friends at home are either bricking it, or holding fast to the "If we all just..." line.