Indonesia preparing to deploy up to 8,000 soldiers to Gaza

[Twiglets1]

Indonesia says it is preparing up to 8,000 soldiers for deployment to Gaza, the first country to do so as part of phase two of the ceasefire agreement brokered by the United States late last year.

The army chief of staff, General Maruli Simanjuntak, said training for the soldiers had already begun, and that they would focus on medical and engineering roles in Gaza.

Indonesia has joined President Donald Trump's Board of Peace, which was announced last month.

The timing of the Indonesian troop deployment and their exact role in Gaza have not yet been finalised, but it appears that President Prabowo Subianto has decided they will go.

His decision to join Trump's Board of Peace has been criticised by some Islamic groups in Indonesia, where there has been widespread public anger over the US role in Israel's bombardment of Gaza.

However, Prabowo has argued that, as the world's largest Muslim nation, Indonesia should help to stabilise Gaza, and has said that its involvement would be in pursuit of an eventual two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

Israel's public broadcaster Kan reported that an area in southern Gaza, between Rafah and Khan Younis, had already been designated for use by the Indonesian army to build a barracks for several thousand troops.

Other Muslim countries like Turkey and Pakistan are also considering sending their troops, but have made it clear they would be peacekeepers only, and would not get involved in the planned disarmament of Hamas.

But with Hamas refusing to lay down its arms while Israel continues to occupy parts of Gaza, there is not yet a real peace for the proposed international force to keep.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgjwpx9j2do

I've noted that no one seems able to answer the question of whether its better for Israel to be in charge of Gaza, or Hamas. You dodged the question too.

I didn't dodge the question I clearly stated neither and pointed out that it is a pointless question because it isn't an option being considered by anyone hth.

Society in Gaza has completely broken down, some parts are in a state of lawlessness with armed militia taking control, this is a massive threat now to innocent civilians but also are the IDF who, in a ceasefire, are still killing civilians. I don't know what the answer is but I do know the lives of Palestinians are not safe with the IDF and as the Indonesians seems to be singing from the same hymn sheet they don't appear to be any better.

You can't even bring yourself to choose between Hamas and Israel. It's mind bending.

Hamas is an extremely conservative Shiist Islamist death cult. Absolutely of the same ilk as the Iranian regime. They don't give a shit about the lives of their own civilians. They execute people without trial. Oppression of women is completely accepted and encouraged. Sexual assault common. No elections. Total corruption. Innocent civilians seen as necessary sacrifices to the greater mission. And this is how they treat their own people- thats not even going into how they treat their neighbors. Theres absolutely no comparison with Israel at all. And theres vastly reduced hope for Palestinian future while Hamas are still hanging around like a bad smell. No Arab nation apart from Iran will touch Hamas' Gaza.

Until Hamas leave Gaza, Israel will stay. Once Hamas leaves Gaza, maybe there will be more international- hopefully Arab- interest in rebuilding Gaza for Palestine.

And still you say- neither is perfect. I won't chose between Hamas and Israel. These are the opposing sides. They can't live with each other. And still, you can't chose.

You can't even bring yourself to choose between Hamas and Israel. It's mind bending.

Ffs is it? Hmmm IDF or Hamas who will be worse for Palestinians who will mean less of them die...stop insisting I answer ridiculous questions, the scenario that I would have to choose one is horrible. But to satisfy your weird obsession with this question if you had a gun to my head and no other option on the table I'd say Israel. Can you stop insinuating I'm a terrorist supporter now because it's been pointless and exhausting. I assume you would pick Israel and paper over the tens of thousands of innocent civilians killed by them in your pretence that they are good for Palestinians because they're not Hamas

Lets just agree to hope Hamas fucks off soon enough that some group other than Trumps Gaza Riviera vultures take everything they can get their ultimately self interested hands on?
And lets hope some other moderate Palestinian/ Arab coalition gain control of Palestinian politics.
And lets hope Netanyahu is voted out and the next Israeli administration voted in wants to pursue a permanent solution to this shitshow and give the Palestinians a completely self determining homeland of their own.
None of that is happening until Hamas is gone though.

None of that is happening until Hamas is gone though.

No one seems to know how much of a stronghold Hamas still have, and what about the militia gangs taking hold who've been armed by Israel? So inconvenient now as they create havoc and terror in Gaza

Yes, a never ending torrent of horror for Gazan civilians.
No one seems to have their best interests at heart.
I wish the world as a whole could do more ( although in truth I've no idea what form that help could take )

Why don’t I just expand on my original statement and say for me I would say pretty much anyone was better placed to manage things in Gaza than the Israelis or Hamas. ? Does that sit better?

For me, yes it does.

Would agree someone outside the 2 main sides in the recent war would be better.

I think it would be better for Israel's sake that they not be involved in the internal policing of Gaza. I hope that whoever does, doesn't go on to develop the same symbiotic relationship with Hamas that has been the issue with the aid organisations.

Agreed ... ideally it would be someone completely neutral.

But I'm not sure such a country/organisation exists.

We are talking about a stop gap till Palestinians have the infrastructure and capacity to manage themselves. I wouldn’t expect that to be too long. Surely between an entire world with the will and expertise pushing for the same outcome we can find the resources to make things work?

The “stop gap” could take years.

You are just waving away the problems by assuming it won’t take long for Palestinians to have the infrastructure & capacity to manage themselves. I don’t see evidence this has been done effectively in the past.

And expecting other countries to find the huge resources required to “make things work” - who?

It is becoming obvious no country will invest millions/billions in Gaza without expecting something in return.

The Indonesian military announced on Sunday that the 8,000 troops are expected to be ready by the end of June.

The Board of Peace will hold its first meeting on Thursday in Washington.

Trump wrote on Truth Social that over $5 billion in pledges toward the reconstruction of Gaza will be announced at Thursday’s Washington summit.

The Times of Israel first revealed the planned donations last week, with two Arab diplomats saying that the US was aiming to announce donations from the United Arab Emirates, Qatar, and Kuwait at around $1.25 billion each. The New York Times reported that the US is also planning on making a similar donation.

Maybe I'm cynical but I highly doubt the UAE, Qatar, Kuwait or the US will be donating $1.25 billion each without expecting a lot for themselves in return.

Of course it will take years. Other countries have recovered from war in the past. Of course there will be those seeking to profit and circling like hyenas to see “what’s in it for them”. It isn’t at all obvious that no country will help. I think it’s fairly obvious that most do want to help. I don’t understand what you think should happen now?

I'm not sure what should happen now that's a very complex question.

But my opinion (and it's only my opinion) is that other countries will only heavily invest in the reconstruction of Gaza if there are big profits for them. So realistically I think rebuilding Gaza will mainly be an investment opportunity for rich countries if Hamas leave, and something worse if they don't. Like a continuation of the situation before 7/10/23 only with Palestinians in a worse position now than they were in before the Hamas attack.

I'm sure lots of countries in Europe for example will contribute significant funding for Gaza's humanitarian needs but rebuilding it? That's a much bigger thing and may be confined to the richer countries amongst Board of Peace members.

So you see the “board of peace” as countries looking to exploit the Palestinians in the guise of helping them? Or do you mean they will benefit financially as a byproduct of their altruism but that isn’t the driving force?

I don't see the UAE, Qatar, Kuwait or the US as being altruistic in donating this $1.25 billion pounds each so far ... do you?

Some of the Board of Peace members may be motivated only by their desire to help the Palestinians but I think the ones investing huge amounts of money in rebuilding Gaza will want to see a return on their investment.

That could just be me being cynical of course.

No I’d agree. I would imagine that’s why so many have refused an invitation to join.

Where we possibly differ is that even if the countries investing in Gaza are doing so to make money, (which obviously isn't ideal), I still think that's preferable to what Palestinians are currently having to endure. With the right leadership (less extremist, more pragmatic) they could benefit from Gaza being redeveloped.

I think we probably agree the Trump plan for redeveloping Gaza was awful but the Arab reconstruction plan looked much better.

I think anything that does not aim to allow the people of Palestine to choose their own course is not acceptable. There is much work to do before that can happen, obviously. A national level Maslow hierarchy (for example) with clear steps to true freedom is what I would be looking for. At present we aren’t even seeing physiological needs met (food, shelter, medicine) so that is the first step. Anyone standing in the way of this process should imo be stopped. I would say both IDF and Hamas fall into that category. They have proved themselves to be unable to provide for even basic human needs.

What if the people of Palestine choose Hamas? They can’t be allowed to make that choice surely.

I believe the people of Palestine chose Hamas because of the corruption of Fatah, and the generally hopeless state of Palestinian politics- with no clear pathway to real self determination and statehood. Surely if they could see a genuine pathway to a better future a significant proportion of them wouldn't chose the violence and death route?
There just needs to be a clear path.
Hamas needs to go and Netanyahu and the religious nutjobs need to go too.
🤞

I’m not sure @dairydebris

Hamas still seems to have a lot of support in Gaza.

I like your optimism though. Agree that Hamas needs to go & Netanyahu’s coalition government has too many religious nut jobs as you say so they should go too and hopefully be replaced by a more moderate Israeli government.

I know what you mean, but it's only logic. They're people same as any other people anywhere. Remove the source of grievance, offer an alternative coherent narrative and genuine pathway, and enough people will choose the route of hope.
There will always be a few nutjobs but thats the same everywhere in the world.
I absolutely KNOW its possible.

Yes there is still support for Hamas and the IDF/Netanyahu still have a lot of support in Israel. I don’t think we get to veto other countries choices. That said I think it’s fairly obvious that we won’t be at that stage for some time. By then my hope is that Israelis have moved on from Netanyahu (or worse) and the Palestinians have found their feet.