Just re-read Ballet Shoes as an adult

[heron98]

Someone answer me this - if they are so poor they can't even afford new clothes, why don't they get rid of the flipping cook and the maid? Why doesn't Garnie get a job instead of staying up all night stressing about money?

Wood I found that really interesting as well. Pride and Prejudice is like this too, always going on about how very poor they are, but employing cooks and maids.
Singled out is very interesting (I can't remember which PP mentioned it), how the excess women were seen as a real problem in the press and how this put pressure especially on upper(middle) class women because you could marry up but not down. It also gave these women a sort of freedom to do more (study, organise etc) and presumably turn in to the sort of women who became the lady doctors (surely lesbians?) in Ballet Shoes. Anyone else who'd love to read a story about them? I always found them the most interesting lodgers. And obviously Petrova was the Fossil to want to be!

Saplings is published by Persephone books and is a good read if you don't mind it being sadly realistic (not for comfort reading, like Ballet shoes is).

I might just go buy the Cazalet books off the recommendation from this thread.

I don't think they say they are poor in Pride and Prejudice - they just WILL BE when Mr Bennet dies because the estate will be inherited by Mr Collins.

At the moment they are decently-off but Mrs Bennet is not very good at managing her household, so they probably are always spending a little more than they should be.

I've not seen anything which suggests they were edited as well...I hope not. I have a copy of Party Shoes which was originally called 'the party dress'
No it was "Party Frock", not "The party dress".

Ruth Jervis, who illustrated the original ballet shoes was Noel's big sister (Isabelle from Vicarage Family) I believe.

sorrel when were your copies printed? I can only see original and very expensive copies on Amazon...

Thanks Witchend, I knew it wasn't party shoes anyway!

I have an original version of The Children of Primrose Lane. It is an anomaly as they are very much working class. Is it the one with the spy?

You're right, it is the one with the spy and they are very much working class totally.

Thinking about it, House in Cornwall is middle class without being strapped for cash. So another that isn't totally true to form.

I love this thread! I've still got a massive collection of NS books from my 70s childhood, which I managed to persuade my DS to get into when he was 10/11/12 IIRC. Other than Ballet Shoes, which I've reread umpteen times, Apple Bough is one of my favourites, as are the Gemma books, especially the one when she realises she's happier having an 'ordinary' life than gadding about the world with her mother. That recognition that the dreaded suburban life is actually something that children enjoy struck me at the time as I had a very haphazard upbringing of my own. I'd have loved nothing more than a large busy family to come home to every day... and yes, the handling of depression in Caldicott Place is so well done, especially for a children's book. Am I right in remembering depression featuring in another of her books? Is it Apple Bough or the Gemma books where the father refers to it like a black dog, similar to Churchill's experience of depression?

Oh and my favourite children's book(s) depicting poverty is The Family from One-End-Street series of three.

^^ not by Noel Streatfeild, I hasten to add.

Does anyone else remember a book called tuppence to cross the mersey? It was (I think) set in a similar era, and the middle class family fall into real poverty - ie not being able to afford food. The family really struggle because they don't know the basics of looking after themselves. I read this book years ago but it has really stuck with me.

Tuppence to Cross the Mersey was by Helen Forrester, wasn't it? I haven't read it, but I remember it being a big seller (used to be a bookseller).

'Feeling black doggish' comes up in a few NS books: I would say it's broadly the same as having a chip on your shoulder/going to eat worms/feeling generally persecuted and hard done to

Ooh yes, Eliza for plain. And I love penny plain too. Not read the others Elli mentions, enjoyed A House of our Own, but not up with the greats.

If going for DE Stevenson, go for

The Mrs Tim ones
The young Clementina
Anna and her daughters
Miss Buncle.

What a wonderful thread this is.

Did Jenny Overton write more than the 13 days of Christmas and the one about the priest?

Tuppence to Cross The Mersey is a very good read - it's a true story.

Yes Tuppence to Cross the Mersey was one of my favourites. It was an autobiographical novel, and one of a trilogy at first (a fourth one added later I believe), and then the author (Helen Forrester, which was a pen name) went on to write quite a few novels as well, many based in Liverpool in the war.

I think I'm going to have to reread it now - and read the sequels

Yes, this thread made me think of Tuppence To Cross The Mersey too. That family who lost their money descended into genuine poverty because they lacked any ability to manage money. They bought lots of goods on HP which they then couldn't afford,not he goods were reclaimed, but the contract meant they still had to make the weekly payments. They were extremely malnourished, often had no heat, horrible illnesses and if I remember the baby died because of poverty....not very genteel at all. The parents were useless because their background hadn't given them any useful skills and their background and accents stopped them doing jobs the working class did.

Thinking about items that the newly poor couldn't do without in NS books or the Railway CHildren made me think about what the equivalents today are. Servants were relatively cheap and seem as essential. Today if people have a bit of a come down, they still want their iPhone with a big contract, to shop in Waitrose and to avoid certain areas or schools. I'm sure there are modern equivalents of what could never be acceptable for the rich who become poor. Any other ideas on this?

The tv.
A holiday somewhere naice, even if camping.

Avoiding junk food.
Not telling people the jam is Hartley's not Tiptree
School visits
Christmas presents
Private schooling if at all possible ( mortgage the GPs)
Car.

Mercedes519 I'm out until late this evening but will check later!

I just had a quick Google and here's a piece on Churchill and the 'black dog' of depression: theconversation.com/winston-churchill-and-his-black-dog-of-greatness-36570. Now I just need to remember where I read it in NS!

Isn't the black dog another term for depression? Might be wrong.

I think the family adapted well to their (relative) poverty in Ballet Shoes - taking in lodgers. Nanna comes across as a very practical soul, who is the driving force behind the scheme. Of course, the family are lucky in their lodgers. I liked the glimpses of Winifred who comes from a more 'real' poverty - lots of brothers and sisters at home and a poorly dad.

'Black doggishness' is certainly in The Painted Garden.

I think Rachel in The Painted Garden comes over all 'black dog' (and probably Jane too!)

Dr Johnson uses 'the black dog' as a metaphor for misery in his letters to .Mrs Thrace and Boswell. Apparently it was a common phrase for nannies to use to their charges. The internet is very a useful place 😀