Childminders- 2 under 1's for one month - what are my chances?

[alison222]

I have been looking after a 6 mth old on a temporaty basis- due to finish at the end of next week.
I have filled the vacancy from the beginning of Sept with an 11 month old.
The parents of the first child are now asking me if I could do 2.5 days from then too.
Both are teachers so I won't have looked after the one with whom I've signed the contract until the end of August.
Do you think OFSTED may allow it on continuity of care? My concern is that I won't actually have looked after the second child but have already signed the contract.
To complicate matters further my certificate needs amending to allow this as my son will go into reception from September but they phase them in slowly and he will only be doing half days until 19th Sept, so technically before that does he still count as an under 5?

Alison - sorry it hasn't worked out in time, hope you get to have both children.

Am intrigued as to why OFSTED would allow this, as we have minders locally who have been turned down for registration changes which are far less "complicated" than yours for ongoing care.

Still waiting to hear from the mum. Hmm. The longer she leaves it the less likely it looks. Still I have my hands very full settling the 11 month old who is very clingy poor mite. It must be a dreadful shock to him - it sure is for me after 2 that were easy to settle . It sure takes me back to the 1st child I minded a boy of the same age and I had similar limpet behaviour. Ah well it will pass and TBH I'm quite glad after the last couple of days there is only one child under 1.
I had my notice of intention today so at least OFSTED are sorting it out.

Prisoner, I've no idea why they let me and don't let some others - I guess I must have written a good "text book" answer as to how I could meet the physical and emotional needs of 2 uner 1's and still care for the older ones.

Alison - friend of mine has identical "qualifications" as me (minded for years, done full CCP course plus others etc.) requested variation to allow four children under 5 years for a couple of hours on one particular day per week. Was "proper" continuity of care for toddlers minded since birth (one mum working slightly longer hours on that day). Her written request followed same layout as mine. Mine accepted; hers refused, even after appeal. OFSTED do not accept that they treat requests differently, but they do!

I could write a long list of similar requests from minders - sometimes they say yes, more often they say no, and there is no logical reason. They are not consistent. I am now on county c'minding association committee, and we hear this time and time again.

Good luck with your newbie - can be a bit of a difficult age to settle!

It sounds like its luck of the draw then, who you get as the inspector making the decision. Hmm, I guess I was just lucky - although it was only for 2 under 1's but remaining as 3 under 5's not an increase to 4 under 5's. Aghh shudder the thought unless they were all older. That would be hard work!!! you must be very brave

It's going to be a no I think.

I wanted to have a little girl, who was 4, for 4 afternoons in total. She started school fulltime in October, but the parents wanted me to have her for the two weeks before when she was parttime, just on two days. They said no cos she was a new mindee. Even though the second she started school full time, she's counted as 5, even in the holidays when I'd have her all day!

Lunavix - Ofsted have said yes, its now the parents who are dithering around. Ah well it will be in place if anything else turns up. Fron the notice of intention, there is no time limit on it, it just says no more than 2 children under 5 with no mention of babies.

It does seem strange how they make their decisions, doesn't it. They said I could have 4 under 5 (who are actually all under 3!), including 2 under 1. It's for 1.5 days per week, until the oldest starts full-time school or a child leaves. I must say though, it IS hard work, and I wouldn't like to do it any more often!

Blodwen - how did you manage to get your registration variation? Good for you for being able to have it, but it really annoys the hell out of me that OFSTED are so inconsistent with all of this.

I have actually spoken to two inspectors (and other people-in-the-know) about these inconsistencies, and there is just no logic to it. They say that they will allow things if it is continuity of care for siblings, but mine was not for siblings! They say that they won't allow you to do it if it is new business, yet Alison appears that she may be able to do it (sorry Alison, not cross with you - just the system )

I know of a minder who was refused a very short term (two-week) variation which had the backing of Social Services because they were using the childminder, and were obviously in need of her!

I totally agree with you that the system is not consistant. It appears that it depends on how the inspector feels when they call you up to discuss the details and how you present yourself to some extent - not fair really. But I'm still pleased that I've got the variation And now the parent has come back to me to use me for those 2.5 days a week, so I'm going to need it too.
Anyway from my point of view it will be relevant for 2 weeks BUT the variation is indefinate.
I really wish I knew how they worked it out

Alison - what do you mean when you say that the variation is indefinite? That you will always be able to have two under-12months?

Well done for getting the other baby back anyway!

I know of a few local childminders who are allowed 2 < 1 and there is no fixed time on their certificate

DH & I are allowed 3 under 2 between us or 2 under 1 each (when working by ourselves) and that is indefinate too (in our case it was twins, then the 3rd was an overlap of 3 half day - one a week until his 1st B'day)

But OFSTED is so inconsistant

I still do not understand OFSTED's system - we are supposed to put in writing how we would manage specific children for a specified amount of time, yet some minders get carte blanche to have two under-ones with no time frame????

Methinks I am going to write to OFSTED and just ask if I can have a permanent variation to my registration (ie. two under-ones whenever I feel like it ...)

And both of my new childminder/minding assistants got it on their initial reg "as they work with us"

It is stupid ThePrisoner

ThePrisoner - I did write to ofsted with my request, adding lots of detail about why I thought they should say yes (ie. continuity of care (both existing families),lots of experience, lots of equipment, and VERY IMPORTANT imho, I only work term time, so have holidays to recover! It is hard work. My two babies are quite different - one sitting,crawling, pulling up to standing, trying to climb etc who thinks it's great fun to shout at the top of her voice because it makes the other baby cry! He is (fortunately!) not as mobile yet! They are 3 weeks apart in age - almost 8m and almost 9m - the younger one being the daring one!

Blodwen - well done you (although two babies can be hard work!)

However, it won't stop me moaning and moaning about the situation - in the old Social Services' days, I was allowed two under 12months as I'd had twins of my own, plus lots of experience/courses etc. When OFSTED took over ... by this time, I'd had plenty more experience of caring for two babies ... but they would hear none of it.

There are lots of minders out there struggling to find work. More babies/children are cared for in nurseries now than they used to be and, with funded places in nurseries available from when children are 3 years old, we have less children in that age group too. Schools are being encouraged to offer before and after-school care, which may also lose us business. If we get a phone call from a parent of a baby, they haven't got time to muck about waiting for us to write to OFSTED about how wonderful we might be, on the offchance that they might allow us to care for 2 babies - they'll just ring the next childminder on the list who definitely has a space.

I think it is up to individual parents to decide if the childminder they want is able to care for two babies. I would like minders to be able to have two babies under 12 months included on our registration certificates (if we want it) - perhaps if we fulfill certain criteria ?? (previous experience, enough equipment like cots etc., done specific courses, whatever??)

I'm allowed to have two babies if I have one of my assistants present (husband, older dds) - but I am the one who is actually doing the "looking after" (nappies, feeding, playing) with an assistant in the house for emergency back-up. I know I can manage on my own!

Rant over ... sorry ... I'm a happy bunny really!

Phew ... I do go on a bit don't I?! Let me see if I can think of something a bit more controversial to get on my high horse about ...

How about taking on my big problem ThePrisoner

DH & I are both C/Mers we have 1 7yo DD (from her next B'D this won't be a problem)

When DH is not here I am only allowed 5 under 8 (as dd is included)

When I am not here DH is only allowed 5 under 8 (as dd is included)

Under almost ever senario possible (the exceptions being one of being in Hosp or abroad) if DD needed to come home from school early the "other" parent would collect her - eg the 1 not working. When they arrive home with dd our numbers jump to 12 under 8 so we aren't overminding. But they refuse to let us have 6 under 8 indvidually because of DD

It makes no sense

Katymac that sounds as crazy as anything I ever heard.
In answer to your question prisoner the intention notice just says "no more than 2 children under 5 (my dd is 2.5 being the other under 5)" with no other comments.

They do seem to have changed the system a bit though because I asked for a variation bacck in Jan to care for 4 under 5's temporarily to keep siblings together but it was refused because it was new business - fair enough. BUT the form I completed then sees to have been abolished.
This time I got a letter asking me to explain how I could manage to care for 2 under ones and my toher mindees with particular refernce to toys and equipment, and emotional and physical care.
SO I wrote back with chapter and verse on how I would do that and it seems to have gone through.
Someone at OFSTED did say to me that now all childminders have the right to ask to look after 2 under ones, So I guess soemthing has changed recently but not been well publicised
Maybe you should try again.

On anouther subject though I have just lost my morning drop to a school breakfast club. I suspect due to price as its only 3/5's of my hourly rate. I still have him in the afternoons though. For how long that remains to be seen depending on how the after school clubs caatch on too.

Oh my awful typing I really must proofread

I'm going to apply for a job at OFSTED and see if I can overhaul the system ...

And just to start up something controversial again - did you know that if you are the emergency contact for any of your mindees (or any other children for that matter) at nursery/school, you should actually have the space available for that child should you be summoned to collect them! (ie. if your next-door neighbour asks to put your name down as emergency contact for 3 year old Little Freddie if she was uncontactable, you should have a vacancy for him). (Does that make sense?!)

This is nothing to do with whether you are receiving any payment from the parents or whether you have responsibility for the child whilst they are there, it is purely having your name recorded as the contact.

I am the emergency contact for half the town where I live, both for mindees, ex-mindees, friends etc. (for children of all ages). If they were all sick at the same time, I'd probably have to hire a coach to collect them. In reality, I've rarely had to collect anyone.

The moral of this story is that you shouldn't tell OFSTED about being an emergency contact at your next inspection!

alison222, I know what you mean about losing bussiness to the breakfast club,

The breakfast club at my Dds school is a quarter of my hourly rate, the after school club is also cheaper and I have lost out too both.

I run our school breakfast & AS club......and I'm empty

I really bad mouth our local B/C and A/S club and seriously I think its a horrible way for children to spend 10hrs a day in school. The one that picks up from our school thankfully charges the same as me, although you don't have to book the same day each week so probably is better for thoses who shift work. I was very happy to see that they only picked up 2 on Monday and I picked up 7 and my DS.

The breakfast club has just started so I haven't heard any reports about it other than the price - and that was from one of the ex teachers.
I guess they aren't full if my charge is going to go there, but how full is another matter. Its actually on school grounds and I think run by the teachers.
I was under the impression that you could be the emergency contact with no impact whatsoever on your numbers, beczasues there is something in the standards(i think there?) about having to call ofsted and reporting any emergencies that you have that take you over your numbers and that you are not supposed to have the children for more than 2 hours regardless. Am I missing something?