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Paid childcare

Discuss everything related to paid childcare here, including childminders, nannies, nurseries and au pairs.

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Original poster

Paid childminder full fees as retainer during COVID lock down, now tells us she is closing business

43 replies

Rubberneck71 · 18/08/2020 12:40

Hi all,

Looking for advice from anyone that is in a similar situation. We have been paying our twins' childminder full fees in the months since lock down at the end of March as a retainer to keep her services for when we are able to send the twins back in September.

We removed the twins of our own volition a week or so before lock down started as due to health issues within our family we needed to be shielded from COVID. Our child minder told us we would need to keep paying her in full to ensure her business stayed afloat. As we were still getting paid in full (working form home) we were happy to do this, on the understanding this would mean she would take the twins back in September. We paid in full April, June & July. In May she claimed government furlough money so we didn't make any payment that month. She reopened in June but we weren't in a position to put the twins back in her care as we were still shielding so we continued to pay the retainer. Total payments by us during this period ~£2000.

She text us at the end of July asking when the twins were coming back, we said early September and this was agreed as the provisional date. On 5th August we received a phone call saying she was closing the business at the end of the month (i.e. less than 1 months notice) so would not be providing any childcare in future.

We understand this has been a difficult situation for everyone but we do feel as if payment has been taken in knowledge that she would not be providing future childcare when we needed it. Are we entitled to reimbursement of any (or all?) of the retainer as we paid this in good faith to ensure her services would be available to us in September.

OP posts:

Apple40 · 18/08/2020 20:37

Hi, Iam a childminder there was no furlough for self employed we were able to claim SEISS which was based on 80% of our profits on our last years trading. You had to have had 3 years worth of accounts to apply and getting anything, if eligible you had to declare you will stay open and in business for the rest of this tax year. Was she closed in April to you or did you choose not to send your twins. Sorry but as she was open in June July and you did not send the twins in you have lost that money. But she should pay you back the April fees if she was closed and not just your decision not to send in. Sadly loads of childminders have closed there doors since lockdown and I can see many more doing the same in the next year .did you pay a deposit for their spaces as she owes you this as well. If she asks you to pay notice period I would tell her to use the April fees.

Crapster · 18/08/2020 21:03

@christinarossetti19 no, but for the people banging on about reporting the childminder for claiming furlough when still working it's a pretty important distinction to make clear!

christinarossetti19 · 18/08/2020 21:23

Except that you don't claim furlough.

Dohorseseatapples · 18/08/2020 21:26

Small claims court if she doesn’t refund you the money?

ivfdreaming · 18/08/2020 21:35

Unfortunately I would have said you aren't entitled to any money back - it was your choice not to send your children when she reopened. The £2k was to cover fees for your places when it was your decision to keep them home?

BumpkinSpiceBatty · 19/08/2020 11:27

She should refund you any fees paid before June but after that she was open and you chose not to send the children to her.

RedRumTheHorse · 19/08/2020 13:02

@IncrediblySadToo my childminder actually filled her places in June/July after she was allowed reopen.

OP read your contact as 4 weeks is 28 days not a month. If she gave you less than 4 weeks notice then you can ask for a refund for the period she didn't give you notice. Also if you don't pay her for August then she can counterclaim, which means your April payment will offset not paying her for August.

userxx · 19/08/2020 13:08

If all of her families continued to pay in full she was unaffected. Which is what I said in my previous post. Believe me, I've done a lot of investigation into this.

Its not just about the financial side of things.

Nicadooby · 19/08/2020 15:39

Just wondering if the original poster is classed as key worker? as if they are the childminder would have been about to care for the children all along

modgepodge · 19/08/2020 16:32

@Nicadooby

Just wondering if the original poster is classed as key worker? as if they are the childminder would have been about to care for the children all along

Not necessarily...I’m a teacher but my childminder refused to take my daughter during lockdown unless both my husband and I were out at work, if either of us was at home she wouldn’t take her. As my husband works from home normally anyway we couldn’t use her services at all. I think each CM/nursery/school interpreted their key worker provision rules their own way.

OP...I think unfortunately you’ve lost that money. It was actually only April you paid as a retainer. She reopened and kept your places in June and July (and August?), and you chose not to use them. It must be extremely frustrating, especially at such short notice, but I’m not sure she’s done anything wrong.

Blondeshavemorefun · 20/08/2020 14:29

You may have paid full fees but maybe others didn’t

So she was entitled to claim for the seiss grant

She may have got it in May as I did. But it covered the 3 months and wouidnt have been much as 80% of nett profits - not 80% of gross salary as was furlough

So you should have paid May imo

She was open June July aug but you chose not to use her so she was entitled to her fees imo

She should give you the full notice whether 4w or more whatever is in contract

£2000 for twins over 5mths isn’t much. How many days are they doing - assume 1-2 days a week

jannier · 20/08/2020 20:30

@modgepodge.
The guidence was clear we were allowed to take children of keyworkers even if only 1 parent was a keyworker if the children could not be safely cared for at home..
.
But your husband was home which like most parents meant he could care for them....yes hard to work but most had to admittedly it was mainly women according to statistics but no reason why he couldn't im guessing he wasn't sawing, welding d8scusding medical, social or legal cases

modgepodge · 20/08/2020 21:04

[quote jannier]@modgepodge.
The guidence was clear we were allowed to take children of keyworkers even if only 1 parent was a keyworker if the children could not be safely cared for at home..
.
But your husband was home which like most parents meant he could care for them....yes hard to work but most had to admittedly it was mainly women according to statistics but no reason why he couldn't im guessing he wasn't sawing, welding d8scusding medical, social or legal cases[/quote]
Yes, but every place interpreted it their own way - the government said one parent key worker was fine (in theory a SAHP with a partner working night shifts at Tesco could have sent child to school full time despite both parents being at home all day) but different places added extra rules. A friend of mine is a headteacher and chose to make the rules say BOTH parents had to be key workers - if they said only 1, they had half the school in which defeated the point of closing. My CM chose to refuse to take anyone unless both parents were out of the home, as well as one parent being a key worker. As it was, we both worked from home most of the time, and yes we managed to juggle the care between us - as you say it was hard work but manageable.

hastingsmua1 · 20/08/2020 21:06

Was there a contact involved with the retainer payment?

Nibor1991 · 20/08/2020 21:09

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

jannier · 20/08/2020 23:29

@modgepodge...
Yes some schools particularly have made their 9wn decisions but your cm was following guidence....your husband was working from home therefore could care for your children so I don't get why you brought her up as an example. Now if you had said school deciding only the same parent can do drop off and pick up id agree....totally illogical as anyone living in the same bubble does not introduce more risk...but being forced to leave work as a nurse early to do the collection or your partner loose their job that can not be done from home is mad, and not any guidence.

modgepodge · 21/08/2020 08:11

[quote jannier]@modgepodge...
Yes some schools particularly have made their 9wn decisions but your cm was following guidence....your husband was working from home therefore could care for your children so I don't get why you brought her up as an example. Now if you had said school deciding only the same parent can do drop off and pick up id agree....totally illogical as anyone living in the same bubble does not introduce more risk...but being forced to leave work as a nurse early to do the collection or your partner loose their job that can not be done from home is mad, and not any guidence.[/quote]
I mentioned her only because someone said ‘ Just wondering if the original poster is classed as key worker? as if they are the childminder would have been about to care for the children all along’ - I was just pointing out that wasn’t necessarily the case, my CM being an example!

I agree lots of schools have added additional ridiculous rules (and on here I have seen some truly crazy ones for September) which don’t help anyone and make some families’ lives very tricky :( irrelevant to the OP of course!

jannier · 10/11/2020 16:56

@modgepodge.
But guidence was clear keyworkers could get care but only if no one was working from home and it would be unsafe for the child. To break this invalidated insurance and risked Ofstef intervention....although I'm sure some did.

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