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Childbirth

Share experiences and get support around labour, birth and recovery.

Original poster

Epidural questions - Why the stigma attached

331 replies

horseshoe · 21/04/2008 16:37

I had one with DD1, G&A with DD2, desperately trying for a home birth for DC3.

I have said to the MW that if I end up going to hospital I am just gonna ask for epidural if I feel I want one to which she replied "Oh you dont want one of those".

With DD1 I did have vontouse delivery but I had epi after 18 hours of labour when I was 8cm dialated and before they realised that baby was back to back and getting stuck in birth canal.

Everyone I speak to especially "angellic "i've had 3 natural no drugs birth sis" appears to look down their noses at this decision.

So can anyone tell me why they are so wrong and what is the best time to have one - nearer birth or early labour. I seem to remeber that they wait until at least 4cm dialated.

OP posts:
expatinscotland · 21/04/2008 23:27

I think the stigma is cultural, tbh. In Britain, it's seen as something to avoid.

I had an epi delivery of a child who was OP and had her hand up by her head. The labour was agony and I don't think having the epi resulted in any 'cycle of intervention'.

She was in an odd position, anyway.

With DD2, I had a drug free delivery. I got to hospital too late for anything but G&A, which made me vomit and gave me a panic attack.

This time, I have chosen to go to a consultant-led unit and have it plasted all over my notes that I want an epidural asap.

ButterflyMcQueen · 21/04/2008 23:31

after 4 natural births (gas and air)

i had an amazing fantastic earth shatteringly wonderful epidural

no loss of feeling in legs

no catheter

just pleasant loss of pain

calm and slow delivery of my calm baby

i HIGHLY recommend them and I should know

expatinscotland · 21/04/2008 23:33

i didn't have a catheter, either, until it was determined that i'd have a forceps delivery.

bliss!

contrasted with my 'natural' delivery.

i felt trapped by the pain. i wanted to die. i truly did, rather than suffer anymore.

i felt like i was being disembowelled by the baby's head.

i'm still traumatised by it.

staranise · 21/04/2008 23:35

Just interested why women in labour more or less seem happy to have epis (or whatever pain relief is going), while MWs seem to want to avoid them (aware I am massively generalising here). Have never personally met with disapproval from another woman over having an epi except for MWs.

Realise there is research that epis lead to more intervention but intervention seems to be more acceptable if it is pain-free? Or perhaps it is becuase epis often don't work and therefore they are often not worth the extra hassle in administering them?

Not sure I'm making sense anymore, have finally finished work for tonight, off to bed...

ButterflyMcQueen · 21/04/2008 23:38

i have said before expat - i begged to die and meant it!

fortyplus · 21/04/2008 23:52

My MW said that if you break your arm you wouldn't turn down pain relief, so she didn't understand why people felt compelled to endure 'natural' childbirth. No stigma from her!

mom2latinoboys · 22/04/2008 04:13

Personally they aren't for me. But I don't care if anyone else has one. Figure here in the US it's between 80%-90% of women get them, so not much of a stigma.

jaynz · 22/04/2008 05:30

My chiropractor said he can tell who has had epidurals and who hasn't from their probs. He said that most of their probs are because of the usual damage caused by epi.

Just another bit of info

Anagram · 22/04/2008 07:06

"Usual damage caused by an epi." That's nonsense. Can you be specific? Can you point to any studies that prove that?

Anagram · 22/04/2008 07:10

Another bit of nonsense ... "epis often don't work." I've lived in four countries. Why is it that I've only heard this in the UK?

ImightbeLulumama · 22/04/2008 07:23

why are you saying it is nonsense? there are times when an epidural only works on one side, or makes a woman too numb.. there is also the issue of a dural tap too. there are side effects. rare, but can be nasty , and it is not correct to say that is nonesense. the process of inserting a needle into the epidural space brings risks. benefits too. but also risks.

there are side effects to virtually all methods of pain relief, not just epidural.

i cannot link to specific studies, but all the many, many books and articles and journals i have read about childbirth have discussed these issues

ChutneyMary · 22/04/2008 07:52

Giving birth is not a competition. If you need relief on the day, have it. You don't know how the labour will progress and what will be best until you are there. There are risks of nerve damage etc with epidural and obviously you make an informed choice but sometimes you have no other way of coping.

With DD1, I had pessaries (3), ARM and then synto drip. I was in agony and would have had an epidural if it had to be administered in my eye, so desperate was I for some relief. It took a long while to get a good block as at first only half took. My PCA didn't work either. I had trial of forceps and then an em CS as she was stuck. Turns out because of her position, I'd never have got her out anyway, so intervention inevitable.

DD2 - planned CS and spinal block. All fine.

I hope your labour is swift and you get the relief you need quickly on the day

ChutneyMary · 22/04/2008 07:52

Giving birth is not a competition. If you need relief on the day, have it. You don't know how the labour will progress and what will be best until you are there. There are risks of nerve damage etc with epidural and obviously you make an informed choice but sometimes you have no other way of coping.

With DD1, I had pessaries (3), ARM and then synto drip. I was in agony and would have had an epidural if it had to be administered in my eye, so desperate was I for some relief. It took a long while to get a good block as at first only half took. My PCA didn't work either. I had trial of forceps and then an em CS as she was stuck. Turns out because of her position, I'd never have got her out anyway, so intervention inevitable.

DD2 - planned CS and spinal block. All fine.

I hope your labour is swift and you get the relief you need quickly on the day

Heifer · 22/04/2008 08:18

Lulumama - you can link to my experience

I had an epidural with DD, but the first one numbed be completely within 5 mins... They had to take it out, and the 2nd one didn't work - but unfortunately it took quite a few hours to realise this (I am guessing due to being numbed), they couldn;t top it up at all..

I ended up needing a C but they couldn't give me a spinal injection (as the epidural hadn't worked) so I ended up having a GA C.

Then after the birth I had the migraines, so ended up needing to go back down to theatre to have the tap (blood taken from arm and insrted back into the hole made by epidural) that was the most painful part of the hole birth!!!

So for me side effects and useless epidural....

staranise · 22/04/2008 09:04

A G&A C-section!!!! Thought that went out in the 19th century!
has panic attack at thought of next birth. Doesn't want to hear any more scary birth stories, thank you. Needs to stop reading MN and do some work

WaynettaSlob · 22/04/2008 09:09

I might have Imightbelulumama!!! Of course I could only tell you if I I knew you were actually Lulumama!
I 'came out' a few weeks ago, when everyone else was fessing up. DC 3 due end of August....
Am hoping to start my very own live labour thread when it all kicks off!!!!

Anna8888 · 22/04/2008 09:16

Here in France epidurals are extremely common.

The "stigma" against epidurals is that they significantly increase the risk of:

  • longer labour
  • ventouse delivery
  • forceps delivery
  • episiotomy
  • emergency caesarean

All of which carry risks for both mother and baby.

belgo · 22/04/2008 09:18

Epidurals are also common in Belgium, and also here are usually plenty of aneasthetists around to give them. There's no big deal or stigma attached to having one.

My friends who have had them have mostly been very happy with the pain relief they bring, although I do know of some cases where the epidural has caused more problems or not worked properly.

Anna8888 · 22/04/2008 09:20

Here in France it is a legal obligation to have an anaesthetist present at the birth.

slinkiemalinki · 22/04/2008 09:42

Presumably a GA section means a general anaesthetic c-section rather than gas & air... I hope!
The NCT classes I attended were very anti-epidural (cascade of intervention and all that). I knew four people who had them first time round - two had normal deliveries, one failed ventouse, episiotomy and forceps (and missed a section by skin of her teeth), the other a section. Most people I knew were however keen to avoid it because of the cascade point.
Personally I didn't have one and I do feel a bit pleased and amazed by myself that I can tolerate that degree of pain and still function (I was induced with gel which I understand some people say makes it worse). Actually the MWs where I was were quite lazy and very keen for me to have one so I would shut up and get on the bed and the monitoring and make their job easier. I wouldn't say there was a stigma but it is not for me.

Heifer · 22/04/2008 09:51

yes GA C - meant general anaesthetic... (god can you imagine gas and air)....

fortyplus · 22/04/2008 10:03

I have friend who is MW and I said why doesn't everyone have an epi? She said sometimes they don't work properly (this happened to me at one stage - the epi was only working down one side, which felt very strange), some people get violent headache and some suffer back problems afterwards from sitting too long in the same position. This can be avoided by making a conscious effort to shift your position every 15 mins or so.

expatinscotland · 22/04/2008 11:00

I've had 3 epidurals and they ALWAYS work. Why? Because if you still have feeling you tell the anaesthetist and they fix it.

As for long-term back problems, I think it's nonsense.

I have a crocke spine, my pelvis is uneven.

Again, 3 epis, no problems.

PollyParanoia · 22/04/2008 11:11

There's an oft-quoted truism that epidurals lead to longer labours, greater medical intervention etc.
But isn't this a bit chicken-and-egg? If your baby is in a difficult position or you're older or any of the other reasons why your labour might be particularly painful, then you are more likely to ask for an epidural and your birth would have more likely needed greater intervention whether you'd had an epidural or not?
How is it possible to know what causes the complications: the epidural or whatever led to the epidural in the first place?

Anna8888 · 22/04/2008 11:20

PollyParanoia - I don't think so - it's a very highly researched area.