Epidural-still can't decide-36 wks pgnt

[laughaminute]

Hi please help me to make an informed decission, have had 2 children and both labours left me 'stuck' for want of a better word @ 9cm dilated and trying not to push for 4 hours with BOTH children, after much discussion it appears that they will not prioritise 'pain' over problematic labours in a hospital,hence my long waits both times for a registrar to tend to my needs-(And this I agree with) hence I was left in a ridiculous amount of pain both times.(Second time far worse too).both times I tried the no pain relief version for as long as I possibly could but second time I simply had to have epidural (9lb 2oz baby back to back-ouch').I have been told it is likely to happen again dure to cervix shape-this really scares me and I am thinking about it daily.Despite all of this I was intending to try for a natural birth right throughout this pregnancy,however, time is rapidly approaching and I am wondering if to simply request epidural on arrival to save all this worry.My reason for not wanting to do this was i felt it was chikens way out and also may slow down my labour thus leading to possible c-section but now I think I am so scared that I ought to have epidural in my birth plan right from point of arrival at delivery suite-opinions please????I won't act on any Mumsnet advice however am interrested in peoples experiences of either situation????Thanks

i don't blame you expat. Didn't realise you were pg. Congratulations!

4 words - nectar of the gods! If you decide when you go into labour you want one, go for it! I had so many comments along the lines of 'So I expect next time you'd like to really experience labour and try without help'... errrr no thanks, I'll be ringing ahead and asking them to get one out the fridge ready!!

BTW it didn't slow my labour at all, 10 hours from waters breaking to delivery and no side effects al all (except first few times walking to the loo was a challenge!)

I had a guaranteed epi from the off for dd2 and it was fab, contrasted with the traumatic non pain relief delivery of ds1.

Apart from the medical need to have a controlled delivery, I did not want to be ruled by pain, nor any of the post-traumatic stress/pnd I associated with the birth of my first. Also for entirely practical reasons I needed to be in good shape for looking after a nb and a lively toddler.

I think epidural is the way to go, but then I'm biased. A lot of mws have epidurals.

Epi delivery took 5hrs btw.

I had mobile epidural, in fact epidural was the only thing on my birth plan and I asked for it as soon as I got there.
Might have slowed things down, you just don't know do you? I did have a VERY long labour (19half hours 'established' ie recorded on notes) but it was pretty chilled out and spent most of it chatting away and sleeping so no biggie.

There were a few complications and she ended up being born with ventouse and a full epidural (nearly c section) but she happy and healthy (10 out of 10 on the Agpar thingys).

The mobile epi was fab because I could feel all the contractions but they didn't hurt - so I still felt connected iykwim. The full epidural was a bit weirder because legs were numb and that but I will def ask for (mobile if poss) epidural next time. G&A - I hate being drunk so think I wouldn't get on with it tbh. I think I was lucky too in that my epidural worked exactly as should.

I think you should go with your instinct and if you really want an epidural, then have it. agree with the person who said there isn't a prize.

because of the absolutely horrible provision of 'maternity services' in this trust, going abroad is looking more and more like a good option.

i'm seriously afraid i'll lose my life or the child's if i try to give birth in this area.

they've proven themselves beyond inept in so many ways there's no way i'd feel relaxed and trusting of any of them.

I had both mine with no pain relief, hurt like crazy and am scared of labout again, though they were not slow and now tearing etc (5 hours and 4 hours)

I remember my midwife saying "if you are induced, have an epidural straight away"

God knows what I'd do next time

totally agree expat about different strokes for different folks.

I had a bad experience with my epidural labour, and a wonderful one without, so I am biased in that way.
I do feel that the epidural directly led to my labour being longer, and the ventouse delivery, which in turn led to BIG problems breastfeeding.

so there are negatives. I have no idea what statistics are like with regard to epidurals leading to more intervention and particularly with probs breastfeeding, so don't know if I am in a minority.

but it did make me adamant I wasn't going to have it again.
if I had had a good experience first time I'd most probably have done it again.

I think FWIW it's entirely your decision. Personally my labours were too quick to merit epidurals, but I was BEGGING for it in my first labour.

Could you put something on the birthplan like "please ask quickly about epidural" that leaves a door open for you to try without if you feel strong enough, but makes sure that if you don't, they're getting ready to give it to you ASAP.

Go to Ninewells in Dundee Expat. They were so good at giving me pain relief with both of them.

I had epidurals with both of mine, and they were both good experiences.

I am just one of those people who prefers not to be in pain if possible.

I had an epidural in my birth plan for the start. I was induced at 37 weeks and started on gas and air, then took pethedine (cos my anaesthetist was held up) - but next time I will try to avoid the peth as it messed my head up - and I eventually got my epidural. It worked a treat. I had experienced enough pain through being induced, and did not want to 'experience' natural birth. Although numb, I did feel my DS being delivered (with vacuum). If you go for an epidural, my advice to you would be to practise identifying your push muscles - eg when having a poo think about the muscles you're using and remember how you do it!! I did this and although numb I could visualise what I was meant to be doing. It worked a treat! I'll be definately asking for it again.

What ever you choose, I hope it all goes well for you. x

I hated having an epidural and felt that it caused a lot of problems and unnecessary interventions for me in my labour. However, if you feel that you will find it hard to cope with the pain, I would put it in your birth plan so that you don't have to worry about making the decision while you are in labour.

I have had 4 children. My last two labours sound very like yours. OP positions, stuck at 8cm. With my third I had to beg for an epidural because they all thought birth would be quick. Eventually I got my way and DS was born 3hrs later. I had a traumatic time in that labour and needed de-briefing when pregnant again, cos I was dreading my next labour.
My birth plan for number 4 was very specific about pain relief. I found that it wasn't the contractions that stopped me coping it was the immense pressure from the head which I could feel front and back (hats off to you laughaminute for coping so long). I again had an epidural at 8cm and it restored my control, leading to a lovely relaxed birth.

Go for the epidural. You have nothing to lose.

Again and again, I am stuck by how clueless people are about epidural on this board and elsewhere in the UK.

In some countries, it's your right to be given pain relief as soon as possible (not 4 hours or 11 hours later).

Maternity care in the UK is worse than in most of the Western world. You get a lot of propaganda about "cascade of interventions" and very little information about the benefits of epidurals. The "natural birth" industry and many midwives promote this way of thinking I think the NHS does, too, for different reasons. A lot of my friends in the US have given birth with epidurals no c-section, no instrumental delivery.

If you have a walking epidural, you can move around.

In my experience, the epidural did not slow down my labor -- quite the opposite. It sped things up because I was able to relax and feel in control and I pushed the baby out fairly quickly on my own. I was able to choose the birthing position (partial squatting).

I wouldnt think twice about going for an epidural personally. You may be at an increased risk of intervention but this needs to be weighed against your experience at the time and during your previous births.

BTW I had an epidural with no intervention and only 40 minutes of pushing.

Loved the epidural I had with my second DS as did my dh as I was still able to cvommunicate rather than being spaced out on pethidine. However, we were lucky in that as we are both medics and knew the anaesthetists, I got the epidural with very little wait. The medical evidence is that they do prolong labour and do increase your risk of caesarian section but even knoeing that I would still have it again.

only read op, and giving you my gut reaction, waht I would do if i were you. background; had 3 nodrug water births, but had a completely open mind about pain going into first, and had no time anyway for drugs on subsequent occasions. (by the time i asked for them in first one, it was too late) and anyway, my births were a piece of piss, unlike the majority it would seem.

if i were in your place i think i would request an epi on arrival. i would ask now if they do the 'mobile epidurals' where you can still walk about, and i would take in a birth ball, pool, etc and do all i could to progress labour naturally to avoid intervention if poss.

whatever happens, good luck with it, and the thing to remember is that a successful birth is one in which you both come out well and alive. you do your best and that is all you can do. back to back is bloody sore... you are not required to martyr yourself - what purpose would you being in lots of pain serve? what purpose you being traumatised? be good and kind to yourself, and know that doing so is also being kind to your baby and other loved ones.

anagram, wtf are you talking about? natural birth industry? i had natural births, and i enjoyed them. the point about birth is that we should all have access to whatever suits our individual needs. i was quite ready to bring on the drugs if need be... but the need never arose. what the hell is wrong with that??

You need to do what feels right for you.. and you don't have to decide till you are in labour.

I asked for an epidural on arrival at hospital (I was 8cm) - the pain was vile but bearable, like you I was worried about how much worse it would get and how long it would go on for, I had been told I was expecting a big baby! Not sure if it was the epidural's fault or my baby's huge head but after getting to 8cm in 4 hours, it did take another 4 hours for me to dilate fully and for baby to descend far enough for me to push. However, it was a relatively pain free 4 hours, spent reading Hello magazine and nagging DP to stay awake. Then another 1 1/2 hours of pushing and a ventouse to get him out, he was a big bugger. I had a "top it up yourself" epidural (I'm sure there is a more technical term), I could press a button and it put a bit more epidural in every 15 mins which was fab, I let it wear off a bit ready for pushing so I could feel the contractions. Could also move around for the first few hours but then I overdid it and went a bit numb!
Would definately have epidural again

Natural birth industry. Yes, it exists. What I am talking about are people like my antenatal yoga teacher. She makes pronouncements along these lines: "birth is a totally natural process .. you can learn to just breathe the baby out... you have nothing to worry about... enjoy it."

And the doula who cost a lot of money and was completely useless when my first birth became a medical emergency (cord wrapped around the baby's neck, plummeting heart rate).

"Natural births" in times past meant that a lot of women died giving birth. A lot of babies did not survive.

As my antenatal osteopath said to me the other day, a lot of women are misled with rosy stories and then feel they failed if they don't have the kind of birth they wanted.

What I am talking about ... described perfectly in this NY Times article, and there was a piece along similar lines in the Guardian recently.

www.nytimes.com/2008/03/02/fashion/02doula.html?pagewanted=1&sq=natural%20birth& st=nyt&scp=1

i just dont think its particularly helpful to anyone to say 'oh fgs, we should all have epidurals at the first sight of anything happening'

about as useful as your yoga teacher saying 'oh you just breathe them out'

imo.

Why shouldn't someone go for an epidural right away if she wants to? You want that so-called natural experience? Fine with me. But don't belittle other people's needs, whether they are based on psychological or medical reasons.

Anagram - I'm sorry you had a bad experience with your doula but that doesn't mean they're all useless.

When I asked for one all my doula and the mws asked was "are you sure?" when I said yes they went off to find the anaethetist. And yes it did end in an emcs.

Also it's not true that "You have nothing to lose"

Yes an epidural can be very beneficial in a slow painful labour in allowing the body to relax and dilate faster and allowing you to get a rest especially when you've had days of painful pre-labour.

But even if you have a walking epidural (and not all hospitals offer them) you then have the problem that

1. at some point after enough topping up you can't walk anymore
2. you have to be monitored and this will

a. tie you to a bed b. mean you're more likely to get interventions because readings on it can cause alarms resulting in forceps or csecs

and that's before you get to pushing problems

hence the cascade of interventions.

That's great for your friends in the US. Do you know what the average csec rate is there btw? 40% and upwards.
There are plenty of people here who had epidurals and normal deliveries as well.

Are you sure you have rejected the "natural birth industry"? An antenatal osteopath doesn't sound completely removed from taht