Backpain since last delivery - wondering what to do this time. HELP!

[motherpeculiar]

I?m hoping someone can offer some advice. I am 18wks pg with 2nd child and getting increasing worried about the whole labour thing. The reason for this is that I have suffered horrendous backpain since the delivery of DD1, just over two years ago. I had no significant backache during the last pregnancy or before but something happened during the delivery that has caused major problems ever since. (to the extent that I have had periods of barely ebing able to walk ) My osteopath thinks it may be a prolapsed disc but I am waiting to see an orthopaedic consultant on Thursday to see what they think. For various reasons (too lengthy to go into here) I have never been offered any kind of diagnostic tests by the NHS (obviously didn?t complain loudly enough ? too busy looking after DD!) but I have had various physio/osteopath treatments over the two years.

During the last labour I was kind of stop-starting with contractions for a couple of days, I went into hospital where they were humming and hawing about whether to induce but I seemed to be getting started ok at that stage. I got to about 3cm (after about 8 hours of fairly serious contractions) and they decided to give me syntocinon, at which point I also had an epidural. After about another 8 hours I was ready to push. I?d had a mobile epidural so squatted on a birthstool for the 2nd stage. DD was out in about an hour which was great but at one point one of my legs went completely numb and all the pushing went through the other one (IYSWIM). This is the side of my back that I have had all the trouble with since so I do wonder whether it is linked.

Anyway (if you?ve made it this far ? congratulations) ? I am now wondering whether I should think about an elective section and if so how best to go about this. I just couldn?t bear it if this backpain were to get worse from another labour, but equally I am a bit suspicious that maybe it was the epidural that caused the subsequent pain (rather that the pushing bit) in which case it is epidurals I should be avoiding. In which case a section is probably not the best options.

I am really really confused. I don?t know what questions to ask in order to try to determine what I should be aiming for, and have found through my experience with the NHS (apologies to anyone who works in it ? I know it is because the system is under pressure, and I also know there are great people working in there) that information is normally disclosed as a result of asking exactly the right question, rather than being offered pro-actively.

Sorry this is so long, and confused. If anyone can offer any advice I would be extremely grateful.

yours hopefully,
MP

also read this thread and see if it rings any chords for you? other thread-aches and pains

sorry im a silly cow i linked to the same page, trying again now sore joints ect

Hi Sleepless

hope you are feeling a bit better after your hour of standing today. Not pleasant. Read the thread you pointed out - sounds horrible. Luckil I've only ever really had the pain in my back (and one buttock and leg ) never ankles, wrists etc. Although I do remember at one stage wondering if it was rheumatoid arthritis. Horrible to think so many of us, for whatever reason, are feeling so incapacitated after childbirth - I never imagined it beforehand. I could really empathise with the people saying they felt like old old women.

Anyway - I am booked in at Kings College Hospital in CAmberwell, I must find out what the birthing unit there is like as I've started to think that if I am going to try this naturally maybe I should stay at home (as far from epidurals as possible as I'm sure I'll be gagging for one ). Your idea of getting an independant midwife had just occurred to me too. I must look into it as I think it's a really good idea. I'm not too optimistic about having any kind of continuity or consistency in midwives through the NHS, Kings being a teeming London hospital and all. So I will look into independant midwife options. Thanks.

No you never sent Katherine's number. I think the nappies got you first .

Hope you are getting on OK with two, you sound like you are managing fine since you are able to get on here and dispense advice to the likes of me . WHat's the gap between yours?

I'm going to print out this thread and as teh time for delivery approaches look back over your story to give myself some confidence

gotta run. DD just emerged from bedroom where she was supposed to be sleeping

Sorry to hear that your consult didn't go so well but GREAT news that the osteopath has helped some of the pain. Even though they say they have just alleviated the pain, sciatica can be cured to a large extent if whatever is putting pressure on the nerve is taken away. The disc (usual cause) can be weakened and therefore it can reoccur but often surgery isn't indicated.
I know often the unknown is difficult to deal with but if an MRI had shown up a disc bulge the only options you would have is noninvasive treatment (ie. physio, osteo) or surgery which sometimes isn't that successful either.
Good luck!!!!

Thanks Chuffed. Yes it is great news that the pain has been relieved recently and thanks for pointing out what the only possible outcomes of an MRI would have been. You are right - it is fear of the unknown (and crap attitudes by male (in this case) consultants - why didn't they tell me what you have just done for example) that upset me.

Much calmer now and trying to be positive (lots easier when the pain isn't grating with every step )

Hi mo im sorry i catted motherinferior instead of motherpeculiar i will cat you her number now.

In the case of the independant midwife (sounds like a sherlock homes story ) i know the amazing midwife i had (verona) works privately i know she is registered and very experienced i think she lives in south london and i recall her saying she had delivered something like 400 babies yet she was fairly young (mid to late 30's at a guess) anyhow i would really recommend meeting up with her if its a route you may consider, without a doubt shes the lady that got me through without epi or any tears at all. I loved her so much i nearly called my baby Verona after her

My ds1 is 4.5 and ds2 very nearly 3 months old, wow the times just flies. So a fairly big gap which has great advantages IMO.

What will your gap be?

Sleepless - I can't believe it - after you'd raised the idea of independant midwives I went onto the IMA website and looked for midwives down my way - there were a couple and of them all I thought Verona sounded fab. WHat a coincidence. So happy to hear how well you got on with her. I think that the continuity of care and having faith in the midwife must really help in situations like ours, where we have sort of "lost faith" in the system (speaking for muself anyway). The only issuie for me now really is the expense - it is a lot more expensive than I'd thought however, I've probably spent that amount on osteos, chiropractors etc over the past couple of years!! I think I might give her a ring and have a chat at least...

Out of interest - did you have your baby at home or in hospital? I've been thinking lately that home might be best as it would create distance between me and the dreaded epi (Which I bet I'll be screaming for )

The gap between yours sounds perfect. Our gap will be just under 3 years. I was planning on a longer gap but fell pg first month of "sort-of" trying. Not complaining mind. I think DD sould be sensible enough to cope with it all, and actualy enjoy it by then (fingers crossed).

Thanks again for all the info - you are a veritable mine...

MP

MP, speak to verona (and send her my love, please) I was fortunate enough to have both my babes in hospital, not sure that i would have the courage to go for a home birth but then again i live about 3 minutes from the worst hospital in London (highest mrsa rating in!!!) so i really wanted to try to ensure that i didnt end up there. Anyhow, i have friends (2) that have had (unplanned) home births (yup didnt get there in time!!!) But both speak quite amazingly about the experience and im not sure ive heard many (if any) who have had bad home birth experiences!!! And also i would just say that if the only thing worrying you about a hospital birth is the epi, then i would have thought that a) if you have a birth plan and it specifies that you really dont want one unless you say beg 3 times within 1 hour for it (if you think that time is your personal limit) then that will give you some protection, b) if your partner knows exactly what your wishes are and c) your own strength will command you through as much as you are able to cope with (hopefully the whole way for you but for me (and its easy for me to say with my last experience) you dont have to put yourself in any postition just be really straight and strong with all your health care providers about what you want.

If it helps (i hope it does) by the time i really wanted the epi- i.e didnt think i could go on, do it etc etc, i also already knew it was too late and i was almost there and it wouldnt really help me anyway so that thought just gave me an extra kick and lift to keep going.

got your CAT sleepless - thanks again

will call Verona I think for a chat at least (I'll pass on your good wishes). I have an antenatal appointment at the hospital tomorrow so I might check out whether they have any community mid-wife groups where I could hope for a bit more continuity either, if we decide we can't afford the independant route.

I better get on with that birth plan then

I read this thread with great interest. I have had back pain for years worsened during my last prenancy and then I suffered a prolapsed disc in Sept 2003. I am now 30 weeks pregnant. I too am dreading labour as the pain in my back is increasing daily and I don't know how I am going to push.
I was shocked to hear how you were treated by the consultants at Kings. In case it is of interest to you I did have an MRI scan which showed one prolapsed disc and one bulging. I was told by the consultant that I had three options, 1. Physio, 2. An epidural (apparently it offers a few weeks of pain relief which allows you to do various exercises and 3 . Surgery.

I opted for the Physio which was mainly leaarning a load of Pilates exercise and the MacKenzie (spelling?) technique. I improved enough to return to work but never have been painfree. Incidentially I was told not to get pregnant again untill I was completely painfree. I reasoned this would never be the case and took a risk. Like you I had spent a lot of money on Chiropractors and Osteopaths but it was the physio which gave me the most sustained improvement.

As far as I know you can't have an MRI scan while pregnant.

My doc told me today that Tens is safe for me to use as pain relief so I will try this. I think I may try an osteopath again so grateful if anyone can recommend one in the SW16 area.

Hi eaney, my osteopath consults in Egham sometimes, is that anywhere near you? If so i will cat you her number? Im fairly sure she did alot to keep me mobile throughout my pregnancy and after and probably ensured that i was able to push, plus she is a woman and mother so i think has alot more inate understanding of the female anatomy etc, good luck!!!

Hi Eaney

sorry to hear about your back problems. I can well understand your growing nervousness about the next labour. HAve you spoken to the obstetricians about options in labour to minimise risk to your back at all? I saw another consultant at Kings yesterday (to go over what the orthopaedic guy had said) and he said they would review things later in the pregnancy, I seem to recall he mentioned something in the 30+ wk bracket as the best point to review. Would the idea of a caesarian be completely off-limits for you?

I wish you could see my osteo, I swear he is the only person in 2.5years who has been able to help at all, my back feels really good now, touch wood. However, I do seem to recall a previous osteo saying that the one time it might be possible to sort things out was if I was pg again as the ligaments etc would be stretched and more malleable. I'm seeing the osteo next week and I'll ask if he has any recommendations over your way.

I'll be very interested to hear how you get on with labour, and will have my fingers crossed it all goes ok.

Hi Sleeplessmumof2 and motherpecular

Egham is probably too far away but thanks for the suggestion. This is the first time I have used the talk section on the site so not sure what you meant when you said you would 'cat' me the osteo's number. I will have to read the sites instructions (I'm afraid i'm one of those people who never reads instructions).

I am due to give birth in Kings too so I was very interested to hear that there may be more options for me during labour. I think I will ask to see an obstetrician. Glad to hear an osteo has helped you - gives me hope. Thanks again.

Hi Eaney

my knowledge of London postcodes is sometimes a bit lacking. If SW16 is Streatham -ish then maybe you would consider going to see my osteo - he's in East Dulwich.

Let me know and if so I'll send you his details.

BTW CAT stands for Contact Another Talker and it's when mumsnet sends an email directly from one member to another without it having to go through a message board. There is an option somewhere to do it.

BTW the obstetricians at Kings seem very nice. Ask your midwife to set up an appointment and I'm sure they'll be interested in talking about how to help in labour. I did have to be a bit insistent with the m/w but the obstetricians have been taking it very seriously.

Good luck