Advice on finding a child psychologist privately - can a 6 year old be depressed?

[RedTurtle]

Please can someone advise me on the best way to find a child psychologist or counsellor privately. We live in the South West and when I've looked on the Internet I can't seem to find what I'm looking for. I'd like someone really experienced with children - my DS is 6.

He has angry outbursts at times (sometimes up to 3 weeks without any, sometimes having them every day for up to two weeks, it really varies) which have been getting worse for the last 6 months, during which he shouts that he wants to kill himself, that he hates us, doesn't want to be in this family, wants to throw himself off a cliff, that he doesn't want to be in this world any longer. He also hits and kicks me and DH and smashes things. He told me last night that he had been trying to strangle himself in his bedroom but it didn't work because he didn't die.

When he has calmed down, he is so tearful and upset. This is worse to watch because he keeps saying he is sorry, that he is a bad boy, that he shouldn't have hit me and that he doesn't deserve to be in the family. We really try to calm him and reassure him that we love him (whilst stressing that hitting and smashing is not okay and that we need to find other ways for him to keep calm).

The angry tantrums only happen in front of me, my husband and grandparents. My DS behaves brilliantly at school. He is high achieving academically, has never been in trouble (he takes the school rules extremely seriously) and has lots of friends. His teachers comment on how well behaved he is. I've thought about trying to access help through the school but because his behaviour is so good at school, I'm not sure if I can ask them for help?

My DS has always been advanced verbally and has been able to have quite adult conversations about complex subjects from an early age. I'm not sure if I've explained that well but it's something other people used to comment on, especially the type of words he used. He asks a lot of questions about death. For example: when he was about 4 he commented that it would be helpful if we knew the dates when were all going to die (within the family) then we could sit with a calculator and work out how many days and nights we have left together. My DH finds these type of conversations unsettling but I think it's just the way DS is. He has a phenomenal memory and loves facts and information especially about nature. He gets obsessed with certain subjects.

There have been several times when it's crossed my mind that he may have aspergers syndrome - but then he copes so well socially that it seems unlikely. He also plays team sports which he loves and he is able to work as part of a team.

As well as the anger, he has been having trouble going to bed at night as he has been having nightmares and he worries about murderers, wars, fires, and many other things. We now make sure he doesn't watch the news because he picks up on so many things. When they learned about the 2nd World War at school he became terrified we were going to be bombed at night.

There have been days recently when he comes home telling me that he has been really sad and doesn't know why. He says he has a sad tummy and has a feeling a bit like a headache (which doesn't hurt) that comes and goes and makes him sad.

This morning he woke up in one of his vile moods. He attacked my DH because my DH told him we have taken his computer away to have a break from it (his behaviour is noticeably worse after playing computer games) and was then crying and hitting himself on the head and shouting "what's wrong with me?".

It breaks my heart to see him like this and I need to get him the right help as soon as possible so any advice would be appreciated. If anyone is still reading, thank you so much, I didn't mean this to be so long.

Actually, I told her everything he's said when he's been angry/upset but I didn't tell he those specific words. I said that he's talked about wanting to die and wanting to kill himself - but only when he's in the middle of ones of his rages. I didn't omit the strangling story deliberately, I was just trying to get everything out. To be honest, she didn't seem shocked or especially interested in that and the way she was nodding made me feel that maybe it wasn't as big a deal as I thought (that may sound strange but it is the feeling I got from her).

She seemed more interested in asking what sports DS plays and talking about rugby season. She is an older GP and has a bit of a vacant air about her so I couldn't really tell what her reaction was. I was so relieved that she referred him that I didn't think about adding anything else.

Should I have pushed that? When those words come into my head, I tell myself "he felt that way in that particular moment because he was so frustrated but that doesn't mean he is actually suicidal". DS is very extreme in many things he says, as in "this is THE WORST DAY of my life" when something relatively minor thwarts him. I am hoping that the talk of death is just an expression of that. Do you think I'm doing the wrong thing by downplaying it?

Hi I cant write properly now as have baby dd - but my son is very similar - we have a fantastic private psych in Wimpole st W1 -
His name is Paul Bain - it took him a single two hour consult to unravel 9 years of confusion
Will pop back on in am - or contact me at [email protected] to chat more
X

Well, I'm coming from the perspective of being a CAMHS practitioner, which I am. We would expect any child who has attempted to strangle themselves and who talks about wanting to die to be referred to us so that we can carry out a full risk assessment. GPs are generally aware of this and would probably make a referral to CAMHS if they knew about a self harm act of that kind.

If you believe that your child tried to strangle himself I don't understand why you are not taking this aspect seriously.

I'd go back to the GP again and disclose fully about the strangling event and what your DS says about wanting to die and ask for a CAMHS referral, which can take place along side the referral to Paeds. CAMHS need to assess the risk, even if it's to rule out any risk.

I wish I felt hopeful that a CAMHS referral would offer more than a 'full risk assessment' - that it would offer ongoing family support stratgies and advice. Would it?

Yes it could well do. A risk assessment is only a part of what CAMHS can offer. But a risk assessment is necessary IMO.

Selks - just to update - DS has been referred to CAHMS anyway, apparently because of his age and because CAHMS have set up a new autism team in our area (although I'm assuming they will consider everything not just autism).

I am more & more convinced the problem is coming from school and I don't think it's social. Near the end of half-term we had a few days with no outbursts. We'd spent a lot of time cuddling, watching DVD's & having 'quiet time' at home. He has told me that he feels 'puzzled' when he's in the classroom at school and sometimes sad but he doesn't know why. He was fine for the first two days back at school & then he started exploding after school - once in the playground and once around the corner from school. I said before that he'd always been strong academically but as it happens we've actually just had a report & for the first time he's 'below average' in a few areas and although the report is good overall, it's mentioned a few times that he isn't listening properly.

He's been on the sad face twice in the last few weeks for not listening and was very upset when I picked him up (he'd never been on the sad face at ll until this academic year and now he's been on it 3 times). His reading teacher told me (when I asked) that he is always looking down & fiddling with his shoes or jumper when is supposed to be listening & that she has to remind him every 5 minutes - he is fine when actually doing reading and writing activity though, it's just when she is at the front talking. I asked DS and he insists that he IS listening but the teacher thinks he's not because he isn't looking at her.

I'm considering having a proper chat with the school - I don't know if it will do any good as they don't have any concerns about him.

I'm phoning the CAHMS team everyday to find out when he'll be seen (if it's too far away we're going to travel and have him seen privately). Someone is supposed to be calling me back on Monday. I will explain to that person what DS said about strangling himself. He hasn't mentioned anything like that since but I know he is very anxious - he wet the bed last night for the first time since he came out of nappies. I am sure this isn't a coincidence and it's a sign that he is struggling emotionally at the moment.

Thanks for the update. Yes do mention to CAMHS about the strangling - it's important that they know. Sorry to keep banging on about it! He does sound very anxious at the moment as you say. It's important to let CAMHS know everything like this that is happening currently including bedwetting etc.

A good discussion with school is a very good idea; they need to be able to understand your son, not misunderstand him such as the eye contact thing. He needs to feel that the school is supporting him not being critical or he will feel more anxious there. Ask the school to detail how exactly they are supporting him and meeting his needs. Is he on school action plus or does he have an Individual Education Plan? (Info on IEP here.
You may have to push the school for him to get the support he needs. You can request involvement from an Education Psychologist, in fact I would recommend that if you feel that he is struggling in school and there is no clear plan in place and he has not seen one before.

Anyway, I hope you get the support that he needs soon. Best wishes.

Hi RedTurtle,

I came across your post and saw many similarities with the behaviour shown by my daughter - the nightmares, 'loose' talk about death, good behaviour at school but unleashed behaviour at home, deep searching questions, quoting from films, etc. I know how hard it is and hope your son is happier now.

I wondered whether you managed to get a diagnosis, and which advisors you found most useful?

I realise this post if old but I hope you will still receive my response. It's just a point of view but I would say that your child is extremely gifted. What he needs is spiritual support,to understand that there is light in this world. I would not go to your GP but I would work with him and get on a quest to meet spiritual beings who are of service to humanity. Also get him to work with his breath, perhaps trying a week-end workshop with the Art of Living or some similar organisation. Why not getting him involved in some activity directed at helping others in need? His anguish is of a spiritual nature. I really hope you have made head ways since you posted. As a parent it must be so incredibly difficult but do not give up. Also I wonder how he really feels at school. If he is of the nature you describe, perhaps he is bored at school? And the fact that he is a model of good behaviour there means that he puts up a front. I'm not sure that other children his age can relate to him and what he goes through. It must be lonely for him. If say he was intellectually gifted, wouldn't some other form of education be better for him? Just ideas and thoughts to explore. I wish you all the best.

Hi red Turtle, I realise this is an old post. Whilst trying to look for information I came across your post. It is very similar to my 7 year old almost everything you say. I wondered what help you go in the end? As I am not sure where to start? many thanks.

i have experienced very similar in my child. he has high pyrrole. google 'pyrrole disorder' or pyroluria and see if it resonates. let me know if you want more info. Best wishes

Following

Dear Red Turtle,

Can I ask if things have improved at all with your son? Many of the things you have written in the above thread are very familiar to me and the behaviour we see in our eldest son who has just turned 5. It is incredibly challenging and both my husband and I are continually torn between a want to support and protect him and letting him know that some of his behaviour is totally unacceptable. I worry every day that I am damaging him when I eventually get cross and shout or take away a toy. He is INCREDIBLY sensitive and can be overwhelmingly emotional and/or angry. Since approx 2 years old he has been extremely challenging when it comes to getting dressed as he will only wear certain things. Since approx the same age he has not touched a fruit or a vegetable. He used to hit himself but has stopped now. He has a beautiful heart and is the kindest, sweetest, generous little man when he feels safe - for example, he has given away his presents to his brother on his birthday every year since he was 3 as he doesn't like to see his brother upset. He has a gorgeous friendship with a little girl at school who seems to bring out the best in him, they talk and listen to each other. On the flip side he can be unbelivably rude and violent. His tantrums are totally inpenetrable and he is so loud and intense at times I feel unable to deal with it. He can get out of bed up to 6 times a night and gets extremely cross about being taken back. He has started school now and I am told he is behaving like a dream there, he loves it and can't wait to go every morning. Friends don't believe us when we say how challenging he can be and family who have stayed with us very clearly think we don't discipline him enough. Play dates can be an unmitigated nightmare. I am so exhausted by it all and would hugely appreciate any help or advice people may be able to offer. We live in West London. Thanks in advance.