Advice to my 10 yo son from my ex-husband

[Nicknamegoeshere]

My ex-husband told my son over the phone tonight that if someone pushes him or hits him, he should push or hit back in "self-defence."

I'm personally quite horrified at this advice. Son says he knows it's wrong.

Advice please!

Example which I've written about in here before.

When my son was 11yo a child kept pinning him up against the wall by his neck. He wouldn't get off. Ds reported it over and over and school kept saying he was misreading th situation due to being autistic (ds iq is top 5% so he's not daft!)

One day the kid was doing it so hard dd was struggling to breathe and so ds stamped in his foot. Ds was internally excluded for violence

The big was into a winner here and so escalated. Every time ds was forced to kick him or hit him to get him off so he could breathe he'd be punished.

Now the bully had power beyond even his ability to control.

The next move was him pulling a knife on ds in class. The phone call every mum never wants to receive. Da tried to hand himself as he truly believe he had no right to defend himself against violence and would rather kill himself than allow someone else to do it.

Police interview I mentioned when he spoke to school they'd mention past incidents with this lad and I was honest about what ds had done to him previously and why.

Let's just say - the police had a few things to say about school and were fuming and even better referred ds to a specialist victim support group.

This is where I learnt about self defence Vs revenge assault.

Self defence is fine.

It’s not ok to hit first but if you’re hit, hit back and hard enough so that they know not to do it again.

It stops the bullies, especially boys.

Dd12 and me have had a conversation about this a year or two back as she has a few kids in her year group who pick on some other children in the year sadly sometimes violence, thankfully not DD but we discussed different scenarios, and we ended it with if she ever finds herself being physically hurt by someone to tell a teacher or the appropriate adult then do so, if she can get away do so, if it continues after telling adults and walking away then that would be my place to speak to the adults involved but if she is ever in a situation where she can’t get away and no adult to tell (or adult not dealing with it after telling them and kid continues it) then absolutely defend yourself.

OP, so what would your advice be.
surely we have to tell children not to be cowed, otherwise they will be a target for bullies.

we were taught in self defence,
it's better to be judged by 12,
than carried by 6.

Self-defence is very different to hitting though? As I said, I spent a year working with extremely violent children. I was taught to defend myself of course. But would never hit them back!

You’re entitled to hit back if someone hits you.

Your son isn’t in an equivalent position to you as a teacher when a child hits him.

I regret doing it the “right” way and going back and back to the school when my son was being bullied. It was a waste of time.

When they were physically stood up to the bullying stopped instantly.

I let my son down.

I think it is good advice, never hit first but defend yourself and that can include hitting back aggressively to stop it. I have seen too many videos taken by teenage kids watching and doing nothing about it of of a bully pushing and hitting a child and escalating it until they respond and protect themselves (friends child was in the video)

And despite viewing the video...the fuckwit teachers decided to sanction both kids because "all violence is wrong". My friend was furious. I helped her write to the school and point out the provisions of the following:

Section 3 (1) of the Criminal Law Act 1967 states: "A person may use such force as is reasonable in the circumstances in the prevention of crime, or in effecting or assisting in the lawful arrest of offenders or suspected offenders or of persons unlawfully at large." .

This enshrines the right to self-defence. What it doesn't allow is self defence to continue indefinitely. Ie if the victim punches the assailant to the ground, if they then continue to stamp on their head, then self defence would fail at this point.

Despite this, said fuckwit teacher wouldn't back down (cited their union advice - what the fuck it's got to do with the union?) so I helped her complain to the governors who had to advise the Head Teacher that they could not over ride the inalienable rights of an individual (even a child) to protect themselves.

When this became well known with parents other examples came about of teachers making up rules based on politically correct beliefs that defy the law!

We have a 14 year old boy and we always told him to stand firm. Sometimes the schools don't do anything even when a report is made. Ours never got in a fight in primary but so far twice in secondary. He is a black belt in karate and he stands his ground. Never punches first he isn't aggressive but if they come for him he is very confident.
I think confidence makes other children stay away. It depends on the circumstances but if your son has been bullied I may give him the same advice.

@Nicknamegoeshere

Self-defence is very different to hitting though? As I said, I spent a year working with extremely violent children. I was taught to defend myself of course. But would never hit them back!

but that's a false comparison. you were working, so must have been an adult, and in a position of authority, vis-a-vis children you mention. if a colleague hit you at work what would you do. esp if they did it every time they see you, a jab in the corridor, or a grope; a swift slap is often effective, it says don't mess with me !

Great advice I was taught the same!

Why show weakness and let someone hit/push/kick you!

Nah - Do it back ten times harder !

[quote Nicknamegoeshere]@nimbuscloud But according to posters so far, his advice is reasonable?[/quote]
That’s because it is

I was brought up to not hit anyone. It did not help me at al. Because I didn’t retaliate I was an easy target. I was bullied at school,taunted, had handfuls off leaves including empty fag packets thrown all over me. It was never near an adult so I couldn’t ask for help. Back in those days adults wouldnt have believed me or done anything anyway.

I was about 13 when I decided that the advice I had been given to not hit back was wrong. I only had to hit one girl once and it all stopped. Wish I’d been told to hit back if someone hit me.

Nowadays I suppose the correct response would be to tell a teacher or parent about it because things are different nowadays and things get taken more seriously.

But if it happened again a second time I’d still say hit them back before they escalate.

And if anyone pulled a child up for hitting back because teachers/parents were aware of the problem from a previous incident and hadn’t protected said child then that would be on them for not doing more for the victim.

OK. I'll tell him to hit him back. Thx.