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Infant feeding

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Original poster

Editor's comment re: Jordan OK! article

105 replies

boogiewoogie · 09/08/2007 09:01

I don't know whether this has been mentioned already but I read this yesterday from the Times.

Melanie McDonagh

Sounds as if she feels guilty about not being a "successful" breastfeeder. I am pro choice and do not have a problem with formula feeders but it's the smug and sanctimonious tone of the article that annoys me as well as the sloppiness in accuracy re breastfeeding. Is the point of her article the reason why women formula feed is because they're selfish? An insult to many who do ff. Also misses the point about the Jordan OK! debate that's going on.

OP posts:
doggiesayswoof · 09/08/2007 10:36

Yes policywonk, agree about the class identifier thing.

purplemonkeydishwasher · 09/08/2007 10:39

"Justus von Liebig, the 19th-century German chemist who invented infant formula, should be a feminist pin-up, a towering figure in the liberation of women from the constraints of their own biology."

WTF??!!

why is going against our body's biology liberating?
that#s it, i'm going to stop mentruating. it's too confining. in fact, why should I have children? MEN should be giving birth! and they should carry the baby for half the time as well. fair's fair and all.

policywonk · 09/08/2007 10:42

Well, lots of people would say that contraception has been a pretty big factor in the liberation of women. I suppose it depends how you define 'liberation'. Some women want to get back to their careers as soon as possible, and there's no doubt that it's harder to keep up BFing when you're back at work.

(Just playing Devil's Avocado - should be working.)

Bink · 09/08/2007 10:46

Profoundly agree with Harpsi on the distasteful disingenuous self-presentation of brave taboo-busting head-above-parapet journalism - doesn't matter whether or not it's pandering to identifiable specific prejudices, it's still chiming in with the majority line.

It's the same slime that's at the root of all "I dare to be anti-PC" crap.

alycat · 09/08/2007 10:54

Very poor journalism from The Times, but she is only a guest rather than a regular.

TBH the bit I found most offensive - after the crass abortion comment - was the apparent sexualising of bf when she writes 'the baby tongue teases the nipple'.

Elasticwoman · 09/08/2007 11:22

I snorted at the bit where she claimed her 8 mo had "healthy bones". How does she know? Has she done a bone scan?

Otherwise, I had to admire her honesty in admitting she could not disagree that breast is best and she had chosen to give her children "good enough" rather than "best".

It made me examine my own attitude which is that formula was NOT good enough for my children. Bf was my top priority when they were babies. However, I was mostly ff myself and am now in vg health compared to many women of my age. I think I would have been healthier as a child if I'd had more breastmilk, but it's very hard to say whether my health would be any different now.

aloha · 09/08/2007 11:25

I think escaping our biology is hugely liberating! Contraception, antibiotics, the lot. Bloody marvellous.
But re this specific issue agree very much with Bink and alycat - esp on the issue of sexualising breastfeeding. Her faux naivety is designed specifically to annoy and provoke.

hunkermunker · 09/08/2007 11:39

Pruners, I've been thinking about this article a lot, since reading it last night.

I have decided that I'm not uncomfortable in any way with women talking about positive ffeeding experiences - I turned all that I've heard over in my mind and probed them well. Nope, don't have a problem with that at all.

What I do object to, and really rather vehemently, is that women who write articles like this and another recent Times one which referenced bf Nazis, iirc (there was a thread on here), in talking about having a positive ffeeding experience, they damage breastfeeding so much.

This article is littered with myths. Yes, she's entitled to her opinion, she can talk about how her experience has made her feel, but fgs, if she's happy with her decision to ffeed (and I don't want to fall into the trap of saying "oh, she sounds SO guilty" because I have no way of knowing whether she is or not), then talk about how good that is, but without running breastfeeding down.

Breastfeeding doesn't make your boobs sag (pregnancy does that).

It's perfectly possible to return to work and still breastfeed - I'm living proof of that.

Plus all the other stuff that's already been said on this thread.

I also object to a journo who has clearly done NO research and just spewed an article out of her own bile telling me I'm being patronising when I say that advertising has an effect on women's choice.

But it seems it's OK to slate women who bf and support bf - in the wider world. MN's a tiny, well-educated corner in that respect. One glance at the comments of any article re bf or ff and you'll see that.

IntergalacticWalrus · 09/08/2007 12:01

Oh how I laughed at the sentebce "formula feeding gives you your life back quicker"

How is spending hours strilising, washing, going to tyhe supermarket for tins of formula etc getting your life back???

LieselVentouse · 09/08/2007 12:10

there are some fair points in the "have your say" as well

IntergalacticWalrus · 09/08/2007 12:20

Oh and I had saggy norks before children

Kirst9 · 09/08/2007 13:37

Slightly off the point, but the phrase about FF being 'good enough' got me thinking: how many people who feed their babies something they recognise as being sub-optimal also trample over their neighbours in the stampede for the best school in the area. It says a great deal about how much (or little) we value food and nutrition that 'good enough' applies in this area but not in so many others. I

Just idle thoughts, really.

Kirst9 · 09/08/2007 13:39

Please ignore my extra 'I'. Idle typing also.

LucyJones · 09/08/2007 13:45

"IntergalacticWalrus on Thu 09-Aug-07 12:01:20
Oh how I laughed at the sentebce "formula feeding gives you your life back quicker"

How is spending hours strilising, washing, going to tyhe supermarket for tins of formula etc getting your life back??? "

because you can get dh/dp/Mil to do all that... lol ... while you paint the town red... or go back to work...

MadamePlatypus · 09/08/2007 14:06

I cannot understand why she thinks bottle feeding is less hassle. I was getting completely stressed packing up car to drive children 150 miles to see grandparents the other day. Having to pack bottles and formula and faff around sterilising them would have completely pushed me over the top. As it was I could pull into service station, take DD out of car seat and feed her without even opening a bag.

As for 'embarassing', whats that all about?

persephonesnape · 09/08/2007 14:15

the primary uses of Jordans breasts seem to be (1) gawped at by rather sad men and (2) squeezed by peter andre (3) inflated and deflated, then reflated by the medical profession. I'm not at all suprised that she elected not to be 'drunk' from. it desexualises her breasts into their (real) primary function - feeding her children.

the times journo woman is basically just a nasty woman.

oliveoil · 09/08/2007 14:22

I fail to see how she is a 'nasty woman'

her views of her stance on feeding her child

hunkermunker · 09/08/2007 14:24

She's pretty offensive, OO.

fedupwasherwoman · 09/08/2007 14:27

Kirst9

I'm afraid the logic of the point you are making cuts both ways. How many mums breastfeed with evangelical zeal but go on to allow their children to eat crap later ?

How many breastfeeding mumms plump for the local school as it puts them out too much to have to travel further afield to a better one ?

oliveoil · 09/08/2007 14:30

in your op HM

not in mine

and anyway, I don't do these threads anymore

hunkermunker · 09/08/2007 14:31

You really can't see why anyone would object to the things she says in her article?

Wow!

oliveoil · 09/08/2007 14:32

nope

hunkermunker · 09/08/2007 14:35

Not even Jordan? She's got a new baby boy according to the author...

And Belinda Phipps might be offended to be called Brenda?

Kirst9 · 09/08/2007 14:50

I'd be very surprised if large numbers of evangelical BFers turned a blind eye to their DCs' nutrition once they'd fastened up the nursing bra for the last time.

I guess all I was getting at was how unsurprising it is to see women writing in papers and magazines about how they've defied breastfeeding 'convention' but how unlikely it is that we will see the same journos congratulating themselves on defying educational wisdom and sending their DC to the adequate rather than the good school. I don't mean this to be judgmental at all - it's just interesting to see in which areas the mainstream media considers it acceptable to compromise.

fedupwasherwoman · 09/08/2007 15:04

Kirst9

I know 2 mums, one of whom was evangelical to the point of rudeness (tactless at the evry least) who now allow their kids to eat poor quality food on a regular basis.

Way before I had my first baby I visited a lovely friend to coo over her first baby and she talked about the benefits of bf whilst actually breastfeeding her first born and smoking a cigarette with her free hand.