is it common for midwives to suggest formula when in hospital?

[DuelingFanjo]

Just reading another thread and a couple of people have said they were advised to give a bottle as their baby was big/hungry etc.

I wouldn't be happy with this unless there was a medical reason for me not being able to breastfeed.

Is it likely to happen and do you just have to be really strong and refuse?

I felt rather pressured with my first child by the MW on the post natal ward, as my DD was screaming and screaming and wasn't feeding very well from me and it was the middle of the night. She offered to take the baby away and give it a bottle and in my state after my long labour, I was exhausted and felt intimidated and agreed. Looking back I should have said "no thank you" but at the time I was worried she was crying as she was hungry, I was disturbing the other mums and babies on the ward etc. It was a mistake.

Kellymom website is always good for information on breastfeeding and how to get off to a good start.

You'll be fine, just say no Can you ask at the hospital tour on their procedures and practices on BF to help ease your mind?

No one asked me if I wanted to give him some formula, they said to buzz every time I had to feed him if I needed help latching him on.

If they had asked me I would have refused. Stick to your guns :)

I was somewhat bulldozed into formula as DD1 was low birth weight and DD2 was early (both were around 5lb 8oz at birth). Despite good blood sugar readings after breastfeeding, I was read the riot act i.e. feed her formula or we'll take her away to special care baby unit and do it there for you. I am just getting ready to write the mother of all complaint letters about the paeds consultant pushing formula after DD2's birth. She had a naturally great latch and my milk came in about 2 days after birth, had buckets of colostrum and DD2 was happy and settled. I keep waking up in tears at night wishing I'd stood firmer for both of them - I so wanted them to have the 'virgin gut' and feel like I failed them on this score. DD1 ended up exclusively receiving expressed breastmilk for 14 months and DD2 has been exclusively breastfed for the last 6.5 months (and I want to keep going til she decides to stop), but I still feel very much like I could have done better in saying no to formula. With DD1 it was the midwives who pushed it (3oz of bloody Cow and Gate into a baby's stomach the size of a marble) and I firmly believe that this paved the way to her problems with reflux. With DD2 the midwives were really supportive but once the consultant had slapped a big notice on DD2's notes saying 'MUST supplement after 20 mins breastfeeding (do not allow longer as will tire baby) CALL ME if mother refuses' I didn't really have a leg to stand on with them. I complied for the first 12 or so hours and then began pouring the formula they kept bringing in down the sink when no-one was looking because i was not prepared for them to wreck my supply and make DD uncomfortable. Anyhow, was funny to hear them rave about how well she was doing on 'top up' feeds when she was in fact just receiving colostrum from about 24 hours after birth ...

Ugh, I should have put some paragraphs in there - sorry!

my milk came in late (due to c-section) and ds was starving, but luckily my hospital is big on bf, so they supported me in feeding him to get my milk to come in - it came in on day 4.

community midwife wanted us to top up as he lost more than 10% weight, i nodded and smiled but didn't as my milk had come in, he soon caught up!

if a midwife is pestering and won't take no for an answer ask to see a paed. when ds had lost weight we saw one for blood tests to check for dehydration, he was slightly dehydrated but paed said we didn't need to give formula or water, but would if it carried on, but the next day when tested again he was fine.

FrozenNorth, I am aghast on your behalf about your experience with those midwives and that consultant !

What utter twats as well for saying how well she was doing when you were pouring it away lol brilliant!

It's astounding that so many hospitals are still so rubbish at supporting mothers who want to bf. I begged for help with latching dd (she was jaundiced, sleepy and exhausted from a very long, intervention heavy labour resulting in em cs). All they ever said was 'you have until the next time I see you to get that baby bfing or you WILL give formula'.

I asked again, was told to choose which brand and if I didn't want to do it, the mw would ff dd.

The woman who changed the beds heard my sobs and intervened, helped me latch dd on and came back hourly to help me out. God bless that woman.

Def put something on your birth plan, they do read it.
I naively wrote 'i would like to breastfeed but will consider formula if necessary for the baby' on my birth plan with ds1 5 years ago. I think I copied it straight off s tempate somewhere as it sounded right.
Still in birthing room, not even back on ward, I asked me advice as baby was crying a lot and not latching on. Mw said 'feed him a bottle, he is hungry' I questioned it but mw said 'you said it yourself in your birth plan you will consider it of baby needs it, well your baby is hungry so don't you think he needs it?'
ds1 had bottles from then on!

My hospital experience was very positive. I was asked once if I wanted to breastfeed and formula was never again mentioned. My dd did not latch on for 3 days. I just kept walking round to the nurses station to ask for help no matter what time of day or night and I got help every time. However, I know of someone who recently gave birth in the same hospital and who was on the same ward and she was given no support to bf and formula was suggested immediately. It makes my blood boil hearing there stories. I know midwifes work so hard and there are not enough staff but to disregard a women's intentions in the way that they did in irene's case makes me mad! I would state clearly in your birth plan that you plan to exclusively bf and that you do not want your baby to be fed formula unless there is a medical reason for it. Also if you really want to breastfeed it might be a good idea to go to a bf group while pregnant to build up a good support network.

I ended up with my ds having formula in hospital, he was big and had an emcs. He was cup fed but I also gave him a top up when got home on day two out of a bottle. It never interferred with bf and he is now a very chubby ebf six month old. If your dc needs it and it can be medically justified by hospital (it was in my case, I refused for ages and he got more and more distressed) then don't beat yourself up about allowing a tiny bit formula.

ds1 born at chelsea & westminster 9 years ago - he was in NICU for a week and i had to physically restrain them from giving him formula.

ds2 born at whipps cross 2 years ago and i was pretty much ignored so nobody even asked if i was bf or ff.

dd also born at whipps cross, 6 months ago, and all through the night there were 3 other women in my ward who wanted to breast feed but were repeatedly told by the midwives to 'just give a top up bottle now and try the breastfeeding in the morning'. i'd have got up and helped them myself had i not still been immobile from spinal/cs.

gingerkirsty - did you have your baby at St. Michaels? I had a very similar experience (long labour/epidural/forceps) plus a very sleepy, jaundiced baby, and found them very helpful there! No one suggested formula at all - ds's first feed was expressed colostrum in a syringe given by DP as I was too whacked out to feed him, and in the following couple of days I had midwives/HCAs/student midwives/maternity assistants helping me with latching and feeding every couple of hours day and night. I've subsequently had no real difficulties at all (though it's only been two weeks!) despite DS having thrush and a tongue-tie. Good initial support really seems to make so much difference.

mmm. I had to ask them and tbh it was entirely my decision.
2 sides to this actually.
ds was a low birth weight and my milk had not kicked in and i could smell ketones on his breath...indicating a low blood sugar.
Terrified of him dying because small babies are unable to regulate their blood sugars very well, i asked for advice.
They (until then had left me to it) asked me would i like to try him with formula which i did but not from a bottle, from a medicine cup,
He downed 50mls straight off. I felt relieved, and reassured, and then he had another 50mls.
My milk kicked in shortly after, i knew it had as he had milk in his mouth and around his lips.I was SO rleived and breast fed him then till he was 7 months old, exclusively.
It didnt affect my feeding plans at all, i was adamant i would bf...but sometimes a wee bit of flexibility doesnt hurt.

DS had 1oz of formula because I couldn't get him to latch and was so tired and in pain after labour and emcs.

I hated seeing him have it and I swore from that second that not another drop would pass his lips, ever. And it hasn't.

I was in a private room and every time he yelled and I wanted to feed him I rang my buzzer until someone came to help me. They kept wanting me to put him back down but because of the CS I couldn't reach him without help so I hung onto him.

The advice I got that night was awful. One midwife gave me nipple shields, then after shift change the next one took them away. There was no consistency.

It is going to be so bloody different this time, I'm determined.
Having said that, I am still BFing him and he's 25 months so perhaps it all just served to make me stubborn about it.

DF (waves) I haven't had this experience myself. I gave birth to DS at the John Radcliffe, which doesn't have UNICEF status and can be rather patchy on bf support (despite having a renowned bf clinic there!) but nobody suggested this to me. DS also had urates (the little orangey crystals) in his nappy on day 2 and I was just advised to feed him as often as possible, if necessary waking him up if he slept for longer than 3 hours, but aiming for every 2 until it cleared up. It did, really fast. Not sure if it had anything to do with all the feeding though!

I posted on here a while ago about someone I met whose baby had jaundice, but not anything more than mild, and was told to give her day old baby formula, based on a blood test. This was at a UNICEF-certified MW-led unit that has a great reputation locally for promoting bf, so I have no idea what they were playing at.

Just put it on your birth plan, but that's not enough - in case you get someone who is badly informed or bloodyminded, say it loud and proud to the MW who is at your birth (while you can still speak coherently!) and make sure she's understood you.

I agree that you need to be flexible but its disheartening for women who WANT to breastfeed but need some support to be told to give a bottle and "try breastfeeding in the morning"!!! My dd had mild jaundice, I gave her colostrum via a syringe then cup until she latched on. She didn't feed until after day 3 and only dropped 7% of her original birth weight.

BTW, I had a minor wobble about gestational diabetes (baby has a huge tummy at 20 wk scan!) which we've now resolved (random blood glucose test was normal) but my very supportive MW said - well, we won't give them a chance to get formula into him unless a paediatrician says it's indicated, so if it turns out you do get diabetes, we will express colostrum before he's born, freeze it, and get it into him every chance we can, in between you feeding him.

I had an emcs and during the first night DD would not latch on or settle so after a night with no sleep and baby screaming the midwife suggested a top up bottle. I asked if this was the only option and she said I could express colstrum and syringe feed but it would be a waste of time. I therefore reluctantly gave her 1oz of formula.

However after the change of shift when I was still struggling with breastfeeding the day midwifes could not be more supportive and helped me to hand express and syringe feed DD then spent time with me during the day whenever DD needed feeding to help with latching on and check baby was feeding ok.

So in my experience it depends entirely on the midwife who happens to be on duty. I think if all the midwifes had been as dismissive as those on the night shift I would have thought that I just couldn't breastfeed and wouldn't have continued to EBF DD.

I think it's some of the stories on hear are terriable. When your trying to establish BF really they shouldn't offer bottles. Even if formula is medicaly indicated it should be syringe or cup fed as to give the best chance of getting baby latched on.

Luckly I didn't have any problems latching DD on in hospital so it was never even measioned. But I did hear other mum's being offered bottles on the ward.

I was in for 2 nights with DD2 and out of the 7 different women in my ward at one time or another all were either supplementing with formula or offered it. I wasn't offered, maybe cos DD2 seemed to take to BF straight away, so i didn't have to ask for help.

The woman opposite asked for help BF her 4-HOUR-OLD baby and seemed concerned she was crying, and the midwife immediately said maybe she didn't have enough milk yet and she should top up I ended up showing her how to latch baby on as noone was helping her. It's shameful, I can see why so many 1st time mums give up BF so soon with such a lack of support.

I had two amazing breastfeeding counsellors come and see me in hospital after DD1 was born as I struggled with BF (flat nipples needing falsies!).
I didn't know of the existence of feeding counsellors before I went in for elective CS, but someone mentioned it to me in passing.
I had to ask the midwives to bleep/contact them.

DD1 slept almost constantly for the first 36 hours, so I didn't feed her. I didn't know I should've been waking her.
No one offered any help either until I asked so be vocal if you need anything.

The midwives on duty wanted to give formula as DD1 was hungry and I was tired.
So we decided to use some and we would top her up using an oral syringe (as they had run out of cups) after BF with formula but she was still mostly BF (she vomited alot).

She was BF for 8 months after that almost exclusively.

We had some similar pushing of formula for dd (now 13 wks and ebf) both in the postnatal ward and from midwives and health visitors once we got her home because of slow weight gain and because in hospital no- one helped enough to get bf established properly. Next time I have a baby I will book an IBCLC to visit us in hospital. Once we had consulted ours I felt supported and confident with the bf but also, very importantly, able to say to anybody suggesting ff that we had a consultant who was recommending a different course of action (so f off). I can't emphasise enough how transformational this was. It cost £150 but was worth every penny. It definitely shouldn't be this way but for many women it seems that it is. :(

My baby had dangerously low blood sugar levels at birth and was immediately put on 3hourly formula feeds in addition to breastfeeding.By day 2 he was up on SCBU as his levels were not rising and by day 3 was on a glucose drip.
The hospital are very pro breastfeeding and if mums 'choose' to formula feed they have to take their own in.In SCBU I was shown how to hand express and after day 3 they gave me a pump and a sterilising kit,all without me asking.They were really fantastic,and although I did want to breastfeed I didn't have a problem with him having formula and being fed through a nasal tuba as I knew it was essential.

Formula was suggested to me twice.
I was VERY firm that I didn't want it on the basis that the baby would know what she was doing.

Both times it was because I was in the hospital for ages and the MWs decided my baby was jaundiced. They were, it is normal at 3 days old and is no reason to give formula. One MW tutted that "feeding for 10 minutes at a time is not enough" (wrong), another told me "your baby is crying because she is hungry" (wrong) and "she is so sucky because your milk should be in but it isn't" (wrong). Another was concerned that I didn't know how much colostrum my 24 hour old baby was getting so I should give a bottle "just in case".
None of the above are urgent reasons to give a bottle, IMO so refusing was not all that hard!