What is your preferred term for your ethnicity or racial background?

[Jamdown123]

I'm just wondering how people feel about:

People of Colour
Ethnic Minority
Black
Nubian
Coloured (surely a complete no-no, but let us see!)

And for people who have parents or grandparents that are not black?:
Mixed race
Mixed
Bi-racial (I don't really like this so much because it assume two races, when someone might be more)

I am black myself, and I like black, but am conscious it could exclude people who also identify as another ethnicity as well as Black. I have also just used 'African' though I'm Caribbean I consider my blackness to be African in roots. Not all of my Caribbean friends like that of course, because they aren't African Caribbean. I actually don't like 'people of colour' because it suggests, once again, that white isn't a colour as it doesn't really reference white people, when it most definitely is!

@Alonelonelylonersbadidea and @TeaAddict235 I'm following what you are telling us here. It disturbs me to read what you are saying. I'm struggling to put into words really without sounding overly dramatic.

Way back, I did a lot of research re Nazi Germany and their Race Laws and what happened to Black and Roma people.

So to read that the N word is used still unchallenged, and these attitudes are overt on a day to day basis unsettles me.

I haven't been to Germany in decades.

In the early 2000's I worked for a month in the Russian Urals. I was so glad to go home because of similar attitudes. We have a long way yet to go on this road.

I describe myself as mixed race.
Sometimes, to be more specific, Black mixed race (because of social constructions of race in the U.K.) or black-white mixed race. Very occasionally I will describe myself as brown.

I also use both names of the countries from which my parents come/my parents' nationalities (one being 'British').

I really dislike POC but do sometimes use it for ease but try not to, and never about myself or an individual. I cannot stand BAME but, again, sometimes use 'ethnic minorities' even though I don't like that either. Generally, if I'm trying to say not-white then I just say that or use other words such as 'racialised' or 'minoritised'.

I hear you @bhooks
People who are white, obviously never describe themselves as "non black"
Yet to refer to myself as "non white" is othering and diminishing.
So I say Black.

@Jamdown123 This is a wonderfully refreshing conversation that you've started. I appreciate your earnest and candid views and very much agree with you.

I'm with @Delectable too, though we are of different ethnicities/ethnic groups.

My identity and ethnicity is Igbo. Born, raised and steeped in the culture, history and heritage. My father, uncle and grandfather fought in the Biafran War (Nigerian Civil War). My maternal grandmother was part of the Women's War (Aba Women's Protest) - both a colonial and feminist revolution. That woman though! Strong and mighty till death - one of my heroes and her death hit me hard. Same with my paternal grandmother, whom I was with when she died. Both lost children to the war. Wonderful storytellers and thanks to them, as well as my parents, our Igbo history (So much more than the war though) has been passed on to our children. Not really something they teach in depth in Nigerian schools and definitely not something taught in Black history in the UK/US (That's fine, of course, because it's Black American/British history).

Anyway...secondly, I'm Nigerian.

Outside Nigeria:
My identity is African or Nigerian in general or if we've had a chat. Specifically, 'Igbo' if you get to know me.

'Black', if you don't know me and identify me based on what I look like or if I'm being general in forums, etc, but it's not my personal identity.

I'm an ethnic minority only outside Africa/Nigeria but I grew up as part of the ethnic majority in Nigeria.

Currently tending to my children but @notsonewandshiny I wanted to say Igbo Kwenu!

I identify in a very similar way to you although half my family are not Nigerian, the other half of me is Igbo through and through.😊

@Alonelonelylonersbadidea i noticed this attitude when I've visited Germany so oddly wasn't eager to work there. At one gathering a white guy, I think he was French, openly said their attitudes to race were backwards.

However I've worked in a couple of other European countries, including one that was a colony. People in those countries weren't confused by skin colour and nationality. They were however confused if your said you were from somewhere that didn't match your accent.

@UrgentExitRequired Ya!

As they say, Igbo bụ Igbo. It's in the blood.

@NotSoNewAndShiny and @UrgentExitRequired Igbo kwenu!

Ya! @Buggritbuggrit

There's a goady copycat thread started in AIBU. Just a heads up. Save your sanity and avoid. It's reported.

WildBactrian and NotSoNewAndShiny‘s posts have almost moved me to tears. They describe exactly why I find the nomenclature imposed upon the entire global majority incomprehensible.

@EchoNan it's an honour to read your posts. I hope to learn from you. Congratulations on 40years and many thanks for the compliments.

@Alonelonelylonersbadidea and @TeaAddict235 I have a friend who married a white German and another who married an African German. They've all moved back to Germany. My friend who's married to the White German says her daughter seems to come into her own when they are in places like New York but still doing well in Germany along with her brother. I wonder if certain cities are much more welcoming than others. I hope things get better.

@NotSoNewAndShiny I know what you mean about history being taught in Nigerian schools. For some reason my friends tend to be Igbo. I'm told I look Igbo. It was a close (Igbo) friend's English husband who first told me about certain Igbo/Biafran facts and then I watched a documentary about it. Shame I learnt more about Igbo history in London than I did in Lagos.

Interesting thread OP.
I am British born and bred of Ghanaian parents. If box ticking i am black African.
If having a discussion with anyone black or white - I am Ghanaian, if the discussion goes further then I will mention born in the UK.
When in Ghana - I am not referred to as black (it's not a description used) but amongst those who are not too close to me (because family know not to press my pissed off buttons ) I am called white, because of my accent and British mannerisms. I used to be annoyed much morE when I was younger - but with maturity I realised they don't mean to be offensive - they are not looking at the colour literally it is the language , accent, and expressions. Also in Ghana I am frequently and more likely to be asked where I am from - and as my tribe is maternal lineage they are asking for my mothers tribe and or village -

I was hoping we wouldn't entertain it on this thread as it will derail this very interesting subject.

Off the original OP but nobody of any background needs to apologise on the thread for "taking space"...it's surely a constructive and interesting conversation that anyone can be part of. You aren't telling anyone of a different race what they should call or label themselves as. I find it sad that anyone would apologise.

In our family we do go with mixed race.
I really dislike POC as it implies white people are people of no colour.

^ thank you for the reassurance @Thedogisdrivingmemad. I am conscious not to tread into spaces which aren't intended for me and as this was posted to the Black MNers board I felt it was right to acknowledge my place as a white person in the conversation.

I agree with you though, these conversations are absolutely constructive and so important to have. I wish this discourse was commonplace in day to day life and not just on the internet.

As an aside, @NotSoNewAndShiny's post is so beautiful to read. Thank you for sharing ❤️

@Buggritbuggrit I'm curious what the purpose of that new thread is. Thoughts?

@Delectable I just think it’s a troll. Possibly a bid to lure out the racists and/or get a mention in the Daily Fail? People can be so odd.

There’s an argument to be made and interesting conversations to be had on the topic, but the poster doesn’t make said arguments. Or, in fact, any rational arguments. My personal favourite bit is their continued insistence that they have NEVER heard anyone described as white.

Anyway, as pp requested, shan’t derail this thread. But I’m observing that one with both amusement and irritation.

@Buggritbuggrit definitely a troll.

As the police definitely do refer to people/suspects as white.

@Delectable. Troll hunting is against Forum guidelines so we can't comment directly.

This safe space on BMN is moderated to keep it safe ,and was hard fought for, against a lot of opposition. Dog whistle racist threads often appear in AIBU, where they rely on "free speech" etc. They often have themes such as " dont' call me black" by an OP purporting to be a POC. Divide and rule etc the timeless racist agenda.

Let us not allow them to indirectly derail this very important thread.

But a good example why I refer to myself as "Black" when often I'd rather just want to live my life as "Echo".

I've no Nigerian/ Carribean/African home to ground myself upon. My family did not come in on Windrush back in the day. We go back as far as we can remember, born in what was an English slave port. amongst a majority who don't look like us. The cry of "go back where you come from", is met with "this is where I am from". I know nowhere else. this is my home.

I am just here, a minority reminded to know my place, often by other women, who happen to be white.

So " Black" is part of who I am.

I have never known anyone black who did not come to the UK more recently, or with immigrant parents / grandparents.

Yours is a little like the US black experience then?

I am fascinated, I must say! If you don't mind me asking, how has life been given you don't have the place to call home outside of the UK with family etc that you can escape to, or fantasise about?! Or those ideas we sometimes have about being better understood by and understanding people better in another part of the world who are your 'people'?

I'm also kind of interested that if your family has been here for many generations, whether there are dark skinned people in your family. Whenever I learn about black Georgians etc the current day descendant is always white!

@Buggritbuggrit I suspected same but wondered what the aim and justification would be.

@EchoNan I understand why you'll consider yourself black (British/English). I feel a Black English/Welsh/Scot has a slightly different view to an African in diaspora. Someone like Kemi Badenoch will do well to consult widely within the black community. As much as I wanted to root for her she keeps disappointing.

Jam I can only go to the late 1800s. in response to your question.(Thank goodness for that I hear them cry)

The "non white" ( for want of another word) population in Liverpool traditionally lived in a certain area near the river/docks.

Not just black people, but a big Chinese community too. (The Jewish community a little further out, but tightly knit again.)

Lots of reasons for that population to live where they did - work, a sense of identity, lack of access to decent housing, (no Blacks, no dogs, no Irish) racism from authorities, and so on.

Into this, Liverpool also was a City with a religious sectarian history too Irish, Protestantism and Catholicism.

Consequently, people tended to stick to their communities, and tended to marry from within them, or from around them. (I'm talking late 1800s to 1950s, things began to change after that, but still that area remains the most diverse.

The Windrush generation came post War, and settled, so we of course mixed socially, as younger people, but no direct family Windrush relations afaik. We socialised in places like the notorious Somali club in Liverpool. My husband's mother (black) and sister, very religious, never travelled out of the City in their lives other than than the local seasides. His Dad (black) worked on the ships as unskilled labour.

My own famiy line is mix of black Liverpool born/ white Irish/ Chinese prior to 1948. All poor, and many associated health problems, For example, my black paternal grandfather had three cleaning jobs. One job was brushing up loose asbestos on ships at the docks. He died in 1962 of stomach cancer. Tough lives. I found him on the Liverpool census for 1901, he was born in Liverpool.

I was brought up by white Irish relatives after some time in care, ( I won't expand on that bit sorry) but am dark skinned, as is DH. So, some might call me "mixed". It's not a term I am personally comfortable with, but understand why some may choose it.

I've no living family, apart from an "assumed white" cousin in the USA. who emigrated from Liverpool in the early sixties.

Husband black/ white Irish/Italian heritage (no living family) is from the same City, we knew each other from school. We made our own way, and did ok. Generally, our life is good.

DD's husband is white. One child is a lighter skin tone, than the other.
I imagine that if they marry white partners, their children may be "assumed white."

Apols for any typos
I 'm bound to have missed something.

@Delectable, sorry, cross posted with you!
I think, for me, "Black" is me saying that I belong to this identity. As I haven't another to fit me.
To say I am English, to some people. provokes the " but where are you REALLY from response" Ho hum
I'm looking with love at your story and others.

(Kemi never ceases to underwhelm me!)