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Is my brother being unreasonable or am I?

31 replies

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 20:39

Hi I will try to keep it concise! I would appreciate objective views on this.
My dad died in April. Since my mother died 3 years ago, dad vehemently wanted to change his will so the house would stay in the family. My brothers (I have 2) were not interested in the house, I was the only one who wants to live there. It has lots of family history, particularly trees and plants in the garden.
Long story short 1 brother was supportive but the other was not as he felt he would be 'short-changed'. In addition to the house my dad had lots of money and investments. Short-changed brother came up with a spreadsheet which equalised the house so we were all left a percentage (60,20,20) and the investments so they got most of them (grandkids got 5% of investments). At the time the house value was based on estate agents upper valuation. When the will was changed with everyone's agreement, the value to each of us would have been about the same, and my dad was content that the house would stay in the family, as this was the most important thing to him.
Now the house is worth 150k less than on the spreadsheet (RICS valuation) and the investments are worth a lot more than they were then, even after IHT has been paid. I have suggested that the actual figures are put into the spreadsheet and we do a deed of variation to ensure everyone gets the same value, which is what my dad was trying to achieve in the first place. 1 brother is supportive but short change brother wants to leave it as it is. If we do leave it as it is, both brothers will get 90k more than me and I also have to spend money on the house doing things my dad was trying to achieve before he died (so I can live in it). This is quite difficult for me as I am on my own, and don't earn that much.
Am I being unreasonable to want to put the actual figures into the same spreadsheet to get up to date figures? My dad was trying to achieve equity between us, and to make it as easy as possible for me to take on the house and garden. Eldest brother (supportive one) and I do not believe he would have been happy with this degree of disparity between us. Short-change brother's reasoning is that the house is worth more than the RICS valuation (I do not intend to sell the house so I am not sure how we would find out).
I am losing the will to live with it, and I am very disappointed in short-change brother in that he is being very hard-nosed about it, treating is as a business transaction to be negotiated rather than the final wishes of our father, and indeed we were all trying to placate him when my dad (who was terminally ill at the time) put his suggestions into practice (the spreadsheet). With hindsight, we should have found a better method that would allow for market variances, but I was on my knees looking after my dad as well as working full time (I did most of the caring as both brothers were working abroad) and was trying not to upset anyone. Says it all really.
Thank you, in advance, for your replies.

OP posts:
TwinkleTwinkleLittleBatgirl · 24/11/2025 20:41

How many valuations have you had that agree the house is worth £150k less than now than when will written?

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 20:45

TwinkleTwinkleLittleBatgirl · 24/11/2025 20:41

How many valuations have you had that agree the house is worth £150k less than now than when will written?

For sorting the will out we just got one RICS valuation - this is the only formal valuation (rather than an estate agent's estimate) that is accepted by HMRC for IHT purposes. We asked for more (3) but the solicitor told us there was no point as they would all be the same (RICS surveyors work to the same formula apparently). Also they cost £400-£500 each, we paid £450 for ours. Originals were estate agents, so there is no like-for-like comparison

OP posts:
TheTowerAtMidnight · 24/11/2025 20:46

I think Spreadsheet Brother is right. You can't have your cake (the house) and eat it (the investments).

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 20:49

TheTowerAtMidnight · 24/11/2025 20:46

I think Spreadsheet Brother is right. You can't have your cake (the house) and eat it (the investments).

Hi
I'm not getting any of the investments, just 60% of the house. He is getting 20% of the house and 40% of the investments. By the time I have bought him out he will be £90k more than me and so will the other brother.

OP posts:
user593 · 24/11/2025 20:52

You should be able to get free estate agents’ valuations. I’d get at least one of those and see how it compares to the RICS valuation.

Changingplace · 24/11/2025 20:59

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 20:45

For sorting the will out we just got one RICS valuation - this is the only formal valuation (rather than an estate agent's estimate) that is accepted by HMRC for IHT purposes. We asked for more (3) but the solicitor told us there was no point as they would all be the same (RICS surveyors work to the same formula apparently). Also they cost £400-£500 each, we paid £450 for ours. Originals were estate agents, so there is no like-for-like comparison

Estate agent valuations are free, just get some estate agents to value the property.

I don’t understand why you think that’s not like for like, the estate agents will give you a market value figure. If it’s the same you’ve lost nothing anyway but at least you’ll know for your own peace of mind.

Who is the executor of your dad’s will? Just add up your own figures on a new spreadsheet, is there a solicitor overseeing this?

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 21:05

Changingplace · 24/11/2025 20:59

Estate agent valuations are free, just get some estate agents to value the property.

I don’t understand why you think that’s not like for like, the estate agents will give you a market value figure. If it’s the same you’ve lost nothing anyway but at least you’ll know for your own peace of mind.

Who is the executor of your dad’s will? Just add up your own figures on a new spreadsheet, is there a solicitor overseeing this?

Edited

Estate agent valuations are not accepted for legal purposes (hence we had to get a RICS valuation). They varied by 150k 3 years ago, since when the market has stagnated. The lower house valuation has benefitted spreadsheet brother as have a few other factors, as it kept the IHT bill much lower than it otherwise would have been. Brother was fine with valuation for this purpose (ie when it benefitted him) so I can't see why he won't accept it for other purposes

OP posts:
Gazelda · 24/11/2025 21:11

At the time you father wrote his will, you were all satisfied with its contents. You wanted the house, which is what you’ve got.

now you want to change the settlement, but seem to see your brother as the one being unreasonable.

I think the will should have been written better if it hasn’t reflected your father’s wishes. But it’s unfair to paint your brother as the villain.

I sympathise with the situation you’ve found yourselves in. But I can’t see a resolution that you’ll all feel is fair.

is there anyone you’d all trust to do a family mediation?

IceIceSlippyIce · 24/11/2025 21:12

Your Dad has written the will poorly thslat has lead to this issue.
It should have been written to leave 5% to each grandchild, with the residual split between his kids, and the first refusal on the house to be yours.

The estate should be divided equally between you and your brothers using the probate value of house and investments.

Changingplace · 24/11/2025 21:17

IceIceSlippyIce · 24/11/2025 21:12

Your Dad has written the will poorly thslat has lead to this issue.
It should have been written to leave 5% to each grandchild, with the residual split between his kids, and the first refusal on the house to be yours.

The estate should be divided equally between you and your brothers using the probate value of house and investments.

Agreed, it shouldn’t be about % of the house and % of investments.

It should be 5% each grandchild and rest divided equally by three, it’s irrelevant where the funds sit.

Changingplace · 24/11/2025 21:17

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 21:05

Estate agent valuations are not accepted for legal purposes (hence we had to get a RICS valuation). They varied by 150k 3 years ago, since when the market has stagnated. The lower house valuation has benefitted spreadsheet brother as have a few other factors, as it kept the IHT bill much lower than it otherwise would have been. Brother was fine with valuation for this purpose (ie when it benefitted him) so I can't see why he won't accept it for other purposes

Who is the executor of the will and is there a solicitor involved?

Was the original house valuation done 3 years ago or after your father passed away earlier this year?

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 21:20

Changingplace · 24/11/2025 21:17

Who is the executor of the will and is there a solicitor involved?

Was the original house valuation done 3 years ago or after your father passed away earlier this year?

Edited

We are all joint executors. We have a solicitor helping us sort everything out.

OP posts:
EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 21:22

Changingplace · 24/11/2025 21:17

Who is the executor of the will and is there a solicitor involved?

Was the original house valuation done 3 years ago or after your father passed away earlier this year?

Edited

Original house market estimates / valuations were done in 2022 by 5 estate agents and varied widely (between 650k and 525k). Recent valuation was done in July and had to be done by a RICS surveyor, as this was the only one accepted for HMRC and probate purposes. We were told only to get 1.

OP posts:
EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 21:25

Gazelda · 24/11/2025 21:11

At the time you father wrote his will, you were all satisfied with its contents. You wanted the house, which is what you’ve got.

now you want to change the settlement, but seem to see your brother as the one being unreasonable.

I think the will should have been written better if it hasn’t reflected your father’s wishes. But it’s unfair to paint your brother as the villain.

I sympathise with the situation you’ve found yourselves in. But I can’t see a resolution that you’ll all feel is fair.

is there anyone you’d all trust to do a family mediation?

I'm not trying to 'paint my brother as the villain'. I am keen to carry out my dad's wishes. My brother has accepted the new RICS house valuation for IHT purposes but not for other purposes

OP posts:
EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 21:27

IceIceSlippyIce · 24/11/2025 21:12

Your Dad has written the will poorly thslat has lead to this issue.
It should have been written to leave 5% to each grandchild, with the residual split between his kids, and the first refusal on the house to be yours.

The estate should be divided equally between you and your brothers using the probate value of house and investments.

Agreed. This is what he was aiming for. But spreadsheet brother was being very mardy at the time. My dad ended up accepting his suggestion to placate him and because it seemed the fairest /most equitable solution. Hindsight is a wonderful thing

OP posts:
ShesTheAlbatross · 24/11/2025 21:32

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 21:27

Agreed. This is what he was aiming for. But spreadsheet brother was being very mardy at the time. My dad ended up accepting his suggestion to placate him and because it seemed the fairest /most equitable solution. Hindsight is a wonderful thing

Wasn’t your brother only getting “mardy” over exactly the same thing you are now annoyed about though? Not feeling like you’re getting an even share?

I mean, I can see why you feel the way you do. But you seem keen to paint your brother’s initial concerns as a bit unreasonable even though you now have exactly the same concerns.

SambucusEbulus · 24/11/2025 21:38

Surely if the house is now valued at 150k less, that means you'll have to pay less than you originally thought to buy your brothers' shares? So you're still better off than you would have been if you do just want to live in the house and not resell it?

Changingplace · 24/11/2025 21:39

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 21:22

Original house market estimates / valuations were done in 2022 by 5 estate agents and varied widely (between 650k and 525k). Recent valuation was done in July and had to be done by a RICS surveyor, as this was the only one accepted for HMRC and probate purposes. We were told only to get 1.

Ok I think I understand you more now, the valuations done in 2022 are irrelevant, but your brother is insisting on keeping that valuation against the house now?

The only one that’s now valid is the most recent one, which should obviously be the one used for the current situation and calculations.

If you’ve used the RICS survey for IHT purposes it should be consistent that you use it for the rest of the calculations.

I would speak to the solicitor about this discrepancy, it surely needs to be consistent.

Zapx · 24/11/2025 21:40

Just tell stingy brother that you’re so sick of his arguing and being unreasonable so you will sell the house and you’ll take an equal share. This seemingly will see him lose 50k + selling fees at least. See what he says?

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 21:45

Changingplace · 24/11/2025 21:39

Ok I think I understand you more now, the valuations done in 2022 are irrelevant, but your brother is insisting on keeping that valuation against the house now?

The only one that’s now valid is the most recent one, which should obviously be the one used for the current situation and calculations.

If you’ve used the RICS survey for IHT purposes it should be consistent that you use it for the rest of the calculations.

I would speak to the solicitor about this discrepancy, it surely needs to be consistent.

Edited

This is what I have asked them to do - ie, use the same spreadsheet but with the up to date figures. The issue is that spreadsheet brother will not accept the RICS valuation (the most recent one that was used for IHT calculations). He will only consider the original one that was done by an estate agent

OP posts:
HeddaGarbled · 24/11/2025 21:46

I’d sell the house. Keeping it in the family was a sentimental and unrealistic notion.

You’re very lucky to have inherited so much and have lost sight of that in your wrangling with your brother.

TheSaltedCaramelPath · 24/11/2025 21:52

Zapx · 24/11/2025 21:40

Just tell stingy brother that you’re so sick of his arguing and being unreasonable so you will sell the house and you’ll take an equal share. This seemingly will see him lose 50k + selling fees at least. See what he says?

Yes, you could consider a delaying tactic for Mardy brother, indicate that you are “thinking about” just selling it (which will take more time, need more valuations from estate agents….)
I won’t happen quickly…
Mardy brother might relent / rethink - if he is in a hurry…
Might work in your favour.

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 21:55

HeddaGarbled · 24/11/2025 21:46

I’d sell the house. Keeping it in the family was a sentimental and unrealistic notion.

You’re very lucky to have inherited so much and have lost sight of that in your wrangling with your brother.

Lucky? I have lost both parents to hideous illnesses in the last 3 years, looked after my dad as he starved to death due to oesophageal cancer. It is all still pretty raw. My parents were homebodies who had invested their lives in their house so yes, it is it is sentimental but why unrealistic? Most decisions are emotional aren't they? I don't want to sell the house, I want to live in it. My dad was just trying to arrive at something equitable (we all get equal value) and I think we should honour this. Both brothers will get a third of a million quid if we go with the latest valuation and I buy them both out.

OP posts:
socialdilemmawhattodo · 24/11/2025 22:00

Gazelda · 24/11/2025 21:11

At the time you father wrote his will, you were all satisfied with its contents. You wanted the house, which is what you’ve got.

now you want to change the settlement, but seem to see your brother as the one being unreasonable.

I think the will should have been written better if it hasn’t reflected your father’s wishes. But it’s unfair to paint your brother as the villain.

I sympathise with the situation you’ve found yourselves in. But I can’t see a resolution that you’ll all feel is fair.

is there anyone you’d all trust to do a family mediation?

I agree. You agreed to those terms, being of sound mind and having capacity. But when my dad who had dementia started to talk about his house and which of his DC wanted it, i was so quick to say sorry not me dad I'm moving out of area. Its a gorgeous house, my childhood home, unique, etc etc, but no way was I having someone impose that burden on me.

sandyhappypeople · 24/11/2025 22:02

EnglishDutch · 24/11/2025 21:45

This is what I have asked them to do - ie, use the same spreadsheet but with the up to date figures. The issue is that spreadsheet brother will not accept the RICS valuation (the most recent one that was used for IHT calculations). He will only consider the original one that was done by an estate agent

That's not the issue at all though is it? It's not the value that is the issue with your brother, it's that you agreed to get 60% of the house so you could keep it, while they got 20%, and for that they were compensated by being given the investments too.

That is what has happened, seemingly driven by your wants/needs, and it is what you all agreed on, the fact that the market has fluctuated is neither here nor there to what you all agreed at the time, it could have fluctuated in your favour just as easily.

You made a bad choice by using the top market value of the house at the time of working out the value, if there was a £150k range then you should have taken an average surely?

It's natural that you feel short changed, but you should have really thought about it before agreeing to it at the time. Surely the house value being lower works in your favour now for buying them out? You're saving £40k on that alone.