Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

Behaviour/development

Talk to others about child development and behaviour stages here. You can find more information on our development calendar.

Flip

1 2

Original poster

3yo gets up early and wakes us all

38 replies

PennyLess · 03/07/2005 21:07

How do I get my 3yo ds2 (ds1 is 6 and dd is 5) either to sleep longer or to stay quietly in his room between 5 and 6 in the morning?

OP posts:

Are your children’s vaccines up to date?

Set a reminder

Caththerese1973 · 04/07/2005 18:13

do you think he would go back to sleep if you were firm, put him back in bed and told him: 'too early?' You would, of course, have a hell of a time with this initially, but after a few mornings he would begin to accept it if he were still tired.
Alternatively you could try getting him to develop a fetish about a 'bed toy' or special article. I have done this recently with my 2.5 y/o dd who will not go to sleep at night. She has a special toy car, and one of my cardigans. She knows that these are special bed things and will play quitely in the bed with them until she falls asleep (admittedly, this is not until about 10.30 sometimes. But at least she is in bed by herself and being quiet!)
If he is not tired, perhaps he needs to go to be a bit later? Or give up his nap, if he still has one?

Caththerese1973 · 04/07/2005 18:20

sorry -just read the posts properly and you HAVE tried later bed and giving up nap.
I guess the essential question is: is he tired? If so, he can be made to go back to bed if you are firm. If not, them maybe try a much later bedtime, like half past nine. I know this sounds irresponsible. But I don't think anyone should have to get up at 5am. It's not civilised! I know a lot of mums give in to their kids' early waking behaviour but you shouldn't have to get up before 7 am , or at the earliest 6. 30. If the child doesn't stay in bed until then, then he or she is not keeping socially acceptable hours (in my book).
Yes, the later bedtime involves you giving up some of your night-time. But if you can get him to do something quiet, like (dare I suggest it?) a Thomas the Tank Engine video or such like, then the extra time he is awake at night wii not be so onerous.
(maybe my nickname shoud be 'badmum?'!!!!

Original poster

PennyLess · 04/07/2005 19:22

The funny thing is, yes he is tired, but not at that time of the morning. But by 10 or 11 he is shattered and therefore behaving appallingly. His nap is welcomed by him and me alike, and I can't wake him as he is FOUL if I do so I generally let him sleep it out, which can be 2.5-3 hrs. If he doesn't nap, we have a hellish afternoon and he falls asleep about 5. So I tried this thing of trying to get his body used to not napping, and he did get better (tiredness-wise) over the week but didn't wake any later! Even one very busy day when he was up at 5.45 in the car for total of 3 hrs and home at 8pm (so not asleep til 8.30). Up at 5.30 next day. So that was it. Back to naps. It is cruel not to allow them.
There is no being firm with this child. He is completely disobedient and does and says what he wants. I am at a complete loss.

OP posts:

bakedpotato · 04/07/2005 19:31

Pretty sure Ferber has a chapter on a similar problem (in Solve Your Child's Sleep Problem, ace book). I think he has a way of reintegrating the nap into the nighttime sleep. Can't remember how he does it, sorry, but Ferber's always do-able and practical.

mandyc66 · 05/07/2005 10:24

think the more tired they get the less sleep they have!!! I would let him nap if he wants to. If DS3 goes to bed late he is up earlier than if he goes to bed at 7pm. Last night in bed for 7 and up this morning for 7.20 needless to say we were rushing to be out for 8!!!!!!

Harrizeb · 05/07/2005 10:41

Hi pennyless, I have been where you are now, my DS is now currently 2.1yr and until he was about 19mths was up at 5.30 every morning without fail - but was tired again by 9 and needing another sleep. In the end I just said enough is enough you will stay in bed. He would stay in bed if DH went in to him - he'd kick and scream about it but would stay put. So what I started to do was set him a time when he could get up - 6 was ok (only ok mind but it was a start) and would go in and say to him it is still bed time and you need to stay in bed and walk out again. Just keep at it until he gets the message

It's a lot harder for you as you have other little ones to be aware of too, and that is a complication we don't have, we do have a neighbour that bangs on the wall if DS wakes her up or if she gets fed up with him crying, and of course I like him crying .

For us the turning point was me just saying right that's it I've had enough of getting up at this silly time in the morning - it is not what you do, and stuck to it. Once he got used to the fact that he wasn't coming out, he would go back to sleep for a little bit and we then introduced the bunny clock to him and for us that now works.

Good luck xx and fingers crossed you start getting some more sleep.

Original poster

PennyLess · 05/07/2005 18:04

Hmm, slight difference - yours was in a cot!!!! How do you deal with a child who simply doesn't do as he's told. I can't physically keep him in his room. Even if I were to get a lock he would band on the door and yell!!!

OP posts:

Harrizeb · 05/07/2005 21:25

Hi Pennyless, good point - a cot does mean he stays put - but my word can he yell!!!

This is just a personal view, but I would just keep taking him back to bed every time he gets up, not talking to him just turn him round and put him back to bed and then say it's still bedtime, until it gets to the time that you are happy for him to get up - what ever time you have set that to be. I would be tempted to maybe sit outside his bedroom door and as soon as he shows his face he would know that he can't come out because your there waiting .

Good luck with sorting it out because I know how miserable it made me feel when my DS was doing it, and I really really hope you are able to resolve it in a way that suits all of you soon

H x

Caththerese1973 · 06/07/2005 08:02

hmm, I have been thinking about it and realised we have similar problem but at opposite ends of the spectrum - my dd won't go to bed until very late, and your ds gets up too early. Could their naps simply be too long? (you mentioned that you son will sleep for up to three hours in the daytime). My dd will also sleep for over two hours, and sometimes as long as three, in the daytime if I let her. But lately I have started waking her up after an hour and a half of napping. And hurrah, she has started to settle earlier at night. So maybe just try a shorter nap (then he is not altogether deprived of his daytime rest, which you both need!)

Original poster

PennyLess · 06/07/2005 14:35

Well, thanks to baked potato, I got Richard Ferber's book out of the library (totally astounded that they had it, tbh) and it is very good, and I think would be very useful to you too, Caththerese. The two problems come under the same sort of headings.
BP said she thought there was something about rolling naps into nighttime sleep, which there is but not really applicable to me as it was for a baby who was waking at 5 then taking her morning nap at 8 so they moved her morning nap to 10 and she slept through - the 8 am nap wasn't really a nap but an extension of her nighttime sleep.
There are various other points of interest for me, but the thing I am focussing on is that we all "rouse" naturally at about 5am but generally don't allow ourselves to wake entirely and turn over and go back to sleep, which is where my ds is failing. So rather than focussing on keeping him quiet for and hour or two when he wakes I really need to focus on getting him not to wake...
While his room is completely dark, with heavy floor length blackout curtains, there is a chink of light down the edge of one of the curtains and I wonder if this is what he is focussing on when he wakes. Last night I did a shunt round and put him in dd's room and I THINK he didn't wake until 6.45. ("Think" because i was actually in a different room too as dh not well!) So HOPEFULLY I might be able to retune his body so he goes on sleeping.
Thanks baked potato, good advice, and I really recommend the book to everyone else!

OP posts:

Harrizeb · 06/07/2005 15:14

Woo hoo - fantastic, I'm so glad that you are making head way I think I need to get hold of that book for the next one. fingers crossed for tonight for you

H x

SonyaSingapore · 20/07/2005 14:21

sorry everyone but can you tell me about this famous 'bunny clock'? I've recently been hearing great things about it but I live in Singapore and so am a bit out of touch. Does anyone know if I can buy it online anywhere?

thanks!

jambot · 20/07/2005 15:06

You can find it on the Blooming Marvellous website. Don't know the address. The bunny's eyes stay closed until the set time. The child is only supposed to get out of bed once the eyes are open. Haven't used it myself, just saw it on the website.

Flip

1 2