New baby - big sister is furious with us. OldieMum needs help, please!

[OldieMum]

DS was born 3 weeks ago. DD is 3.5. She had expressed her concerns about his arrival beforehand ("Will you stop loving me when the baby comes?") and we had striven to reassure her. I had, mistakenly, assumed that his arrival would lead to her falling in love with him and, hence, reducing her anxieties. Things have turned out very differently. She had not been prone to tantrums in the past, but these have become increasingly prolonged and intense. She has not displayed much antipathy to the baby (though she tapped his head yesterday). But she is furious with us for all the time and attention we are giving the baby. She hits out at both of us and screams when frustrated over anything, however trivial. We realise that this behaviour is entirely understandable, but that doesn't make it any less difficult to deal with, especially since we are both lacking sleep from looking after the new baby. In the past, we had relied on occasional use of the naughty step and, increasingly, talking things over with her. Neither seems to make any impact. She is highly intelligent and responds to attempts on our part to reassure her ("DS will need less of our time when he is feeding on solids and needs to spent less time eating") to escalate her antagonism ("So I'll keep crying until he stops drinking milk"). I feel we need to go back to the drawing board in dealing with her, but feel like I've lost the map. ANY suggestions would be helpful. Thanks!

keep to her routine as much as possible, and also stay constant with how you discipline her too. Don't let her get away with anything you wouldn't have before baby.....she needs to know that the boundries are still the same and that mummy and daddy are also still the same (even if there is an alien invading the house!).

And where possible, put baby down and give her as much one-to-one as you can, even to the point of riding thro the tantrum and going back to the start each time you get the time with her (ie....if she tantrums and you would, for eg, put her on the stairs, then still do that and then go back to giving her the one-to-one again.)
Maybe there would be some kind family member or good friend that would take over with DS for a couple of hours between feeds??

Just stay constant is the key...she'll come round eventualy. Kiddies rarely keep this up for too long

Can you still pay attention to your DD while feeding your DS? I did a lot of "reading and feeding" with DS1 and DS2 (3 year gap) and that seemed to work ok.

Is she always at home with you? Any way for her to get extra one-to-one time, with either you or your DH?

Congratulations on DS
Ignore him as much as you possibly can
Try not to talk about the baby when she's around, just about her
Ease her into the situation, lots of bribery and fuss when she is helpful, make sure guests are primed to pay her attention, not DS (personally I would say don't go too hard on the discipline right now or things may escalate)
If at all possible, try to spend some time alone with her while the DP is with the baby
Knackering
She will see his potential when he starts to smile in a few weeks time

I take your point about routines - we have tried this. She goes to nursery 3 days per week and we have managed to keep Tumble Tots going, but nursery finishes for the summer next week - eek!!

All really helpful suggestions - but we've tried them all. She responds well to reading while feeding etc, but then morphs into Mr Hyde shortly afterwards.

I neglected to mention telly, gallons of it.

Hi - we have a 3.5 dd and ds is now 11 weeks so i know exactly where you're coming from Oldiemum.

Although dd is absolutely fantastic with her new little brother, she has started to hit me (and only me. She gets so frustrated sometimes (usually when i cant give her my full attention) that she shouts at me and hits out.

After several weeks of not really knowing how to deal with it I've decided to completely ignore this behaviour (which is very hard to do btw) and it usually blows over in a few seconds.

Also, she is 3.5 yrs old and dd never had any tantrums until the last few months. I dont really thing thats necessarily anything to do with me having a baby as lots of my friends with just one child have told me that their toddlers are doing exactly the same things. We didnt have terrible twos, it was definitely terrible threes!!!

You just have to keep telling yourself that she was your baby for such a long time and now this screaming baby has come into her perfect life and taken her place. She is still so very young and you cant possible know what is going on in her little head.

Just give lots of positive attention, reassurance and, i know it nigh on impossible to do, but try and give her some quality one on one time - even if its just an hour a day - something that is just her and mummy.

I dont know about you but as soon as i saw dd after having ds, she seemed to have grown ten years and was suddenly this big, clumsy, slightly irritating toddler!!!!! It passes, believe me, and i just keep telling myself to look forward to the two of them playing together in a few years' time!

HTH X

Some of this is just unavoidable, I fear. She's been displaced from her position as queen of the household, and it's a shock for her.

It will pass.

At least she's angry at you, not so much at the baby.

Try for some big sister responsibilities - get her involved in how she can help look after him ('Oh look, he really likes it when you smile at him/tickle him gently/whatever'). DD was 4 when DS was born, and she reacted a bit like this - not quite as intensely, but very similar. Nursery was very helpful in giving her little jobs to do that made her feel important, and she grew out of it quite quickly.

I have to admit that my sister was born when I was three and one month and I took against her violently for 10 years . (No, I didn't tell you that when I sent you my article on DD1 falling in love with DD2, did I .)

The really important thing, I think, is that you're listening to her and paying attention to her distress (in retrospect I suspect my father's explanation that I was "experiencing sibling rivalry, which would pass" was possibly not the most appropriate parenting technique).

We found indulging DD1's urge to 'be a baby' helped a bit (she did revert and feel insecure despite the doting). I do think that as she knows you love her and you're listening to her, it will change. And soon enough he will be an adoring, pliable toy....

my solution would be - get your toddler involved as much as possible - let her hold the baby and dress him.
Tell her 1000 times a day how much you love her.
And come down very heavily on all displays of temper. It is simply not allowed to be jealous of the baby.

My sister was very jealous of me, she carried on being spiteful all our lives. A couple of years ago, I drew the line, after 38 years of nastiness, she no longer has a sister.
My mother is the sort of person who always takes the easy path, and I am sure she never took steps to stop my sister being so jealous as a toddler.

But FFON, she is jealous of the baby. With every reason - she gets less attention, and (as she perceives it) less love. She needs to have that feeling acknowledged in order to get through it and over it and past it. I think BP's suggestions of ignoring the baby not involving her in him (when he's already taking up too much damn space and attention in her opinion) is a good option.

(I get on very well with my own sister now, btw.)

You may already be dping lots of this but just gonna tap out ideas

• get her involved in the feeding, nappy changing. Ask for her help, make it a game for her
• when he cries say 'ohhh noooDD1, he's crying again, what shall we do, do you think he needs a dummy. He's funny isn't he' and laugh at him crying as you deal with it, all the time talking to her and saying 'do you think his sister smiling at him will make him stop, do you think a kiss from you will make him better'

Will you feed him ask her to come up on the sofa for a cuddle. Ask her to read with you. Put her fav DVD on.

• get DH to deal with bubs and give her as much 1-2-1 as poss.

• give her as many cuddles as poss, tell her over and over how much you love her, how she's your special girl.

• tell her she's the big sister, she's in charge. Give her control over things like what he wears.

• Buy her a new book, from baby.

Good luck, xx

Jealousy was 'not allowed' when we were growing up, with disastrous consequences of it all going underground and resurfacing later. Maybe FF meant 'jealous behaviour' as opposed to 'jealousy'?? 'Cos I'm all for feelings being allowed, and some behaviour not being allowed....ie jealousy is a feeling, and totally normal/acceptable, hitting is a behaviour and not acceptable (in my book).

I am five months pg with dd2, and dd1 will be nearly 3 when she is born....so not in a postition to offer real advice, but am reading thread with due care and attention!

ps when my friend's second dd was born recently, she would notice her 3.5 year old looking pissed off when baby crying and just say 'yep, babies can be really annoying sometimes can't they...' and give her a hug. Then attend to the baby. May not be the right approach with all, but I remember seeing dd1's face relax and a resigned look take the place of anger/tension....

...sorry, that was erring on advice

when my DD - (4.5 with special needs) gets annoyed with her 7 month old sister I find that making whatever DD2 is doing funny really helps and diffuses the situation. If DD2 is doing her mad growl and upsetting DD1 with the noise for example I say to DD1 'does she think she's a little t-rex, or a bear, or is she a lion?' and then I play growl back at DD2, encouraging DD1 to do the same, all the time laughing and making it fun and a game. DD2 trying to take DD1s food when eating something out in the garden for example isn't so easy so I just remove DD2 and say 'oyyy cheeky monkey stop taking Lotties apple' and reassurign Lottie that it's ok. with toys I am v firm and make sure that DD1 knows she MUST share. I just make sure that there is enough toys around and reiterate over and over that she must share and do a sign for the word share too. To the extent that Lottie is now taking books, drinks, etc out of my hands and sayoing to me 'share mummy share! Waht do you do about that????!!!!!!

I tried to build a relatonship with ds and new baby dd by constantly building him up 'look at her, she only smiles like that at you', 'she loves it when you tickle her toes', etc. I also used a squeaky baby voice for dd to 'talk' to ds which went down well "mmmm ds your breakfast looks yummy I wish I didn't just have to have milk".

If she is very bright maybe you could talk to her about love and how she feels about you and about daddy (ie you can love two people at the same time but in different ways). Lots of stories about siblings to reinforce the benefits subliminally - my ds loved My Naughty Little Sister stories and the Alfie and Annie Rose ones (Annie Rose is my little sister still makes me fill up at the end " and she will be my sister for ever and ever")

Whilst I agree with trying to stick to routines I would try and introduce some special privileges related to being the oldest - a slightly later bedtime and some special time with you maybe, special trips out for the special big girl. Make her feel that being a big sister is a great thing.

I also found ds wanted to be babied a bit so we didn't do too much of the 'helping out with the new baby' thing - that came a bit later.

I would ignore as much bad behaviour as you can and accept any offers of help with the new baby so that you can spend time with your dd.

HTH - it's very early days.

Yes I did all that as well Puddle. Seems to have worked well. If I have a moment with DD2 and I am kissing her I always then kiss DD1 and get DD1 to kiss Dd2 as well and so on. I say to DD1, 'ahhhhh look you make her happy, she's smiling at you, she really loves you doesn't she'. I expressed milk so DD1 could have a go at feeding her. I made the new baby a fun thing basically. Think i'll shut up now though, sorry!

I think elibean has clarified it well - the feeling of jealousy has to be acknowleged and given attention in order for it to pass, but at the same time it needs to be crystal clear that "jealous behaviour" ie hitting etc is absolutely not allowed and that your ds has all sorts of good things in store for your dd in that he will be a playmate when he is bigger, etc etc. She will hopefully gradually learn to regard him as an equal. Like fistful, I grew up with an incredibly dominant and difficult older sister (she still is) who is 3yrs 2 months older than me, and I do think part of her attitude was encouraged by my parents. I remember my dad telling me how they snuck me in the back door when I came home from hosp so that sis would not feel threatened and that approach was pretty much how they handled all disputes from then on, from who got to sleep on car journeys (sis lay down across the back seat, I sat up) to her stealing my clothes as teenagers. I realise these "poor little me" complaints are v trivial in the grand scheme of family life, but what happened is that sis got the message, loud and clear, that she was the more important sibling and that my feelings were of no consequence (oh, and I got this message too) and this is the attitude that has persisted now for 41 years.

I don't want to sound like a voice of doom, and of course your dd's circumstances are very different (hopefully you don't have the ludicrously complicated family dynamic that I had!) but I did just want to say that you thinking about these issues is really great and that I'm sure your dd will come through and be great friends with her little brother.

Sorry, my essay crossed with some excellent posts - I like that emphasis on how the new baby loves the older child in an extra special way. Lovely.

There's a lovely book called Zaza's baby brother by Lucy Cousins that might be worth a look oldiemum - happy to send it to you if you CAT me.

Thanks for all this helpful advice. I think the suggestion of more 1-2-1 time between me and her may be particularly helpful. I've been spending hours b-fing DS (he was 11lb at birth and lost quite a bit of weight due to jaundice). My milk supply seems to be keeping up with him this week, however, so I hope I'll have a bit more time to do this with her now. She also responds well to 'boosting' - e.g. "think of how you'll be able to teach him to swim, read etc."

puddle, whats the Rosie book called please? Would it be right for a bright 2.7 yr old?

Puddle - Thanks. I have CAT-ed you.

The Alfie books have various titles. Alfie Weather is a particularly lovely one. They are by Shirley Hughes. Our favourite of all is also by her - 'Dogger' - and features a loving older sister who saves the day for her little brother. Maybe an emergency re-reading of Dogger would help tonight!