To ask my cleaner not to shout at her 4yo DS in my house?

[WorkingItOutAsIGo]

First AIBU - be gentle! I have a cleaner who has been with me for over 10 years. She comes to my house 4 mornings a week (I know, I'm lucky!). She has a 4 year old DS who she will be bringing with her every time once the school holidays start. He is a cute boy and a typical scamp, and it is hard for her to work and look after him. So she spends a lot of time shouting at him to stop doing this, do that etc. It's quite ineffective as he doesnt do what she says, and she doesnt follow through but just keeps shouting, so she spends a lot of the time here shouting.

I hate hearing it, and my own DCs have said to me it upsets them and ruins the atmosphere in the house. I don't want their holidays affected by this and would like to ask her not to do it but have been anguishing for weeks about whether it would be a really offensive request. How can I phrase it so it doesn't come across as a criticism or a slur on her parenting skills? Or do I just have to accept it as the price of having her here?

I wouldn't mention the shouting.

She is probably busy cleaning and worried that her DS is running amok so she's shouting at him to stop because she can't do anything else due to the fact that she's cleaning. She might feel that she would be neglecting her job if she stops what she is doing to deal with the her DS.

I'd tell your kids to not let the shouting bother them because really at their ages, I think they ought to be able to tolerate it.

By all means think of other ways to lessen the shouting, but I would just get on with it tbh.

Thanks all - especially SugarMouse for that long and thoughtful note.

It hadn't occurred to me that some of her shouting might be to show that she is caring about what he is doing, and I think the idea of reassuring her and being really clear that I am totally happy for him to be playing downstairs with anything (no china ornaments in a house with 3 DCs!) is a really good one.

I also will suggest that she reduces the hours she spends here by taking our ironing to her house during the holidays so she still earns the same amount but can do some of the work in less stressful conditions - I know she would like that.

I'd love it if occasionally she arranged for him to play elsewhere but think at 4 and a bit that is a couple of years away. And I think she likes bringing him here as he enjoys it so much - we are his playgroup!

And Ninah - yes nursery attached to the local primary school - I called it school for short!

I won't address the shouting head-on (god I love AIBU as I've been fretting over whether I could do so, and now know I can't, so that's easy!) but yes, I might pluck up the courage to say something next time I am working from home and it happens.

Many thanks all!

Workingitout - you seem like a lovely person and I think your cleaner is very lucky to have you as an employer. You've had some good advice on here and I think your solutions sound great. Good luck .

Ditto what The Bolter said

Thank you C&R and The B

Don't let your cleaner rule the roost. It's your home & you don't like her to shout at her child.
Are you her only cleaning job? If she works elsewhere what does she do with her child then?

I once had a cleaner who brought her 12yr old dd with her. She expected her to help with the cleaning! I wasn't having this so she sat out in the garden. She was bored all day (my kids were much smaller) but very polite. I said that next time her dd should bring things to do but she wasn't to clean.

could she not do 2x6hrs and get a childminder for her ds for 2 days?

I suggest that either you ask her not to bring her child to work or else that you ask your nanny to entertain him properly whilst he is at yours. Either approach should sort out the shouting issue effectively.

Sounds like a good solution, OP. I agree you sound like a nice employer and a nice person.

For those suggesting a childminder, I'd imagine that would wipe out most of her wages. One of the good things about cleaning work is that there is (usually) a bit of flexibility about bringing your DC in during the hols. I know the women from the cleaning agency I use do this, and I am very happy with this. (It is only 1 hour a week though, and I am always at work, so not exactly a big concession on my part!)

If Nanny is there and its ok with you, could she not entertain him for a while?
We dont know cleaners circumstances, but if she has to pay for a childminder that may well put her out of pocket I guess.
How old is he? old enough to have a DS or simlar?
and as others have said she may well want to show you shes a good mum, not want you to be disturbed etc etc although her shouting does seem to disturb you.
sorry not particulary helpful, just what I think what I would do IYKWIM.

I agree with all the advice about reassuring the cleaner that you really don't mind her ds being there. Agree it's not necessarily her normal parenting style, she is just anxious that it might be stressful. Actually, I used to hate being home when my cleaner was there - but I guess it is hard to go out four times a week!

And good on you for taking the light-hearted comments about 'upstairs/downstairs' on the chin (am just jealous, can't afford a cleaner once a week any more )

Your final post sounds spot-on. Hope it all works out!

TSC and others thanks .

On the childminding etc question, I think it's right that cleaners' payrates make it uncommercial to organise one, as well as the fact it would be complicated for just the summers, I assume. So taking a child along in the holidays is quite normal.

Interesting question re whether to ask my nanny to step in and help. I'm quite protective of my nannies - they are professionals, with a contract and terms and conditions of employment, and I put a lot of effort into respecting that. So, her job is to look after my three kids, and I think asking her to look after another child regularly for a longish period would be something outside her terms, and as such would require extra payment. Of course, she does keep an eye on my cleaner's son, cooks him lunch etc if he's here, but I don't really want to make it a contractual obligation, IYSWIM.

And, OTOH, a nanny earns more than a cleaner, so in addition to paying my cleaner £X per hour, I would also be providing childcare worth £Y per hour...wish my employer would do that .