in thinking that this behaviour in British slaughterhouses is horrific and needs to be stopped?

[Vallhala]

www.animalaid.org.uk/h/n/NEWS/pr_factory//2188//

I haven't seen the film footage as I can't face it. FYI I don't eat meat (for animal welfare reasons) but this isn't designed to convert others or to spark yet another veggie vs meat-eater debate.

Its to ask whether any decent human being would think these practices reasonable or acceptable and to pray to goodness that those who don't will forward the link to their MPs/press contacts/whoever in order to obtain tighter legislation and closer surveillance on what goes on in our slaughterhouses.

This is surely so wrong... or AIBU?

[Itsjustafleshwound]

Just a quick question - those who are vegetarians - do you still consume dairy products??

[Morloth]

I was raised on a sheep station piratecat I have seen sheep walk off cliffs (not panicked/not run) literally walk off a cliff because they were too dumb to do otherwise.

I don't respect sheep, I view them as meat and wool on legs. The only value they have in my eyes is a monetary one.

They are not too dumb to notice and panic when being slaughtered, which is why good practice is to do them singularly rather than with more than one animal in the room. We used to do so and by hand (this is before stunning was in general use). They will however trot quite happily up into the killing room with its mess and blood and not notice anything going on.

[piratecat]

yes cos i'm not perfect (halo emoticon)!

are you going to justify something now?

[ijustwanttoaskaquestion]

Yes i do fleshwound - and yes, im aware of some of the awful practices surrounding dairy - i dont like it, i just coudlnt be a vegan, id probably die I am however, a non preachy veggie, i dont eat meat, my choice - i do feel better for it - i like to share that though.

[piratecat]

so the way your family did the killing seems to have been with the sheep's best interest at heart, even if they did trot happily up to it?

[Itsjustafleshwound]

If you don't east meat for humane reasons then you shouldn't drink or consume any dairy ... don't think that because the dairy herd isn't slaughtered they have a more humane life - dairy farming is just as cruel!!

[ijustwanttoaskaquestion]

lmao at the sheep walking off cliffs, I think we should set them up as politicians - we might have more luck as a country

Morloth, it might be good practice to "do them" seprately, i totally agree, but from what i have seen on the tv (so it must be true!) that isnt often the case, even in well run slaughter houses. Correct me if im wrong

I do take issue with your dumbness argument though - just because there is limited intellect that doesn't mean an animal or person for that matter, doesnt feel pain, fear, emotion etc. Besides, lambs are cute so therein lies my argument ;)

[mayorquimby]

just from the list of atrocities there are awful ones about animals being kicked but theirs some others which i don't understand what their complaints are

"Pigs and sheep going to the knife without adequate stunning
Pigs and sheep stunned and then allowed to come round again "
so on the one hand they're complaining when the stun doesn't work and they're killed but also when the stun doesn't work and they wait for the animal to come round.

"A sheep too sick to stand ? or possibly already dead ? being brought to slaughter in a wheelbarrow "
why is the possibly dead in bold?surely that would make it better? what would be wrong with a dead sheep in a wheel barrow

"Pigs falling from the slaughter line into the blood pit and being dragged out and re-shackled while other pigs look on "
wtf is this about?what are they meant to do?leave the carcass in there to rot? tell the other pigs to look away if they're easily offended?do you really reckon the other pigs are looking on thinking "well this is just not cricket"?

[Morloth]

Yes, I never said that I thought that the practice showed in the video was in anyway acceptable.

Just that I believe the vast majority of people know about such practices and don't actually care. So these threads that set out to shock don't really do so. Other's on this thread have commented that they saw similar footage 20 years ago, you would have to have been living under a rock to not have some idea of how animals are treated in mass slaughterhouses. Nothing has changed, people know, they just don't care.

I like quality meat, so my preference is for meat from the family station, if I can't get that then I will buy free range/organic, if it is available.

Was raised to not get emotional over animals, even pets, it is a pointless and potentially heartbreaking activity.

[ijustwanttoaskaquestion]

fleshwound, i half agree with you - but i dont eat meat because i dont WANT to eat it, yes, because of welfare issues. Its not a big deal to me not to eat meat, i thought it would be, its not - i dont miss it, the smell of bacon sandwhiches makes me want to puke now lol. Its easy to be veggie, but less easy to be a vegan. It doesnt have to be all or nothing though and lets face it, my veggieness makes not a jot of difference one way or t'other.

[Morloth]

Bad idea to slaughter and eat an animal that is already dead mayorquimby you can't be sure exactly what it died from.

They should ensure that the animals don't fall from the slaughter line.

[Rhubarb]

My dh worked on a sheep farm in Australia and on one occasion they did their patrols and found all the sheep dead in the field, they had become dehydrated and died of thirst.

There was a huge trough full of water in the other field.

What they had done was to wander through a large gap in the fence into the next field, then none of them could find the gap to get back into their field where the water was, even though the gap was quite obvious.

[Rhubarb]

[ilovemydogandmrobama]

Am about GentleOtter's comments. So, what does it take for 'British' meat to be called such?

[ijustwanttoaskaquestion]

Ah, morloth, thats an interesting comment, because i have often had this discussion with DP about shooting and fishing. I have always been a bit about it as i would worry that i was eating something with some minging disease or something, because how would you know??

[Morloth]

I think they just have to joint it/butcher it/repackage it? in the UK, then they can whack a sticker on it saying "Produced in the UK".

[Morloth]

If it is running about quite happily before getting shot/caught ijustwanttoaskaquestion then it is probably just fine.

Almost certainly "cleaner" than a animal raised in an intensive farming situation.

[ijustwanttoaskaquestion]

hmmm maybe i should get a gun after all lol. I had pigeon once, that was nice - gawd it stunk though.

[pumpkinpasties]

my dad is a hunting/shooting/fishing chap, which always thought was really cruel, but lately i've come to realise that it is more humane to shoot a duck which has had a free range life, compared to an intensivly reared chicken.
hugh fernly-wittingstall has it right with his chicken out campagne.
now i will only eat free range chicken, and i limit my red meat intake.

[Rollmops]

piratecat, as you say -every living creature deserves respect- does that generous policy of yours extend to rats, creepy-crawlies etc. Just curious.

[Rhubarb]

[Ripeberry]

You talk of decent human beings. Anyone who works in a Slaughterhouse does it as a VERY last resort because there is no other work around and they have to earn money to feed themselves or their famillies.
Anyone who WANTS to work there is a bit sick in the head to be honest
In the end, these animals are going to die anyway, there is no 'good' gentle death for animals or people for that matter.
And any sick or injured animals won't be used for food, but they will still get killed but their life was for nowt.
People have always kept animals or hunted animals and will continue in the future.
We are not all going to be tree hugging, lets get rid of all farm animals.

[RockinSockBunnies]

YANBU. I became a vegetarian six months ago because I did not want to be a part of the hypocrisy surrounding meat-eating.

I always bought free-range/organic and supported the Chicken Out campaign etc. But I finally had some time on my hands and decided to phone the meat suppliers to ask how their animals were killed. I spoke to people at places like Abel & Cole to determine what 'standard' of death organic meat had (was it killed on the farm, taken to an abbatoir etc?).

Essentially, whilst organic animals have a better standard of life, they have no better standard of death. It's just as ghastly (though to be fair, some organic animals are killed on-site, rather than transported, which is marginally better). I decided at that point that I could no longer be such a hypocrite and salve my conscience by buying organic. If I reared, cared for and slaughtered the animals myself, then I would perhaps feel happier in eating meat. As it is, I don't feel happy passing the buck and letting someone else do all the horror, enabling me to have 'tasty' meat, nicely packaged and leaving no trace that this was a living, breathing creature.

People have become so far removed from nature and the process of animal rearing that few give a second thought as to how the sausage/steak/chicken has ended up on their plate. I think we have a responsibility to examine the whole process, from start to finish, before deciding whether we should actually be continuing to support such an industry.

[pumpkinpasties]

did you know global warming wouldn't be an issue if cows were extinct?

[Morloth]

Good, my house is feckin' freezing at the moment, global warming sounds fine, when can we expect it?