in thinking that this behaviour in British slaughterhouses is horrific and needs to be stopped?

[Vallhala]

www.animalaid.org.uk/h/n/NEWS/pr_factory//2188//

I haven't seen the film footage as I can't face it. FYI I don't eat meat (for animal welfare reasons) but this isn't designed to convert others or to spark yet another veggie vs meat-eater debate.

Its to ask whether any decent human being would think these practices reasonable or acceptable and to pray to goodness that those who don't will forward the link to their MPs/press contacts/whoever in order to obtain tighter legislation and closer surveillance on what goes on in our slaughterhouses.

This is surely so wrong... or AIBU?

[Nekabu]

The British public dare to complain because that is illegal over here! If someone is breaking the rules governing slaughter houses then that is a different matter to there not being the rules in the first place and for it to be standard practise.

There was a worker in an abbatoir recently who was found to be causing unneccesary suffering by not following the strict guidelines, he was sacked and I believe prosecuted for causing suffering.

[itsmeolord]

How many of you have been to a slaughterhouse? I have been to quite a few, most slaughterhouses are well run and their practices ensure humane treatment and slaughter of animals.

The ones that aren't can be reported and they are clamped down on pretty quickly.
An article like the one linked to is great for sensationalising things, did the people who were secretly filming go to the proper agencies afterwards though?
Name and shame the bad ones.

Its a bit like filming a car theft, then writing an article saying how awful it is, look at what goes on, but not actually going to the police about it.

[Morloth]

That sort of thing really isn't on.

I have killed and butchered my own meat and been knee deep in blood. Meat eating and death doesn't bother me but it can be done quickly and cleanly with much better results as far as hygeine and taste goes.

As Riven says how much care and attention is paid to cleanliness in such places?

Most of my concern isn't for the animal suffering but for the effect that has on our food chain.

[Emprexia]

sensationalist clap-trap, designed to pull at the heartstrings and cooked up by idiots like PETA.

Yes, bad practise happens, and its dealt with.. just like restuarants with bad hygiene, breeders with bad practice..etc.

The vast majority of the meat on our shelves is killed within the guidelines and laws laid down to regulate the industry.

YANBU to think its horrific when it happens, because it is.. but beyond that, quite frankly.. i dont give a toot as long as its dead when i eat it.

[sparechange]

I've watched most of that film and I can't say it has put me off meat or shocked me wildly.

In fact, if after watching 1,000 hours of footage, that is the worst they can find, I'm not sure the slaughter industry is that bad.

If you watch countryfile, the sheep are just as desperate to escape the farmer when he comes to check them or sheer them, so I don't think the bit at the beginning is proof they are aware of their fate and trying to run away - I suspect that is just what sheep do when they are in a confined space with a human.

[piratecat]

what's on it? I am too scared to look.

[Morloth]

Sheep are dumb, it always amuses me when people talk about them having emotions and thoughts, was raised with the stupid things and have never seen anything that makes me think of them as anything other than thick as a couple of bricks.

Pigs might, but my experience of those is as malevolent bastards that you keep the kids the hell away from and who escape and go feral and then come back and kill the sheep.

[piratecat]

but surely animals have a fight or flight reflex, and deserve to die in a controlled way, hygenic way ) if i was a meat eater i'd def want this).

I had a pet sheep once, was def not totally dumb!

[ijustwanttoaskaquestion]

There are some really upsetting comments on this thread. I think it is complete ignorance that people make such trite comments about not giving a fuck where their meat has come from etc. Its a bit of a niave, head in the sand attitude.

I have recently gone veggie because i dont thin that animal welfare is up to scratch in british farms and not all of the meat on the supermarket shelf is brittish anyway so i shudder to think. The slaughter process itself is the least of the problem, however, what put me off meat eating is the simple fact that they slaughter animals in front of each other. The argument that OK we should put our money where our mouths are is moot. Our thoughts were, OK, we dont like this factory farming conveyer belt production of meat so we will go organic, freedome food, local supplier route - we just couldnt afford it. For a while we continued eating meat but then just made a change.

I probably would eat meat if i could raise it and kill it myself, but thats not practical for us, also i would probably become attached to the animal and wouldnt be able to kill it. I would however quite happily go and shoot myself a rabbit and eat it (if i had a gun licence and could actually shoot!) because i would reason that the animal had freedom and died humanely (i would have to be pretty damn sure i could do the job quickly and efficiently though). We are, after all carnivores ande it is perfectly natural that we do eat meat - but it is society that has made me unable to continue to do so as i am not happy about the way it is produced.

As it turns out, we have been veggie for six months now and i didnt think wed manage, but im loving it - our diet is far more varied and healthy than it ever was and we feel better for it.

The thing is, we shoudlnt have to pay a premium for food that has been produced humanely and with respect for an animals life and its natural behaviour patterns etc. That is a bit non-sensical if you ask me.

[wingandprayer]

Sorry, entirely inappropiate, but LMAO at Morloth. Thanks for brightening my morning.

[ijustwanttoaskaquestion]

I had to laugh at the sheep are dumb so they dont matter comment - rotfl, that being the case, i could think of a few humans i would like to bump off, they are dumb, whats it matter.

[Morloth]

The thing about threads like this is they start off with the assumption that if people actually knew what was going on then they would do something.

This isn't correct, some (most maybe given the size of the meat industry) simply don't give a fuck and no amount of videos or talking about the inhumanity of it all is going to make any difference.

Most humans like to eat meat and we are (in general) not that choosey how that happens. Many people view this as a character flaw, I just see it as a cold hard reality of evolution.

People know they just don't care, the only way you are going to make them care is to make it relevant to them and even then there are going to be people that don't worry about the consequences (to themselves) of eating poor quality meat.

It just goes round and round and round. Soon the veggies will start using (what they think is) emotive language, like carcasses and deadflesh and the rest of it and then the meat eaters will respond with "mmmmm big juicy steaks" and off we will go.

We need a damned popcorn gif!

[Morloth]

ijustwanttoaskaquestion "I had to laugh at the sheep are dumb so they dont matter comment - rotfl, that being the case, i could think of a few humans i would like to bump off, they are dumb, whats it matter."

Me too, we just have to hope that Darwinism will triumph in the end.

[GentleOtter]

I cannot speak for all farms in the UK but certainly most Scottish farms fall under the Quality Meat Scotland Scheme whereby the standards of good hygiene and husbandry are very strict. Regular vet checks, QMS agent checks etc.
If you are not registered with the QMS scheme then you are not allowed to sell your animals.

My main concern is that the bulk of 'cheaper' meat comes from vast slaughterhouses in South America which follow different standards to British ones. This meat then gets shipped for packaging in the UK and can be misconstrued as being labelled 'British Meat'.

It is a fact of life that many people do not give much thought to the life or death of the animal unless it is brought to public attention by eg Hugh Fearnley- Whittinstall and the chicken campaign.

[itsmeolord]

Darwinism or Darwinists? There is a difference.

I don't subscirbe to the animals are dumb so what if we kill them.

I do however think the op is unneccessarily sensationalist and like Morloth, have noted that over 1000 hrs of video were shot to get a small amount of wrong doing.

[Rhubarb]

I eat meat and have long since known about these practices. In fact when I left school I was put onto a YTS course in Animal Welfare and they taught us all about battery hens; chickens not being able to move and getting crushed; lambs bleating in terror; hens having their throats cut whilst still alive etc etc. That was (ahem) 20 years ago and nothing has changed.

I think the workers get insensitised to it all and no longer see the animals as living creatures at all. In their minds that animal is already just a piece of meat. Perhaps they need to have that mindset in order to work in an environment like that, I don't know.

Yes it is appauling and yes these animals should be treated with dignity and respect to the very end, and in most cases they are. The footage was taken from 3 slaughterhouses across the UK, no doubt they already knew what to expect from those 3. BUT this is not a reflection on the meat industry as a whole.

[GentleOtter]

You can bet your bottom dollar that those three slaughterhouses have inspectors and the Animal Welfare people investigating immediately.

[ijustwanttoaskaquestion]

i certainly dont think that meat eating is a personality flaw, however, i had to walk away from a woman the other day who was putting non free range eggs in her basket, and found myself scowling at her in the checkout queue - lol, i thought everyone bought free range eggs these days.

[ijustwanttoaskaquestion]

I used to be an animals rights "campaigner" as a teenager, hence the quotes - you know how it is when you are 17! The thing is, it was organisations like animal aid that made me no longer want to be involved as they are over emotive and sensationalist - i want facts, not horror tactics.

[Morloth]

I don't think I said that they should be Riven just commenting to the poster who said they had complex emotions etc.

I think you absolutely do become desensitised when working in such an environment and I believe the reason I see this so differently from many of the posters on Mumsnet is where and how I was raised.

[piratecat]

morloth you post about how sheep are dumb etc... is ignorant. Surely any living creature deserves respect.

it's a totally different vibe to what you were saying in your more recent post. I really don't care wether meat eaters eat meat or not, and I get your points. I just don't get your sweeping statements about some animals being too dumb to notice.

[piratecat]

I was raised on a small farm, where we reared and killed our stock.