I can't undestand all the hatred for Paris on MN

[2026IsMyYear]

Just that really - i just don't recognise the Paris that people post about on here!

I have been many many times & spent a month there not too long ago

I adore it & would happily consider living there.

So much to see & do, so much history & beauty

I am obsessed with modernism & early 20th century literary history. There are amazing museums, galleries & libraries. Love the flea markets & clothes & shoe shops.

Great food & wine!

I've never found it smelly (certainly no worse than major UK cities) & i have never felt intimidated or been followed etc

I am now in my 50s & a v seasoned savvy traveller & I've been visiting Paris since i was 20.

I adore it but often feel like an outlier here!

If you try to be friendly and polite they are the same. If you do not make an effort they think you’re rude.
I think this is the problem. They seem to come from a mind-set that it's up to you to impress them. Most other people come from a mind-set that most individuals are OK, unless/until they prove otherwise.

Yes, and this isn’t a new thing — in What Katy Did Next (1886), Katy notices the formal greetings of the hotel employees by French people on her first day in France. (Though Katy is with many Mners in disliking Paris!)

Ah well yes, ‘French teenage school group chicken’ is a bit of a tougher game than ‘patriarchy chicken’ tbf😂

Paris is fine as a city, there's beautiful bits and not so nice bits just like any big city. The problem is it's always romanticised to the max on TV as being the epitome of fashion, quaint cobbled streets, that stereotypical french accordion music etc. So inevitably people go there expecting that and are disappointed when it's mostly just a normal European city!

It has never occurred to me that saying ‘bon jour’ might be considered an effort or impressive! It’s normal in any language or country to use some sort of pleasantry. I’m pretty sure my interactions were equally civil whether I started with Bon jour or hello.

@ErrolTheDragon 80 euros we were charged to get to Notre dam

You mean British?

Quite. Saying hello in whatever language is basic civility surely?! Maybe these people experiencing rudeness are the unaware ones meting it out…

I love Paris, lived in France for a year in my late teens and then again a few years later, visited often. A lot of French people where I lived hated Paris though too!

Loved Dublin when I visited a few years back.

Also really enjoy my trips to London, thought Venice was breathtaking, rarely if ever have I been somewhere I outright hated.

Maybe I'm easily pleased, though I tend to go to places open to being pleased too!

The problem is that they are allowed to breed.
😉😁.

Me too. I think some people just aren’t happy unless they can find something to criticise or moan about.

But why is it up to us to say bon jour first? If they are so keen on the bon jour then why don't they say it first?
It's such a weird thing to get pissy about.

For the avoidance of doubt, if I'm out on a country walk I always say hello to people. I don't wait for them to say it first.

From gare de nord? Are you sure it was a proper taxi (G7)? We went to and from gare de nord to more or less the left bank side of the Pont Neuf for under €20 a trip inc tip.

I’m pretty sure that on entering cafes or paying for groceries there was a good chance they’d say Bon jour first. 🤷‍♀️

It’s just based on each persons experience. It’s like anything in life.

My first time in Paris was awful. We were followed by older, scary men, barked and hissed at, asked if we were prostitutes, my friend was groped whilst waiting for a train. I found it to be quite a cold , unfriendly place in general. Naturally, my opinion of the city wasn’t favourable. Why would it be!?

I visited again for work many years later and thankfully didn’t have to put up with creeps following me around. I saw through fresh eyes, some lovely buildings and coffee shops but other than that, I’m not really bothered about it, it’s not somewhere I think about.

Non-Parisian French people often find Parisians rude - at least that’s been my experience. In the area we most often visit, not far from Dijon, people are usually extremely pleasant and polite.

I have more than once met Parisians on holiday - perfectly pleasant to me and dh but revealing extreme snobbery as regards others, and in which arrondisement (sp?) aka Paris postcode, they lived.

Another was when we were on a very small (2 cabs) tour of part of Syria (ages ago) where the only others were a middle aged Parisian lady, and two other middle-aged French women, who were great fun, but who I can only really describe as the French equivalent of a pair of Blackpool landladies out on a spree.

Madame Parisienne would have nothing to do with them! She clearly thought them utterly common, and always made a point of getting into the cab with me and dh, rather than with them! Needless to say, dh and I were (quietly) highly amused.

Agree. There are plenty of quiet towns and villages to go to to suit their desires. Maybe they like wasting their money to moan and cement their views.

As for the famous Parisian rudeness, I’ve also never experienced it.

Same. When I was in Paris, people helped me carry a stroller up stairs. Shop owners smiled at me and greeted me warmly. I greeted and spoke French even though I’m still learning and was nervous and they were kind about it.

Saying that, I did research culture and etiquette beforehand because I had heard they were and found it no different than being in another major city which I don’t find rude and know what to expect.

I do think some are acting as if there aren’t rude people here when there are plenty. There are rude people everywhere.

@2026IsMyYear I love Paris too and interestingly I also love modernism and 20th century literary history - maybe there's a connection there for how we perceive it! I think if you love architecture, art, history, cities generally (lots of people just don't like cities) then Paris is a great place to visit.

@senua It is just a really ingrained thing in France - you say Bonjour/Bonsoir whenever you enter a shop/bar/hotel/bus even if you are just browsing or passing through. If they say it first you always respond. If you don't observe that you will be regarded as really rude.

Not doing it is like not observing queue etiquette in the UK.

Not doing it is like not observing queue etiquette in the UK.
I get your point but the equivalence doesn't stack up. Queuers are equal but vendors/buyers are not.
They can stand on their customs if they want, it's their country after all, but to get pissy with tourists is not great customer service. Someone mentioned up above above a hotel being shut at lunchtime. We've had similar: after years of holidaying in France in August (peak season / school hols) and finding the place SHUT we gave up and now go to places that are happy to see us and are open.
<gallic shrug>

Yeah - August in France - stuff is going to be shut. It is just the way it is.

What on earth do you mean about queuers being equal but vendors/ buyers aren’t? I hope I’ve misunderstood but that sounds like an attitude of superiority towards people serving you.

They do seem remarkably angry about the expectation that customers observe basics customs of politeness towards staff.

And nobody shows their underwear on purpose in the UK?