Part time workers and bank holidays. Fair or unfair?

[crunchiesnuts]

I know that it’s completely legal and up to the employer, but I’m just curious about what people think about this.

I’m part of a small team (there are 7 of us in total). Everyone works full time, 5 days a week, except for one person who is part time, working 3 days a week. This person works Monday-Wednesday. When there’s a bank holiday, they switch their days and work from Tuesday to Thursday instead. Like I said, I know this is all above board and our manager is fine with it, but the rest of the team feels it’s a bit unfair since they don’t have a say and have to use their annual leave regardless.

I’m kind of torn on it. I know this person asked to work Mondays when she took the job, so it feels a bit like having the best of both worlds, but I also get not wanting to burn through almost all your annual leave just for the bank holidays. Recently, this person has mentioned how she doesn’t complain about the fact that the rest of us get more holidays and better pay (which is a bit confusing since we work more hours, so naturally, we would), but it’s stirred up some tension in the office, and I guess, some people think she’s rubbing it in their face. I’m just interested in hearing what others think. Even though it’s legal, do you see it as fair or unfair?

She’s worse off because she doesn’t get that day in lieu if all you guys are having to work a bank holiday, so she’s actually short changing herself. But can I say that being a part timer amongst full time workers who are bitter is horrible. We had a workplace survey to fill out and found it on my desk when as I worked Wednesday - Friday. I picked it up and asked what it was about and someone said office re-furb where we can have input on what we’d like it to look like and seating arrangements. To have a colleague saying I shouldn’t get a say & she’d also say I should have last dibs on booking annual leave. I was only allowed part time because I had a baby and they had to accommodate my request. However, they didn’t reduce my work load. My customers would be told to ring me when I was in & whilst people had time to chat and giggle I had to put my head down and catch up. I never complained. When someone was on annual leave we would have to cover those people’s work load between us and that was also ready and waiting for me on my days, yet my annual leave never got covered unless it was urgent.

when it came to my appraisal my manager actually apologised to me saying the way I’m treated by the others was horrendous and she would vouch for me if I wanted to take it up with HR. I understood why my workload wasn’t lessened because that would have been unfair to make others busier to make my life easier, but what I didn’t appreciate was the assumption I was doing less and getting more

The more you post the more this sounds like the normal confected whinging about part timers (who are disproportionately women).

The part timer is getting exactly the same holiday entitlement as everyone else on a pro rata basis.
Your business (based on your posts) is a Monday to Friday operation at least for your team and is shut or largely shut on weekends and the BH Mondays.

It doesn’t take a genius IQ to work out there are business advantages to having the part timer be flexible and offer a normal days work on the Thursday rather than wfh with limited scope on Monday just for the sake of a BH. It makes business sense to get the full three days of normal working.
That is very different from an entire team randomly electing to work on BHs in a business which is normally closed, just as when it suits them (not to mention a lot more holiday to accommodate at other times of year). Do they think people should randomly elect to WFH on Saturdays to rack up extra hols? Its a logical extension.

Your colleagues are whining because she doesn’t have to take a disproportionate chunk of her leave as BHs which would disadvantage her compared to the rest of the team.

Your team need more to do if they have time for this kind of nonsense.

But is your employer open a standard Monday to Friday? As if so, when are you all expecting to be able to swap the day to? You can’t work a Saturday or a Sunday, and your full time hours are Monday to Friday. It isn’t hard to see that there isn’t another day. The part time worker could swap other days, it’s one of the benefits of working part time. If I’ve had the kids school events on one of my working days I’ve made up my hours on my non-working day. Full time staff can’t do that, because there isn’t another day in the week for them where they don’t work and the business is open. It’s…just common sense really.

Its not exactly new news that part time working gives you more flexibility but less money and career progression opportunities.

Surely that's the trade off people choose to make.

Full timers have the same options available to them if they are willing to give up the full rime wage.

You don't get 28 days PLUS bank holidays. They don't need to do that legally and they can force you to use your holiday allowance to cover for them.

Oh that's helpful to hear about other sectors than the one I work in. We get 20 working days annual leave (so 4 weeks) + Bank Holidays. So I suppose if they amalgamated the two categories, that might end up the same amount of annual leave.

Are there some places where people get almost 6 weeks' annual leave?? I can see why that includes Bank Holidays.

So you think it’s fairer for her to use 3.2 days of her 12 days of non BH annual leave to cover the other parts of the bank holidays?

That would leave her with less than 9 days a year of annual leave that she can actually control, less than half of what you all get.

I think your employer has handled this very fairly tbh.

I actually despair if HR or any line manager or office business would be so prescriptive.... As far as the part-time and their work is concerned it makes absolutely no difference. Of those 5 manditory Stat Leave Days a good few of them are probably Christmas and New Year... For which the part-time worker will have to contribute part of their AL if it falls that way, so only fair they get to gain them back on the Monday bank hols.

The whole premise of the thread is so mean spirited.

I'm in private sector I get 30 days annual leave plus 8 public holidays plus a "birthday" day - so 39 days

The Scottish Civil Service starts at 25 days plus 11.5 public holidays rising to 32 days plus 11.5 public holidays. so 36.5 to 43.5

Yes it is annoying. We have similar in my department where a part time worker never has to use any of her allocated BH days so has an extra week to take over the year. We also don't have any choice, if we did I would save mine too & take the hours when it suits me but we can't. She is also allowed to swap her days at Christmas etc to make them her days off rather than using any annual leave at all. So essentially gets the benefit of all the public holidays as days off then all her annual leave at a time of her choosing. But I don't pay her wages so none of my business really.. but yes, it is annoying for the rest of us.

Generally because often people think full timers have it easier.

They work 60% of the week and get 60% of your pay, so you are being very unreasonable

ALL ? Or six of you talking about someone else behind her back? I am pretty sure that is how it panned out.

Next time why not ask her how her working days/ bank holidays/ annual leave is worked out and give her a chance to explain it in very simple words and diagrams so that you all understand.

So you have to use a day out if your entitlement for bank holidays?

Your employer should not include bank hols in the entitlement if they are not operating and they don’t want people work. Most places are 25 days plus bank hols (for example). That would solve the issue you’ve described.

otherwise, yes it’s a bit annoying but I wouldn’t get too upset about it.

Half term has brought the mn bitches out in force. Part timer shouldn't have the option to swap the days and bank all the extra holidays to take when it suits. I'd be annoyed about it aswell.

But you're full time...? So its totally different to being part time. Why aren't people getting this?

I’ve read the whole thread and still none the wiser what the drama is about.

Recently, this person has mentioned how she doesn’t complain about the fact that the rest of us get more holidays and better pay (which is a bit confusing since we work more hours, so naturally, we would),

PPs saying that @crunchiesnuts is petty & mean to her p-t colleague: did you see this? The part-time colleague's really stupid comments on the "advantage" of her full-time colleagues was the thing that kicked off this discussoon .

Basically that a part timer should be subject to the same restrictions as a full timer but for a lot less pay. That's what I've got from it. Or that by magic another day should be added between Monday and Friday so the full timers can have the best of both worlds.

Essentially yes.

One way to look at is if full time staff get 28 days leave inc bank holidays they get to choose 4 full weeks off (20 days) plus the pre determined bank holidays. If someone works 3 days they have a pro rated allowance of 16.8 days including PH’s and is affected by what days they fall on - they aren’t all Mondays, up to 4 a year could be on different days depending on how Xmas/NY falls. With pro rated holidays for part time if the business is closed on bank holidays so they can’t work, that part time person won’t have enough holiday to choose 4 weeks off (12 days). Do people think that is fair?

I work part time in a small business and managed to negotiate pro rated holiday plus all the public holidays so I still get to choose 4 weeks off.

Bank holidays should not be part of Annual Leave entitlement.
So the full-timers are getting several days off against the part-timers 0.

Well personally I think it's petty and I wouldn't have got involved in the discussion beyond shrugging.

Sounds very petty to me.

It’s not fair!! What are your colleagues,12???
If your part timer worked only Tues, Weds after a bank holiday they’d probably complain that they’re only working a two day week. They’re working their full week and taking the bank holiday at another more convenient time. They’re not gaining anything contrary to what your co workers think. They need to grow up.

I’ve been retired a few years so things may have changed but when I worked for my local council, part timers and job share used to get bank holidays pro rata. If it fell on their working day they had to pay back the hours through A/L or work extra hours. If not on their working day they had the hours credited to A/L. We were all on flexible time so it wasn’t difficult to make up the time.

I think your colleague is worse off than you as if she is working an extra day she doesn’t get any bank holiday