Employers hell bent on working in the office full time

[NewDayNewLife25]

Anyone else currently job searching and noticed the same thing?

I'm utterly miserable in my current role which is unfortunate as I've been there for 4 years and use to love it, but a new manager has changed things. I've always worked from home.

Anyway, I've been applying for jobs, mainly remote/hybrid working but also a few office based roles. I always state in my cover letter what I'm looking for, and my address is on my CV too.

A few employers have contacted me, saying that I'm perfect for the role, have all the experience/skills that's required and that they think I would make a great addition to the team. But as soon as I've asked about the working set up, that's it, done. They won't entertain it and decline my application.

I just think it's a shame. I know that they probably have plenty of applications, but surely it's more important to hire the right person, with the right skills and experience. Not just because that person happens to live near the office. Half the time they can't even explain why they need the person in the office. Is it control?

I'm fed up already!

What "windowless office where nobody is allowed to make a noise"??

I work in my dining room with French doors overlooking my back garden. It's a much nicer environment than sitting like sardines in an office surrounded by dirty city streets and noisy traffic! I can see my snowdrops. primroses, daffodils etc etc as the seasons change. We've bird feeders and I can see a wide variety of birds that visit them. To my right, I can see my front garden.

I have my cats for company! DH works in the kitchen, so no issue with noise for either of us.

Genuine question, if it’s that dreadful why stay? If you want a better work life/balance why not change your lifestyle to enable this.

I worked in awful places with the most narcissistic bosses. I got out of those jobs and found something that worked better for me, I didn’t expect an entire business to fit around me, to be honest didn’t want to give them the opportunity lol.

Mainly because I'm in my fucking 60s lol, I want to build up my pension, and nobody else would have me at my age!!

Plus WTH would I move anywhere else now that I can wfh FT?! I'd be out of my mind!

@YourArtfulPlayer Very few employers where I live seem to have nice offices. If they spend money on offices they are open plan with at best cubicles. If they do not spend money on offices, they are smaller offices that were last decorated last century and are a bit grungy.
At home I have my own study, with a window, the radio on, and nicely decorated.

You need to look up what ‘as opposed’ means

But if that’s your personal preference because an office doesn’t suit you, then that’s absolutely okay. But it doesn’t mean an employer and a business has to flex around you.

Op you sound experienced and in a potentially quite senior role - how are you approaching the hybrid request? Are you putting it forward as a request/demand only or are you selling it, as part of a wider proposal and sell of why you are right for the role and what you being hybrid offers that employer as a positive and constructive contribution, do you put forward a bigger picture? Convincing the employer it's far better for them and achieves more for them by you in particular.

Many employers are open to 3/2 day split, mine included. But when speaking with applicants that have worked fully at home for a good while we are not as receptive to requests for hybrid as frankly we don't overly have much confidence the applicant is being sincere or appreciates that there are some downsides to being fully wfh eg ability and involvement with junior staff for training etc, the difference some face to face contact time with the team actually makes.

If going from a current full wfh role to a role advertised as in-office you need to sell the idea of a half way position. If it doesn't feel like a demand and is sold as a "why you and a hybrid set up" is perfect for them that is far more convincing and will distract the employer from the (sorry but very valid in my experience) concerns and suspicions many have of people that have been fully wfh. And I'm not talking about people wfh stretching things and taking liberties with flexibility to do the school pick up etc, most don't really care about that, but from a business it's the difference in communication and engaging with other employees etc, it is simply not the same as working in person too for at least some of the time. Sell the benefit of a mix of both so that's it's foolish to refuse it

I have all those at home - and much nicer!

I don't have to share a manky fridge with the rest of the office!!!

We weren't allowed a microwave until a colleague took the matter into his own hands and bought one!

Yep you think businesses should just make life as shit for its employees as possible

Really odd to be honest. I manage a large team and we will never go back to full time in the office. We do 1-2 days a week in office at most with some teams just in a few days a month all together. I often contribute and attend industry events and the companies that are ‘back to the office’ tend to have poor systems, old fashioned culture and to be honest managers that aren’t that great and seem to really dislike people generally. I can see when people are ‘on the keys’ remotely if needed and have great data, targets and KPIs. You don’t need more than once a week ‘eyes on’ people to be aware of their mental health status and needs. Hybrid working is great all round if you have the right tools

But if you're going to make that comparison... some employers DON'T offer maternity pay (apart from statutory which is law). Just as some employers don't offer WFH. Many employees 'shop around' for an employer that offers a decent maternity package... just as some employees shop around for a job that allows them to WFH.

So then technically your employer is enabling you to retire and saving you from the hassle of finding a new job. That means you’ve struck a mutually beneficial arrangement 😅

Trust me, I don't need to look anything up. How rude and aggressive!

The business isn't "flexing around me" - a new agile working policy was agreed and implemented implemented by our director, and I like it! OK???!

Yep, and what of it?

I do a fair day's work for a fair-ish day's pay. I pay into my pension, my employer pays into my pension.

Where do you think I'd find a job at a decent level in my 60s? Have you seen the ageism there is out there, including regularly on this site?

What is your problem?!

That’s your personal preference. Some people thrive in busy offices with everyone around them. Who should the employer support?

You're just arguing for the sake of it now.

If you won’t work in the office then you aren’t the perfect candidate

You signed the contract with them knowing the environment, pay and conditions. In that contract you said between set hours you would do a job in return for the far-ish pay.

So what’s your problem… your employers have given you a job, fulfilled their contractual obligations which means you can pay into your pension etc and ignored the ageism out there.

Really I’m not though. I’m just pointing out not everyone wants to be you.

There’s a thread in Chat right now where people are discussing WFH in bed. I feel like these back-to-the-office employers might have a point.

It’s not sour grapes at all it’s the employer’s prerogative to rule you out if you’re not going to fit in with what they require that’s usually how employment works. Some people on here moan there job no longer fits in with childcare school runs etc. now employers want them back in I’m just saying they are allowed to request that doesn’t mean you have to apply or accept this.

So I’m rude and aggressive because you don’t like my response to your question. Okay.

That’s great you have a situation and a job that suits you. Doesn’t make it appropriate for every other business in the UK or worker. Okay!!

And 5 years ago they changed the goalposts? So what?

I've no idea what point you are even trying to make?

Well if they are failing to produce outcomes, then the employer needs to do with it.

If they can carry out the duties of their role, what does it matter if they're working from bed or sitting on the loo?!

Can you point out where I said that? Because I am pretty damn certain I did not! I actually said that there are roles within my organisation where wfh just isn't possible!

I described your post as rude and aggressive because it is.

My answer to that would be a question - would you go on a teams call from your bed?