October budget going to be painful

[increasinglyconcerned]

Here we go..... I knew it. Labour were promising not to hike our taxes in the election campaign and here we are.... apparently they discovered £22 billion black hole in his first weeks in the role and it's not his fault.

Let me guess, those of us who earn six figures and already pay 45% will pay EVEN more and take home even less. It's the hard workers who will take the brunt. What's the point in working anymore!

I earn a little over £120k and I'm taxed the same as those earrings £500k.

Before people jump in saying they don't feel sorry for me, I work full time to support my family, as of January I will have 2 DCs in nursery, plus my mortgage and get ZERO free hours childcare, whilst they keep promising free childcare but I just pay more for everyone else to benefit.

I cannot afford to pay more taxes to fix this country and especially when so many people are getting a free ride and not paying their way, ranging from millionaires with tax havens to those claiming benefits dishonestly.

I wouldn't turn it down.

I wouldn't bitch and whinge that I'd be better off on benefits either.

Imagine saying something like this to a low earner, people would be crying all shades of how unfair that is to say. Should have chosen a better job, not had children you couldn't afford.

The difference is people who have children while not working and on benefits are not actually providing for their kids - it's the state, and the taxpayer.

Given how expensive childcare is when you earn over the free hours entitlement it's almost impossible to send more than one or two children to full time childcare while you keep working.

And I would question why we think families who do not contribute to society have more of an entitlement to have a second, third, or fourth child than families who do contribute.

I'd rather see my taxes go to funding more childcare spaces at a subsidised rate (like other European countries) than being put in the bank account of the perennially unemployed.

My sister and I went to the same school. So until we were 16, we had the same education.

We are very different people. I excelled academically and even now could probably take an exam and pass with very little prep/effort. She couldn't. I work in a very analytical and intellectual role. It pays well.

She tried an apprenticeship, as her GCSEs were not good enough to get into college. She struggled with the paperwork and couldn't get what she needed for the qualifications.

She left that and now works for just above minimum wage. It's not from lack of trying but more because the way we are assessed for our capabilities can very much dent some people's confidence. So then the idea of retraining or upskilling becomes impossible.

Doesn't stop people being hard workers. Doesn't mean they aren't contributing to society. It's just that society places value on different things. Often the wrong things.

My role is mentally quite challenging. But in the grand scheme of whether it's important to society, it's not. But I get paid more than, for example, many nurses. Definitely more than carers. Should I? I think I am definitely worth what I get paid but I also think that some roles that are more important are vastly underpaid.

Suggesting that someone isn't working hard enough to change their financial situation is just rude, TBH, and shows a huge lack of awareness.

Why are you guessing what the October budget will say. As in the quotes I see are that it won't impact national insurance or income tax or the pension triple lock.
It sounds more like welfare cuts, spending cuts and fiddling around with VAT and capital gains and inheritance.
I'm not saying you won't be affected by these things but your current tax burden was from the Tories.

Nurses nor teachers earn a pittance, and support with childcare costs, housing costs, UC top up is available to people on low wages.

I also don't get this about the hardest workers- someone earning a high salary hasn't ended up there by accident, they don't just sit around twiddling their thumbs all day. Most jobs are challenging in different ways.

Labour want to try to sort out some of the mess the Tories left public services in eg prisons/NHS.
If funding is increased there will be decent state school options for everyone so once you are out of the nursery years you will benefit from free education for all your DC plus healthcare & public services.

You might not think that those services benefit you as you are wealthy but if there's poor healthcare then the plebs will be in slums spreading diseases which will affect you, the criminals who should be in prison/rehab will be breaking into your home, stealing your car, making the streets unsafe so your kids can't go out.

I work hard too & accept that I will put more into the system than I take out in order to benefit the wider society. A failing society with people in poverty, out of work due to treatable & avoidable illness/disabilities caused by poor health & social care, criminals not rehabbed/punished , kids not in school due to untreated MH or SEN affects everyone including the wealthy.

Ok then 🙄

I can't even afford a new oven at the minute. I know it isn't a race to the bottom but geez sorry if my heart isn't bleeding for you.
I'd love to be in a privileged enough position to be able to pay that much tax - and yes I'm well aware it takes a lot of hard work to get to that for most people.

In my case it’s definitely not tax that caused it. It was burnout and mental health issues caused by working as a teacher for over 30 years. I once briefly paid higher rate tax on about £2.50 of my wages. I worked very hard, did a huge amount of good and now I can’t do it any more. Fairly certain that’s true of a lot of early retirees. I don’t claim any benefits though.

Sympathies OP. It isn’t fair.

OP, everyone is going to be hammered this time round, not just the higher tax payers. Labour have started the way they mean to go on.

I would recommend watching Gary Stevenson's YouTube channel. Wealth distribution is a problem in this country (as well as the world) with assets being concentrated in the hands of a few mega rich billionaires/families/trusts whilst the rest of us fight over what is left pushing prices further and further up.

You're probably right, taxguru, though personally I wouldn't want the current crop of Tories back either - not even with a shiny new leader and a futile promise that "lessons have been learned"

And BTW apologies; I see you responded before me about the cruise ship thing!

Im sick of all the tax we pay. Labor and tories are two sides of the same coin.

Aye, they should target those shouldn't they, and not people on what isn't even that high of a salary globally.

Tough. And your comment about only high earners are hard workers is disgusting.

A lot of people who wanted. Labour government also voted Lib Dem because in their constituency that was the candidate with a hope of getting the Tories out. There was so much tactical voting this time I don’t think you can draw many conclusions from voter numbers, just seats lost by Tories.

Would it be unfair or untrue to say that the vast majority of workers are NOT high earners and may contribute more due to volume?

Yes, it would be unfair

"The 10% of income taxpayers with the largest incomes contribute over 60% of income tax receipts."
CBP-8513.pdf (parliament.uk)

Top 10% is about 67k pa.

People on 40k or so are net recipients from the state.

I didn't google the numbers but I believe annual income and NI tax revenue is in the range on 800bn. 60% of it is 480bn.

Can you imagine just 10% of those high earners dropping their hours just one day a week? it's 9.6bn wiped out.

Before you jump that someone else will do these jobs - there is a massive skills shortage in the UK, this won't just happen and there will be knockdown effect with even less economic activity.

Yes maybe in a way, but if you end up in a nursing home that'll be costing circa £1k per week (todays average) so it makes sense to give the incentive now to save by not charging tax, because you will only get support for this once your savings are run down very low. So that is saving government money long term. If that makes sense.
Houses I disagree, yes maybe doubled in price but for them to move forward then the property they have to purchase will also have more than doubled. And it is inheritance of something we parents have slaved our guts out to pay for.
but - only my thoughts, I do pay tax and nobody ever has all the correct answers. Tax always hurts but keeps the country in a reasonable ish state.

Still don't get why they won't do a big windfall tax on these energy companies British gas etc make a massive profit. And cap their profits and cap how much they can add onto bills Energy companies can't go abroad as they supply here that and amazon etc that are really not paying fair

I would. I only pay £19 tax pm and don’t wish to pay more. Nor do I want to be away from my child more than I have to be.

Oh absolutely.

They pay more tax than any other sector already including a windfall tax

It's already happening

I hate to break it to you, but if you are going to refer to people on north of £120k as ‘the middle’ then nurses and teachers very much are paid a pittance. You can’t have it both ways. If £120k+ isn’t a high salary, then what teachers and nurses earn is definitely a low one.