Free breakfast clubs for ALL primary school children? Why?

[Safi7]

I’ve been overseas since the election so a bit out of the loop, but is it true that Labour are going to make it standard that all primary schools must now offer free breakfasts to all children, regardless of need?

Fair enough for children from deprived families - but all children?

Where is the money for this coming from?

Are Labour actually saying that in 2024, its now to much to expect parents to actually bother to feed their own children breakfast? This responsibility can just be pushed onto schools instead - as if they haven’t got enough on? Teachers are leaving in droves as it is. Du much is out in them - the jobs is becoming more like social work in too many cases. Who will staff these breakfast clubs and make sure kids are actually eating?

Surely this is just encouraging lazy parenting - ie parents who can well afford cereal / toast / eggs etc it but just won’t bother if their kids can eat at school instead. Plus children will be dumped at school earlier than necessary, just because parents can now get away with it?

Surely it’s better to direct resources where they are actually needed, rather than turn schools into free cafes? Makes no sense.

@Whatabonkersworld I do however thoroughly agree with you on that- I'm all for people spending their assets - we've made that clear to my FIL - and yet we rent and could certainly 'do' with an inheritance - my view is if he has more than a couple of hundred k to cover off any care needs ( and hopefully Labour will bring in the 80k limit as was proposed by the Tory's- but never enacted) then anything we get is very welcome - but it's not an entitlement. I'm very against a certain mindset that some over 65s have in going down the 'poor pensioners' route whilst sat on very substantial assets they refuse to use to enrich their life or maybe help other family not in that position at the point they need it most. My FIL gave my son the deposit for his rented flat and frequently helps him keep his car on the road etc- and my son in return drives 50 miles regularly for the day to see his much loved grandad. I do appreciate however some pensioners aren't in this position , especially if single or still renting or don't own a home outright- personally I would have made the limit £25k single or joint - but that may be hard to administer I know.

If they charged for it £7 a week for it, would you still use it?

“The best balance for me was part-time work which left me with enough energy to spend 2 full days doing fun things with my daughter.”

Maybe stop worrying about what other mums are doing and stop comparing it to want you couldn’t do.

I won't speak on breakfast clubs but I'm sorry I think it's a waste of money for everyone to get free school meals which is seen as a good idea on this site. It should just be for the poorer children.
As for this "stigma" people talk about nobody knows! My child gets free meals and it's all booked online. I doubt even the dinner ladies know

@FarmFlowers

Nope, because with four kids I couldn't afford it. We aren't eligible for FSM but an additional £28 a week would be beyond my financial means at the moment.

My children love it and the staff encourage children to come.

I don't know the particulars of this policy but in general when considering a means-tested policy there are two important considerations:

1. Often the work involved in administering the means-testing process is more costly or a worse use of resources than just allowing anyone to access the benefit.
2. Making a benefit means tested discourages those who are actually entitled to it from taking it up, whether because of stigma or barriers to access or other similar reasons. Often it is better to allow everyone access to the benefit in order to ensure those who really need it are getting it, rather than means-testing and running the risk of alienating some of those who would benefit the most.

I know that both of these reasons were factors in Scotland deciding that all expectant mothers get the Scottish baby box, rather than making it means tested.

Of all the things that I think the government wastes money on, feeding children, even the ones whose parents can afford to feed them, isn’t one of them.

This is bullshit. Firstly everyone gets free school meals until year 3 secondly it is all booked online my child gets free school meals and I doubt even the dinner ladies know who gets them. Everyone books online whether they get it free or their parents have to pay
I also used to work in a primary school and the kids were clueless about fsm. The most important wealth signal was who had the biggest collection of prime bottles 🤣🤣

@Leah5678

As a school governer, I can say that many parents who are eligible for FSM don't because they are worried about the stigma. Yes, it should be kept confidential but staff know and many parents don't want that. They also think back to their own school days where it was more obvious.

Feeding kids is never going to be a bad thing

I can't see how the staff could possibly know at my child's school my child gets fsm and it is all booked online through a company that are separate to the school. The paying parents use the same website they just have to enter their bank details. I also received fsm as a child and none of the other children knew. Some stories on this thread of being publicly humiliated in front of other children are dating back to the 1970s. Things have changed a lot over 50 years.

Maybe your school does things differently from my child's school though

Is this about the length of the school day? Yes, 8am drop off to 4.30pm pick up without clubs.

No, it really isn't. Children did not all get FSM in Year 2 when I was teaching primary 👍

None of the schools I've ever taught in have used online booking systems.

The children in the last school I taught in were aware of FSM, as the staff member who would come and remove them from class for targeted intervention would announce, "Could I take the FSM children, please".

And as I've previously stated, on trip days, the FSM children were given a packed lunch by school, which provoked questions from the children who weren't.

HTH.

Teachers know because of tracking, statistics and targeted interventions. Children on FSM are statistically likely to have lower attainment so this is monitored.

Not all schools use online systems. The last school I was in, we asked the children every morning when taking the register if they were dinners or packed lunches, then that list would go straight to the kitchen, and parents would pay with money in an envelope.

The last time I taught primary age was five years ago, so no, I'm not going back to the 70s. I hope that helps you understand.

Completely agree 👍

If my child needs to use breakfast club it’s because I need to be In work before 8am, I am capable of giving breakfast but I’m not going to feed him at 7am then he has to wait until lunch for a small school lunch so he will have breakfast there which is paid for my me when I pay for his time there, otherwise, same situation when he’s at the Childminers before school, breakfast is part of the gig. Teachers don’t do the breakfast clubs, it’s TA’s and the breakfast club itself funds the staff needed.

Even on the days I don’t work where I do in fact give my child breakfast, I wouldn’t send them to breakfast club for a free breakfast or get them earlier than they really need to be. School days can be long days for children so on the two days I’m able to do the school run, I would feed them.

Breakfast club is only used for me when my Childminder isn’t available. As I have a younger child too, I wouldn’t change to 2 separate drop offs for this.

Schools will have limited places as it is, they aren’t going to offer more places to give a free breakfast.

They can’t win.

Huge issue with child poverty and teachers having to try to manage class who haven’t had decent breakfast is harder.

Also supporting parents to work.

Means tested benefits don’t work well.

I agree with it, there’s a lot of money wasted, this is a positive.

Children learn best on a full stomach. Toast, beans, cheese are usually on offer as well as drinks, hot or cold.

Some schools have 75% of children on FSM. They may not get an adequate evening meal. Breakfast keeps them going.

This started in Bradford in 1907 so it's not new!

Many rely on grandparents like me to give the children breakfast and take them in on time. I don't mind giving them a proper breakfast, likely to be toast or cereal at Breakfast club as it was at our last school.
Would be nice to have a few days off every now and again though!

I’m happy with the idea in principle but worry about how many will take it up. We have about 25-30 at the moment which is just about manageable for them to eat, then play in the school hall.

If any more want to come, Im not sure where they will actually go. I don’t think it’s fair on teachers setting up their classrooms for the lessons for the day to have children playing in there for an hour before school. Even if the teachers aren’t the ones supervising them-they will have books/sheets etc on the tables ready for the first lesson and won’t want their classroom resources, (often largely paid for themselves!) used.

I also hope it’s funded adequately (unlike the way the previous government funded nurseries!).

Because of poor children being made targets by other children. Everyone gets treated the same.

It enables kids to be on a level playing field. Those getting free breakfast will not be "pointed out as poor or under privileged" by other kids. Reduces the stigma, kids can be cruel to each other. If every child is eating together then it is a little less obvious who's on the bread line so to speak.

Agree about adequate funding. I think some may not because of fussiness over food, and then there are those parents who could never be up in time for an earlier arrival.

And to add to this, there will many children who come from families not considered “on the breadline” but with the rising costs of food, energy and mortgage/ rent will be struggling just as much as those who qualify for benefits.

Free breakfast for everyone. Even the ones who can easily afford.
Sod the pensioners. They can freeze to death

I would rather pay for a child's breakfast. Than an illegal immigrant.