Labour should invest in weight loss medications immediately

[HowToSaveTheNHS]

AIBU to think the Labour government should seriously consider rolling out weight loss drugs to the obese population, to tackle obesity, diabetes and cut NHS waiting lists? Traditional public health measures to tackle obesity are not working.

We spend so much money treating disease associated with obesity and it’s only going to get worse as increasing numbers of people are living for decades with multiple health conditions associated with obesity. Even dementia’s leading cause is Type 2 diabetes.

Looking at the Mounjaro thread on here, huge numbers of Mumsnetters are successfully losing weight and improving their health. But people on lower incomes won’t have access because the drugs are expensive.

A course of drugs for a year will surely be money well spent if we can reduce heart disease/ diabetes/ dementia/ cancer etc… even hypertension.

WeGovy and Mounjaro are the two used in the U.K. ie by Mumsnetters. There is no problem with their supply - they are prescribed for obesity not diabetes. I’m not suggesting there are no supply problems with this medication but the ones used for obesity are completely separate.

No 9t wouldn’t, as people over eat for many reasons, and if you stop you put it back on.

Liraglutide is branded saxenda and victoza. It's also used for losing weight.

As a health economist I think in terms of costs v benefits. I don’t believe moral judgment has any place in this at all.

Do you have a back of the envelope calculation for the savings over time vs. plausibility of funding it, at the necessary scale, in the near term? NB: I agree with setting aside moral hazard etc. I'm interested in costing the benefits vs adverse events. (I'm intrigued by the people who report reduction in alcohol consumption, the drive to gamble, the use of pain medications etc.)

People overeat for many reasons - yes, of course they do. Mounjaro removes the obsessive "food noise" which many, many overweight people know about. The way I'm looking at it is I'll use it until I'm at a healthy weight and I hope in that time I will have learned new ways of eating. For instance, I eat between 12 and 6 now - that should be a habit in six months' time. Same with alcohol - I went from having a couple of glasses of wine every night to never giving it a thought. I don't have it in the house now as it never occurs to me to buy it. I'm hoping that remains a habit, too.

I’m an economist! The approach is called invest to save and it does make economic sense. If the evidence shows that savings are likely to far outweigh the costs in the medium term, it is economically advantageous to pursue such a policy. There is likely to be increased economic output from reduced sickness (arising from physical and mental health impact of reducing obesity).

I read about it here.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/weight-loss-injections/5107426-continuing-mounjaropart-15?

I don't think they give someone 2 years stock in one go, it's more that they'll support them over time if they want to purchase it for maintenance.

I've no idea what the outcome of any lawsuits might be.

Do you have evidence from other countries where this has been tried?

I don’t and I would not do a quick impact analysis because health economics is complex and a lot of assumptions and evidence would need to be collected. It might be too early to calculate healthy life expectancy- I don’t know without examining the evidence base.

The costs and benefits are so far reaching, and interrelated with other factors (eg smoking) so you need to be sure you’re not overestimating effects.

It would be a 2+ year study to do it properly. I do hope there are plans in place

No, that's masturbation.

@montysma1 , it's Tim Spector not Phil Spector
Tim Spector - Wikipedia
Phil Spector - Wikipedia

For the people saying "they'll just pile it all back on when they come off it" would it be the case that the obese person would be so used to eating smaller portions & avoiding junk food over the course of their treatment that their body & brain have been "reset" as it were so they'd carry on as if they were still on it? I know when I'm on an extreme diet for any length of time my stomach feels as though it's shrunken (most likely it hasn't) & my cravings for junk goes out the window, it'd be interesting to see in a year or two what happens when you actually do come off it, also the weight loss would surely be motivation to keep the weight off? It's a complex isssue

Agree. But I guarantee your opinion will not be popular OP. So many people think using weight loss drugs is 'cheating' or 'lazy'.

I haven’t

The first step the government would need to do is an appraisal with cost benefit analysis. My opening post didn’t go into detail over this, as I was being simplistic saying they should invest as I was interested in the public reaction if I’m honest (I suspected people would be strongly against).

But of course they would need to do it properly … run a pilot, collect evidence and IF it works roll it out.

@flashspeed what do you mean by taking 10 mins?
I do 30-60 mins spin, netball (30-45 mins) and lift weights (20-45 mins)
I don't see exercise as pointless, it's for my heart, lungs, mental health and I enjoy it, I just don't see it as for weight loss. Plus netball has the social side to it too

I think a lot of people see obese as struggling to walk, unable to put socks on etc when obesity is also people that run, play sports, lift weights etc

This is the current NHS pilot if anyone is interested … this is only for people over 35 BMI with an obesity related health condition

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new-drugs-pilot-to-tackle-obesity-and-cut-nhs-waiting-lists

There's talk in the US of the medical insurance companies accepting it because of the knock on effects with fewer weight-related problems. The issue there seems to be that people switch insurance companies quite frequently so one company might fund the drugs then another reap the benefits.

And @HowToSaveTheNHS , investment carries risk, which is massive in the NHS. In fact, as a health economist, you'll know that the nhs was established on the basis the good, preventative public health was also introduced. Hospitals were to there for surgery and really poorly.
Well yes, p h is much better than in 1948, but you must agree, that sociologically and psychologically, when something is free, it is valued initially, then taken for granted, as the nhs and p h is now.
Smoking, drinking and sti rates are not brilliant, and despite increasing the price of tobacco and alcohol, it is not a deterrant, even to those who can afford it least. P H messages about their effects don't work.

So, it's not as simple as invest and save when individuals are involved, particularly as those that would 'benefit' from the drugs represent a small per centage of the 'obese' population, and thus a smalker per centage of the overall population

Yes my fitness instructor for HITT is very overweight (not sure is obese) and she is awesome- very fit and strong. She is popular because her classes are accessible. I have no qualms being taught by her- I see fitness and weight as separate. You can be overweight and fit- actually it’s really bloody impressive to see fit people who are carrying extra weight as it must be very challenging.

Oh my god, I wondered when you'd admit you were recruiting for a study. Are you using thesecresponses as qualatativecevidence?

This is what I have found so weird in this thread. I work in this area so am aware of the research on obesity clearly giving evidence for the multiple reasons so many are affected, and I realise that this isn’t everyday reading for most people, nor does it need to be.

But the judgement. Is this what people really think? Or am I just naive? Surely anyone can work out that obesity is more complex than fatties having no self control? Over 20% of year 6 children are obese (not just overweight) according to gov.uk. That’s something else other than shit parenting/bad choices.

And the future impact of this is everyone’s problem, even the judgey ones.

Eh?! I have nothing to do with this. I don’t work in this field. I also don’t think it’s something you can sign up to… you’d have to live in a pilot area and be referred by your GP. I was sharing for interest so people can see what they’re trialling. Very unlikely anyone would be able to sign up as it’s well underway and I’m sure they are probably closed to referrals

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamaophthalmology/fullarticle/2820255

It's not a definite yes or no yet, but certainly not a definite 'no' right now.

I apologise, @HowToSaveTheNHS . Jumped the gun, I was wrong. 😐

The issue with weight loss drugs is they don’t get to the root of the problem.

We as a nation need to start looking at WHY obesity is such an issue and start there. As I see it, our whole mentality and culture around food has deteriorated over the last couple of decades. Fast food places are literally everywhere and are addictive, convenient and relatively inexpensive. To allow such crap to fill up our high streets, roadside service stations, malls, just about everywhere has been a disaster.