Tenants accepting (overdue) safety certificates- how to proceed

[DoubleShotEspresso]

Hello,

Posting here as I cannot find another relevant category and figured traffic here may be better.

We are tenants, were provided all required safety certificates when we moved in, but these expired some (years) ago. Managing agent hurriedly arranged new inspections at the time we were being issued new contract (rent increase) and out property failed on both gas and electricity.

Recommended works were completed, but only some time after we signed a new tenancy agreement. We suspect the intention was perhaps to facilitate the possible use of a section 21 at some point in the next year but understand this is now not possible due to late issue of gas safety certificate. (After our new tenancy agreement was issued and signed).

So my questions here please:

-Is our landlord in breach for us not having had checks done for some years? If yes, what consequences could they face?
-Should we sign for an electrical certificate issued prior to signing new tenancy agreement even though the works are only being completed now? Can we/should we refuse?
-Can tenants seek compensation in situations such as this? (No intent here but interested to know the gravity here as being made to feel crazy whenever I raise a question on this)
-What consequences exist for landlords who fail to hold current gas safety certificates mid tenancy?

N.B No desire on my part for any conflict or at all to leave our home, but we do have some very real concerns as to the safety here but have no clue how to judge this.
Would be very pleased to hear from anyone kind enough to share some qualified wisdom! Thanks for reading.

We have a new tenancy agreement which cancels out the previous one. We id have all docs provided upon moving in but these expired .

So new contract means all should have been provided once again with all other relevant docs which is not the case.

It is the issue and very real pressure of needing to sign for these that I was querying hence the purpose of this thread. I cannot establish why this is needed and if in ding so, we are "accepting" that all is well when lit certainly is not yet.

Yes but suspect not validly issued.

Not yet no.

Not at all no.

I rather think that if certificates are now in place, you have no recourse and can be sent a Section 21 if the ll has now complied with the law. You say you have safety concerns even though the certificates are now in place?

Do you live in Dorset? Sounds like you are going through the same as me. My agent is doing the same with the landlord living abroad. I know there are 2 other properties with the same landlord/letting agent. I am going through my local council. A notice from them stops revenge eviction

No but I would like to one day!
He has we think 20 or so properties, no idea where they all are though. Really wanted to avoid the council as we are happy here for now and are in no way "problem" tenants as inferred by an idiotic pp upthread. Live quietly, paid rent in full with no exceptions, never declined access for any works or similar, it's all so stressful and time consuming.

Yes you have but you re not a new tenant, the original cert and epc issued still count, this is my understanding as the docs have to provided BEFORE moving in, as you are already there, this can't be done.

The gas cert should be renewed yearly.

A gas cert is either signed off by the contractor or it will have AR or ID in the relevant tick box and the appliance disconnected & Repairs have to be made asap.
Is this your case?

Right have searched this and the law is quite unclear, though the lateness of the gas one specifically seems to negate this/ Not sure tbh.
Yes the wiring is very old and the electrician identified it would be a "high code" on some of the recommendations he gave the landlord.

https://www.cozens-hardy.com/landlords-advice-gas-safety-certificate

This is helpful thanks. Gas cert has not been done for years.

No the certificate appears as if all is in good order, no references to the things which needed doing in order to pass. This and other wiring concerns are why we are worried and why I was seeking some advice. Nothing disconnected no.

Thanks for this

Did you get any C codes on the electrical report?

OP Have you read the EICR in detail? Was it satisfactory or unsatisfactory overall? What were the code numbers? Code 1 for anything is dangerous. C2 potentially dangerous. Code 3 is just recommendations - which a good landlord would generally deal with. Once C1 or C2 rectified, I would then expect a new domestic electrical installation certificate if it was things like a dangerous consumer unit. I think if you read it in detail it is quite self explanatory? It is C1 and C2 you need to be concerned about.

Regarding EPC, it is generally a new tenant. Some differing opinions there too. People are not sure yet whether a new Labour Government might bring back a C from 2028.

So you think the certificates are fake and the things certified can't be because they don't work?

We have not seen the report-it went direct to our agent.

We do not have a copy of the report so cannot say win relation to codes I am afraid.

In a nutshell yes

Your LL has clearly been in breach of their legal responsibilities but in reality, if you don't wish to involve the authorities, you have no recourse.

So, you think an independent gas company and an independent electrician would risk their livelihoods so your landlord could save a few quid?

If a property has tenants the ECP must be done every 5 years. It's only 10 years for private houses. There should be at least 1 smoke alarm on each floor. There should be a carbon monoxide alarm in every room with gas eg boiler or gas cooker. Optional extras include smoke alarm in all bedrooms, fire blanket in kitchen and first aid box provided.
OP if you had wanted to complain or report to claim compensation you would have needed to do so whilst LL was in breach. Gas certificate is every 12 months. Also LL can put rent up only once a year.

Not gas company no. They provided certificate after we signed contract as the corrective works took that long. Electrical works still happening and certificate issued before we signed, as above. I am not asking anybody, landlord included too risk their livelihood?

You are not making much sense. Do you have a valid gas and electricity certificate or not? You can ask the agent to give you a copy. I issue a full pack for my tenants every 12 months. So I print out How to Rent documents from the government website every year, they are also given a copy of the new gas certificate every year and they are handed a valid electricity certificate which I photocopy every year and I print out the EPC every year for the tenants too. On the contract page I get them to sign to say that they have been given valid documents which are all listed. I get them to sign this every year. I also get them to sign to say they have working smoke alarms in every bedroom as well as on both floors also as working CM detectors next to boiler and gas hob. I take photos of CM detectors Insitu too. I provide fire blankets and a first aid kit too which tenant signs for.

@caringcarer An EPC is only required on a new tenancy or a house sale, they are valid for 10 years, after that you do not need a new one, there is zero requirement for a private owner to have one or any other checks other than on new work.
Eicr is every 5 years for tenant.

OP - You ve a right to have a copy of the EICR, in fact thats the law

Bear in mind, older wiring or an older CS do not mean anything is unsafe eg an older plastic consumer unit wouldn't comply with latest regs but it can still be safe.

Please see my responses upthread re certificates.
Very good to read how you look after your tenants, in all the years I have rented I have never been given a first aid kit, but that's very kind of you ;-)

What is the purpose of you getting your tenants to sign for the docs please?

That is interesting to note, we have asked for a copy earlier today, thanks for the other info, that is very reassuring and all was very unclear.

Why are you being asked to sign for the electrical certificate? We have a gas and electri safety inspection every year. The agents email me telling me when they will be coming and if that works for us. I agree. They attend and do what they need to do. There's no signing to do, even for an agreement for them to come... to be honest as long as its all up to date and is now done annually I would leave well alone. Its not easy to rent at the moment.