To want to maim my neighbour's dog

[greyskythinker]

Every time we open our back door or go into our garden, our neighbour's dog goes mental; starts barking, growling and snarling through the hedge.

This has been going on for 2 years, and I am at the end of my tether!The dog is so aggressive, my 2.5DD starts to cry every time we are in the garden, my cleaner refuses to go out the back door, and my PIL refuse to come round to eat al fresco during the summer.

We hardly know the neighbours behind us, but having spoken to them about an unrelated matter when we moved in 4 years ago, I know that it would be impossible to have a constructive discussion with them (husband is a smartarse).

We have complained to the council, but they have not been much use.

The owners know the dog is harassing us, as they will occasionally call the dog back in, only to let it out again 30 seconds later!

Short of murdering the dog (don't think I haven't thought about it - sorry dog lovers), what can I do?

Wisteria - they are 7.5 years old. i saw a trainer once but too expensive to go again. they are good dogs but tbh it is depressing if there is another dog and though i live on an army camp and there is a rule that all dogs are to be kept on leads, i am the only one doing so and i have to have one muzzled because someones dog came running over to my pair. they wear haltis so there is control but it draws attention with them causing a scene and i am also pushing a buggy so i fear another dog coming over, a situation ensues and my son is traumatised. hopefully if my 5 weeks pregnancy is successful i will be pusing a tandem soon so need to get them sorted. i am trainig them with treats at the moment for positive reinforcement. they are stubborn and water does not work. i feel they can have selective hearing iykwim? sorry for long post

greysky - thought it was a gsd! i would throw water at it every time it barked! is that wrong? saw it on dog borstal.

It could work but only if you give it treats when it is quiet...might be hard methinks. If you feed it when it is barking then it may think it's being rewarded for barking

I would be furious if anyone gave food to my dogs though and, given what you have said about your neighbours, they don't seem particularly reasonable people and may even accuse you of trying to poison the dog.......

I personally would not bribe the dog. Because if it associates you with treats, then every time you are in the garden it will winge and bark to get your attention in the hope of a treat. Best not to go there imo.

My first port of call would be blocking up the privet bit. Ensure the dog cannot see you.
Then I would try the shaker method. But this will take commitment and consistency if it is to work.

Good luck

Golly - at 7.5 it would be an amazing feat to recondition behaviour... you could try it but I think it will be hard.

Personaly, I don't think the bottle rattle will work, as the technique wouldn't be carried out by the dog's owners. It would probably only aggravate the dog more, and coming from someone who's not it's owner, it may see it as a threat and will exacerbate the situation.

I think blocking off that privet hedge bit will help as the dog won't be able to see you, although it will probably still bark when it hears you but at least you won't have it snarling and growling at you.

I have two dogs and they often bark at people passing the house when they're outside. They're behind a gate. They're not aggressive by any stretch of the imagination, it's a territorial thing.

that's true MP - a good strong piece of treated wood attached to the wall would be a cheap option.

Thank you for all your posts. I posted this thread thinking I was just having a bit of a rant, but I have actually got some really useful suggestions which I feel could help. Thanks

Off to bed. Nighty night.

"Look at www.thedogownersclub.co.uk/extra/db_faq.html"

It is the advice from the people at Dog Borstal about using rattle bottles. Not a good idea I would say.

"Can I use a rattle bottle on my dog to deal with his aggression to people?
A. NO! A rattle bottle, or indeed any type of punishing equipment should NEVER be used without a professional looking at your dog and his behaviour.

There have been many cases where the inappropriate use of such equipment has made the dog much, much worse, and turned an assertive dog into a biting dog, with the bite directed at the person who used the punisher.

The rattle is NOT A MIRACLE CURE! Those of you who think that it is a quick fix, and that simply shaking a bottle or can with stones in it will stop the problem are in for a shock. On Dog Borstal, we do so much assessment of the dog and preparation before any form of punishment is used that you do not see, and if you don't know how to do this, you could find you make your dog much more of a problem. The sad thing is that even despite reading this, some people will still be foolish enough to give the rattle bottle or cup of water in the face a try. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED!"

Wisteria

"I have been training dogs for years and have never had this not work - it does depend on the breed somewhat I admit but I, personally, would give it a go."

A little bit of knowledge can be a dangerous thing. I'm not saying you haven't had success in the past when training dogs, but no professional dog trainer worth their salt would ever recommend this method without taking a full case study and assessment of the dog in question.

it's difficult for you to attempt to correct the dog's behaviour when it doesn't recognise you as part of its family, and when those with most influence over it (the people it lives with) are not going to apply the same methods - it has to be done consistently by everyone the dog knows and with a number of repetitions before the behaviour changes. I suppose some dogs will respond more readily than others but your chances of success with this or more positive methods are slim.

"I am not going against Bang's points here as she is right as well - have you considered taking them to a professional trainer?"

At the end of the day - this is a completely different situation, it is unfair of a dog owner to not rectify this and, although I agree with you wholeheartedly, I would try this as a last option. I would not put up with my children being terrified to enter their own garden. The dog can't get through to the garden so is unlikely to bite the hand that rattles at it.

As for the boxers - I think too little too late probably but as you can see I did refer to a pro trainer for those very reasons. The thing is with the bottle that you can generally tell the first time you use it whether it is effective or not.

Totally agree that the situation needs to be rectified Wisteria, I just don't think your suggestion is necessarily the most sensible one.

Someone has already mentioned on here that dog noise can be taken up with the Council. Someone else has suggested blocking up the hedge.

The worry with the rattle bottle is 1) that it may make the dog worse and 2) the neighbour (if she is as unreasonable as she sounds) might catch her out there with the rattle bottle and accuse her of aggravating the dog. Then when it comes to any kind of Council involvement or mediation that might go against the OP.

I'm really not trying to have a fight with you Wisteria, just disagreeing with the advice you have given.

we had a problem with neighbours dogs and had to keep a log of it and send it to the council and then they wrote them a letter and it stopped, if its causing you real stress the dog owners could end up getting an asbo for it. Everyone has a right for 'quiet enjoyment' of their home and that includes the garden. If this dog is causing you a nuisence which it sounds like it is you have every right complaining about it. sounds like the dogs owners a selfish fuckwit.

it must be horrible though, and a real shame that it is happening at about the time children are most prone to developing fears - I'm shocked at how unreasonable the neighbours are being. Is anyone else affected by the dog's behaviour, could you check with occupants of adjoining properties? Perhaps as a group you could come up with something, or at least get some support by way of them making complaints too.

I know bang - I understand that.... and likewise I am not arguing with you - I thought I had made that clear.

All I am saying is that I would try it if boarding the gap up, contacting environmental health doesn't work - the OP mentioned she had got nowhere with the council previously but obviously it is a better route to travel.

Were it a larger dog the council would probably wade in straightaway....

Thanks all - I will keep you updated.

Contact the council.I lived with the misery of constantly yapping dogs for years until we moved.Appartently,after we moved,another neighbour rang the council & reported the owner,who got a letter telling her that they were causing a nuisance & to do something about it.These poor dogs were pugs,but were left on their own all day & barked from 7am til 10pm.The owner never walked them,the selfish cow.

Even now,nearly 3 years later,the sound of barking dogs makes me all jumpy.

FuriousGeorge,
I empathise so much. I contacted the council last January, who wrote to the owners, firstly on an informal basis to tell them a complaint had been made, and then to tell them a formal investigation was being conducted. The owners rang the council each time to tell them the dogs were only allowed out for 5 minutes a day and were certainly not a nuisance!! What planet are they on?

Anyway, I kept records for a couple of weeks, which actually was really stressful, because I was hyper aware of the barking, even more than normal. The council came out a couple of times to take noise readings, but typically, both times, the dog was nowhere to be heard.

The last contact with the council was approx October, so I intend to ring them again tomorrow to see what they can do.

The prospect of another summer being constantly harassed by the dog every time we step out the door fills me with dread. I would love to move, but with the way the housing market has gone in NI, it would cost us £50k just in fees & stamp duty, before we even paid for a new house!!

Rant over. Thank you for taking the time to read

i really feel for you greysky.
we have been plagued by a neighbour,3 doors away from us,for years,with his dog's noise.
he has 4 rescue dogs.2 are quiet,1 barks constantly when he is out(sometimes for hours at a stretch),another one recently added,barks at every slight disturbance(again for long stretches).it must be awful having one so close and aggressive.i would keep on at the council if i was you and i wonder if you could get extra people to vouch for you,if not neighbours,people who come to your house(witnesses).did your neighbour say anything to you after the council contact?
has anyone on this thread had success with enviromental health?-stories would be appreciated.i asked my neighbour last summer very nicely.he told me it was an old dog and looked as if it was hopeless.he also seems unreasonable and totally unsympathetic.
i wonder if we could get decibel reading meters from the council as i heard someone suggest once,to prove the noise is a health hazard as well.someone once said,get an ultrasonic whistle and blow that when it barks.do any of you know whether that would have any effect.the noise is a few gardens away in our case so i thought it may not hear me and not work?!
good luck grey.i'm sure something should be done,as it is a serious form of stress to me,as i feel it lift hugely when i leave the street sometimes.how dare someone else be so inconsiderate!

bump

Hi Happyathome,

We have tried the ultrasonic pointy thing and also a dog whistle, to no avail.

My sister had a similar problem in her new house, and she was successful with environmental health, I think the dog owners ended up getting a court order against them (it sounds like my entire family are anti-dogs, we're not, honestly).

Environmental Health explained to me that they had to actually witness the barking and take their own decibel readings, however, I did take video to show them, and they agreed that based on what they saw on the video evidence, it would be classed as a nuisance, however, as they said, they needed to witness it themselves & take readings.

I have arranged for them to come out this Monday - let's hope the dog is in the garden this time (perverse, isn't it, hoping that the dog will be in the garden, when I spend my time hoping it won't).

Good luck happyathome, I so sympathise.

It's not the dogs fault... unfortunately it's the mornic owners fault.

sorry... I would have a word with them, they may understand, especially if you say your DD is scared of the dog...

Greyskythinker - can I recommend that you go round and try to speak to them, however pointless you feel it might be?

We've got two rottweilers, and I appreciate that to a lot of people they might seem threatening and noisy, especially when they are playfighting with each other in the back garden.
I do, however, know my dogs very well, and am always happy to explain their behaviour to anyone who asks about it. When we got the second dog, and realised that their favourite game was going to be chasing each other around the garden like crazy dogs, we invited our neighbours and their children around to the house to meet them. All of the children whose gardens look onto ours now know the dogs' names, how to make them sit, lie down, and fetch any balls that might have flown over the fence. They are all happy to stroke and cuddle both dogs.
Obviously your neighbours might not be as interested in good neighbourly relations as we are, but please try it. I know exactly how I would react of someone called the Housing Executive (we live in a RAF house) before coming round to speak to us if they had any concern.
Please don't use a rattle bottle from your garden. Trying to impose training methods through a fence, on a dog you hve never met, is only ever going to make the problem worse.

thanks greythinker for info.
hope it goes well with EH.
it would be great to hear if you have success too
good luck.fingers crossed for you
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