To think that people have become completely incapable....

[memorial]

Ok so I'm a GP (yes yes I know I could be anybody) and have been for over 20 years.
But bloody hell our society have become completely and utter incapable of any kind of self care or self responsibility. I have never known anything like the kind of demand we are facing. And I'm sorry most of it is just complete and utter nonsense. Over and over again.
Genuinely ill and needy people are being lost in the deluge. It's absolutely impossible to offer any kind of decent care. And we are losing doctors, nurses and staff rapidly. And we cannot recruit. It's not about pay It's about absolutely ridiculous workload and risk.
Yes the system is broken yes we need more of everything.
But every single thing does not need GP hand holding. It doesn't need 2 page complaints because you didn't get what you wanted when you wanted it.
Some days I just think people won't be happy until I go and wipe their arses for them.
I'm done. And it's not just me.

You can in Wiltshire too. Current waiting time 3.5-4 years

This was me, turns out it was severe endometriosis, all over my bowel, but all the tests were coming back normal because it wasn't inside the bowel, couldn't be seen by the scopes. Took me 10 years to get diagnosed, I didn't think my periods were that bad to be honest, I figured everyone had painful periods...

I'm not saying it will be the same for you, but its worth considering. I had 3 referrals to Gastroenterology, I knew something was really wrong, just didn't know what it was.

I know if a patient who has complained and said he is going to sue his GP surgery- why? Because he was told he needed a face to face appointment to check him over before some medication was prescribed. He wanted a telephone appointment and is claiming west and tear to his car (for driving to the surgery), petrol and stress (his appointment time was late so he had to wait 15mins ).

The biggest problem overall seems to be the assumption of bad intent, which results in aggressive, dismissive and often angry approaches. From both patients and HCPs.

Not a troll. And no were did I say the majority of patients. You're the one spouting daily mail rhetoric.

Couldn’t agree more OP.

I am a hospital consultant and it is grim. The mismatch between the public’s expectations and what the service can deliver is vast. Many senior doctors are leaving much earlier than planned. I certainly will aim to retire at 55 (10 years and counting).

Do you still treat them? Or cut the appointment short?

There’s something very wrong if, as OP says ‘most’ people are there for ‘complete and utter nonsense’. I just don’t believe it. Most people imo do try home care, because it’s easier, it saves time and doctors surgeries aren’t pleasant, neither is the hour it often takes on the phone to get an appointment, the 10 minutes of being judged as worthy or not by a receptionist etc. I really struggle to believe that ‘most’ people are time wasters. Who the hell are all these people that want to be at the doctors? And how is it that they’re all getting appointments and the genuine ones aren’t? It makes no sense.

Dodgy mole one is a right pain in the bum. I feel like such a pain calling about a mole, my Drs don't often agree to making appointments ahead of time so you have to ring on the day. Is it urgent for today? No that's why I wanted to book in advance.

I'd be more than happy to attend a mole clinic where you wait, go behind the curtain yes/no, next patient please. Like a conveyor belt. I know most of the time it's nothing but my Dad has had skin cancer twice and so many mole removals I feel it's irresponsible to ignore something.

OP, you literally said ‘And I'm sorry most of it is just complete and utter nonsense. Over and over again.’

Had the OP have said, ‘a few patients are really wasting time, they need to try treatment at home and speak to a pharmacist’, I’d have thought, fair enough. Just because there’s bound to be a few, just not most. And OP did say most! They referred to genuine patients being lost in the deluge (of non genuine patients I presume) and used language like ‘every thing doesn’t need a hand hold.’ OP, you were very much saying most, the majority etc. That’s why you posted. If it was just a few, presumably it wouldn’t be that much of an issue for you to feel so passionate about. 🤷🏻‍♀️

Complete 💩

I'd guess it only takes a few people to be making excessive use of a service for them to make up a significant proportion of the patient contacts.

Is OP a Tory shill? How do you make so many posts in the first page without once mentioning Brexit and its effect on staff shortages in healthcare? Why are you minimising and dismissing the huge structural problems with a hand wave?

‘Yes the government needs to resource it better but…’

There should be no ‘but’ here. This isn’t a footnote. We are training far fewer doctors than we should be, have fewer doctors per capita than most EU countries, and it’s a massive problem.

But let’s carry on blaming people as the primary response mechanism.

I certainly do believe the OP. I think thing are really bad. I think the workload is really bad. I services are underfunded and there isn't enough HCP .I think the worried well are big issues. I work in another part healthcare. I think most of colleagues are burnout. I do think the landscape of health has changed. I do think there is a flip side to this. I say this as someone who both receives and deliver healthcare. I had health issues since I was child - I witnessed how healthcare has really changed and in my opinion. These changes are not positive. I have also experienced being misdiagnosed due to being dismissed by GP - this has been a traumatic itself. I think HCP often fail to grasp the long term impact a misdiagnosis. I think a lot them don't realise that how life changing a misdiagnosis is in terms of relationships, career, goals and aspiration. I think HCP also don't recognise that seasoned patient (those with disabilities and long term heath care condition) also get burnout from the healthcare system and often don't really want to see or engage with healthcare professionals. People often admonish patient for not take responsibilities for health - I am guilty of this too. However, HCP often fail to realise that disabilities and long term condition are actually burdensome and time consuming. Most people do not choose to be particularly those who do not have lifestyle disease. They did not contribute in anyway to the their illness/disease/disability.

ditto - It took me more than 20 years to get a diagnosis. I went to the GP numerous times. I probably one of those patients the OP complains about.

@Lucidas you embarrass all of us when you make such silly statements and proclamations. Brexit/political parties are not responsible for woefully ignorant abuse of services.

‘Yes the government needs to resource it better but…’

There should be no ‘but’ here. This isn’t a footnote. We are training far fewer doctors than we should be, have fewer doctors per capita than most EU countries, and it’s a massive problem.

But let’s carry on blaming people as the primary response mechanism.

Yes, it's failings in the larger system that are causing this breakdown of trust. Those systems are larger than just the NHS.

To the poster who asked if we still treat patients who manage to get appointments for obvious trivia by lying to reception -
I once saw a patient who'd insisted that her conjunctivitis was urgent and needed an appointment that evening despite all the appointments being taken. She wasn't worried it was something else, she knew it was conjunctivitis, but she wanted seeing. I was quite junior at the time so didn't have the courage to refuse, so I kept the surgery open late just for her. I saw her, gave her treatment, and gently suggested that in future she didn't need an urgent appointment for conjunctivitis. She made a formal complaint about me which created a ton of work and made me feel like crap. It would have been easier if I'd just kept my mouth shut.

Actually the people who do all these things are likely to save the NHS money in the long run, because they're statistically more likely to die relatively young.

The biggest increase in costs to the NHS from the time when it started in 1948 is due to the ageing population. In 1948, the life expectancy in the UK was about 68; now it's over 81. Which means lots of elderly people with chronic health problems relying on the NHS. And sometimes for things that would be more appropriately provided by social care; but social care is even more underfunded than the NHS, so the latter takes up the tab.

Of course it's an excellent thing that most of us live longer now than in the past and I'm not proposing that we all drink and smoke ourselves to death before we're 70!!! Just that so many people getting old costs the NHS more than some people having bad habits, and we have to find more ways to adapt the system to the ageing population.

And it’s the woeful abuse of services that causing the UK to train far fewer GPS than is needed? Explain the link - I’m not seeing it.

To read OP you’d think that elderly patients aren’t getting a look-in while the perfectly young and healthy vomitters and IBS-sufferers scoop up all the appointments - when we know that our ageing population is a major threat to the sustainability of the NHS. Disingenuous.

In many schools children are on site at 7:30 for breakfast club.

@memorial I'm sorry you've had such a vile response on this thread.
I don't suppose it's done anything to persuade you to stay in the profession. Do people really not realise that to put the boot in as they do on threads like this just exacerbates the recruitment and retention issue, as with schools.
Posters on MN (and wider social media) has a lot to answer for, I think.

@memorial

I agree with you. I'm ex-NHS. Left when every shift I thought 'is this the one where I will end up in court' . The way Dr Hadiza Bawa-Garba was treated really bothered me.

It's all entangled though - insecure working conditions lead to a want for 'quick fixes' when what is really needed is time and care.

Inability to gain secure housing near to family leads to fragile support networks, leading to greater need for outside intervention.

Fear mongering from the media, 'a pill for every ill' being relentlessly pushed.

It's all adding up to endless demand with shrinking capacity.

You just have to look at the vote to know people do get it.

I hear you @memorial

I’m only a NP but I really don’t know how my GP colleagues do it. I work a ten hour day and am wrecked, but only do 2.5 days a week. They do approx 50 hours a week or more and deal with so much.

I’ve been doing this job for over 20 years and have seen such a shift in expectations. There’s a massive gulf between what patients want, and what they actually need.

It seems we live in a society of instant gratification and healthcare is viewed the same way. Nobody wants to make an effort for their own health - it’s always someone else’s fault or responsibility.

And regarding the menopause yes, the Davina effect is real. It’s a good thing that menopause and associated issues have been highlighted and brought to the fore but fuck me it seems that 75% of women 35 and over think that all their issues are down to peri/menopause.

I’ve seen a 40 year old woman on numerous occasions who just won’t accept that despite regular periods, normal FSH results, no vasomotor symptoms but vague symptoms of tiredness, anxiety and stress are all due to perimenopause. The GP has told her the same because apparently “I’m just a nurse and don’t know anything”. We’ve explored lifestyle reasons, but no her teenage children, useless husband, ageing parents, demanding job and elevated BMI aren’t a factor, it must be because she needs HRT and will keep demanding until she gets it. Apparently the NICE guidelines are irrelevant because Davina says she’s entitled to HRT.

That’s the tip of the iceberg. Just today I’ve seen a patient for a blood test he needed for the hospital - nothing on the system, nothing in writing, he didn’t know what he needed or who had asked for it. I suggested he rebooked when he knew what bloods were needed and brought some evidence of what they wanted taking. Apparently I’m a fucking useless cunt because I should just know and do it.

The patient who phoned 37 minutes after waking with a sore throat, wanting to be seen.

The patient who was outraged that the GP wouldn’t refer for a scan for a sore knee. The hospital would reject that scan referral as it doesn’t meet referral criteria.

Luckily most patients are lovely, attend appropriately and you really feel you’ve made a difference. However the scales are tipping and very soon it will swing the other way, at which point I’ll be gone.

MY BF was a GP, but retired early saying that the toll on her health outpriced the reduced pension. She preferred being a gardener and landscape designer.

This is so well articulated!

As an aside how do you feel about cards and biscuits etc? We get tonnes in hospital but although our GP surgery is amazing I feel like might be more awkward to send a card or something?