To think that people have become completely incapable....

[memorial]

Ok so I'm a GP (yes yes I know I could be anybody) and have been for over 20 years.
But bloody hell our society have become completely and utter incapable of any kind of self care or self responsibility. I have never known anything like the kind of demand we are facing. And I'm sorry most of it is just complete and utter nonsense. Over and over again.
Genuinely ill and needy people are being lost in the deluge. It's absolutely impossible to offer any kind of decent care. And we are losing doctors, nurses and staff rapidly. And we cannot recruit. It's not about pay It's about absolutely ridiculous workload and risk.
Yes the system is broken yes we need more of everything.
But every single thing does not need GP hand holding. It doesn't need 2 page complaints because you didn't get what you wanted when you wanted it.
Some days I just think people won't be happy until I go and wipe their arses for them.
I'm done. And it's not just me.

I agree with this partly.
This sounds a little bit like a venting GP (which should be allowed, it’s good to hear all sides)

The cuts on NHS mental health in this country are not on though.
Unless you are able to afford private mental healthcare, you do not get a proper therapist. Then you might go to your GP - but they are not trained for giving MH therapy.

I think a lot of this has gotten worse in lockdown.
A lot of people who had ‘some’ MH issues, have gotten a lot worse, or fallen in between the crack and forgotten.
Not everyone is aware they have mental health issues.

But the thing I do agree with in the root of this post, is that there are people who do not have enough self care, and also some with not enough responsibility - compared to 20 years ago..

It sounds a bit like the story of the teachers. They are also complaining the workload has become too great. Some kids do not get taught basic skills at home.

Maybe this is more a problem of budget cutting on education and the NHS ??

But there is far more nuance to this, i know…

I sympathise, OP.

I've been working as a steward at Covid vaccination sessions. At first I was in a large one in a sports hall. Most people who turned up were very grateful, understanding about delays and polite to the staff. As the rush has died down I've been going more to sessions held in doctors' surgeries and pharmacies. I get the chance to chat to people who are there to see the doctor or pharmacist when I'm not needed for vaccinees. I'm shocked at the level of entitlement some patients show. I understand it can be hard to get an appointment - I've only managed a phone consultation myself since Covid - but the moaning and complaining that enough isn't being done is unbelievable. One lady complained that she had to wait ages for a routine blood pressure check; when I suggested that the local pharmacy would do it for nothing, or buying herself a machine would save a lot of trips to the doctor she said 'But it's their job. Why should I do it?'

Nobody seems to have a natural response to worrying situations anymore - it's always anxiety that needs treating, or to a really sad event - it's depression that needs treating. Now, of course, sometimes medical treatment is the answer, but no one seems prepared to try anything except medine, immediately.

And everything is the HCP's responsibility. Like the PP who took a substance that was harming her for years. When 2nd vaccines started, people would abuse the staff who wouldn't do one sooner than the NHS allowed (that site didn't have a doctor) and it would be all the HCP's fault if they couldn't see their loved one abroad before s/he died, or even admitted that they would miss a holiday. And I saw a lovely Indian security guard fighting tears when Covid was raging in India and people there (including his own family and friends) were desperate for vaccines, but here people were getting angry at being offered AZ - which I had and I've not had Covid, so it can't be completely useless.

OP you need to join a doctors forum like drs.net You’re not going to get the response you want on here.

Just googled GP core hours and it appears on the face of it our surgery is flouting those as well. It also doesn't mention on here that the on site pharmacy closes at 4pm so if you get prescribed something after that it's either next day or a 10 mile drive to collect.
There are also regular posts on the local FB page regarding rude "gatekeeping" receptionists and the total inability to get an appointment. "I can't believe they refused to see me!". I do wonder what it is these people are calling about.

In my experience though that's not the case. If you're polite to the receptionist they're polite back. The telephone triage system works well and they will see someone face to face same day if they deem it necessary. They did for me, and I got a gentle bollocking for not coming sooner (didn't want to make a fuss, obvs). During the course of my illness I had regular phone calls from the GP and during one of these was told they needed to see me but had no appointments that day. I said never mind, I'll call in the morning, to be told no, can you come down now and I'll fit you in. The opening hours in the picture are clearly not what they work to, because having had blood tests one afternoon I got a call with the results and a plan around 7:30 that evening.
I do tell people about my great experience with that surgery btw, and I made sure to write and thank them for the care I've received recently.

Still pissed off they ignored my perimenopause symptoms for a decade though

I always go to the pharmacist first, but do still get told, more often than not, to see my GP. The last time I did that, I got the eye roll and the ' you're wasting my time' comments. Well sorry, but I was only doing what another HCP had advised so... Had shingles a few months ago and was again initially told to see my GP, but as I couldn't get an appointment rang 111 ( as per NHS guidance). They didn't call back for ages ( absolutely not complaining about this and I fully understand that they are really busy) and in the meantime saw a different pharmacist who took one look and immediately diagnosed me, gave me advice and said nothing further was needed. If the first pharmacist had said this, l wouldn't have wasted 111's time. I think my point is that you can be seen as a time waster just by following advice- and that if, for instance, pharmacists were more willing to advise, like the fantastic second pharmacist above, a lot of time could be saved.

We want excellent health care for free, this is the result. I am dreading our one experienced go deciding to retire.I know the help and sympathy I get for serious chronic illness will diminish.But carry on voting Tory folks and this is what you will get.

Solidarity OP. Do you have someone in real life to talk to about this? I know it won't come close to fixing it, but are there people you can talk to when you need?

(I am the spouse of a GP and the high likelihood of him burning out - and its potential consequences - terrifies the crap out of me)

But it’s not free.

Half the problem is other organisations saying "see your GP" for every little thing.

AIMummy, agreed. It’s part of an overwhelming need for organisations/individuals to cover their backs, again through lack of personal responsibility.
When my cancer treatment ended, both my surgeon and lymphoedema nurse recommended massage. Off I went to spend the spa voucher I had - they wouldn’t do it without a signed letter, which I didn’t waste anyone’s time trying to obtain. From now on if I want a massage I’ve had a benign lump removed, not cancer treatment.
The fact that we live in a world where my weed burner came with a warning not to use it as a hairdryer feels like a part of the problem too.

They’re not closing for lunch, they’re stopping appointments so that the doctors can sort bloods results, do paperwork such as referrals/letters, do home visits and do local nursing home wards rounds. When else do you think this gets done? Seriously, there’s so much more to being a GP than seeing patients.

My husband hasn’t had a ‘lunch break’ for months!

Not that I watch it religiously, but I don't think Doctors on BBC afternoons helps matters. Caring GPs who read between the lines and follow up patients. The reception staff rehearsing for a dance competition.

That said I dislike the 'be clear on cancer' campaign encouraging people to be cautious, and then get accused of being malingerers if they do manage to see a GP. Same as the 'Bowell babe', Sarah Harding or Jade Goody deaths raising awareness of cancer symptoms. All well and good IF YOU CAN see a GP

PS - I think people also understandably confuse hours that appointments are available for hours that GPs are working: the two are WILDLY different. During 'lunch' and indeed after appointments finish there are actually tons of home visits and something to eat squeezed in if you are lucky. Before and after appointments there are hundreds of admin tasks, test results to review, phonecalls to deal with etc. It's not like the GP or their staff just head off home and show up the next morning in time for the first appointment.

Also not helpful the health service can't decide between themselves what belongs to who.
My husband had a lump on his face, Dr said cyst, leave it be while it's not doing anything. Apparently his ethnicity makes him susceptible to them. Ok, no problem.
One day he comes home from work and his face is swelling, as the evening progresses the swelling has spread down across his cheeks and eyes. So we go to minor injuries to get him checked out. We get a lecture from minor injuries about how this is not for them, could have waited for the GP tomorrow. She also lists other examples of ailments that shouldn't be there including broken glass stuck in them.
Next day he sees the a GP who removes the cyst, gives him antibiotics and said if that happened to her she'd have gone to A&E!

In a similar vein my elderly mother-in-law had a call and although they sent an ambulance it took about 6 hours to come and when we arrived at hospital we had another wait. Once she was given a room I thanked the ambulance staff for being so good with her and they said I was the first person that day to thank them.

It's so sad

There are a million things wrong with our NHS system and it will take a number of things to fix it, if at all possible.

I think if we had decent MH services, then a lot of the pressure would be taken off GP's. Not sure if the OP agrees with that, or not. I get this from my own examples. I have a relative that has health anxiety. They are in and out of the GP every week, and at the hospital often. There is nothing physically wrong, and they need MH treatment, not 6 medical appointments a month. I also think that many of our older generation are in the doctors too often. My parent and my in-laws are in the doctors very often and my mind boggles. For example, my own parent will call me up very distressed saying they went to the doctor about a stiff leg, and they were told that at their age (86) to expect some aches and pains. They refuse to accept that this is just part of the ageing process and every twinge has to be explored at the hospital. It is the same for my MIL. According to her, she is gravely ill, she has had loads of tests, but they found nothing. She gets very aggressive with staff if she is not taken seriously.

I had to go to A&E a few months back and it really scared me, as I have always been very fit and healthy. I never want to do it again and so I have changed my lifestyle and eating habits. It was stress induced. I've never been before. Today I went to Boots and asked the pharmacist about an issue I have and they recommended something to me, which if it doesn't work, I should call my GP. I don't like asking the pharmacist these things either, but think this is a good first stop.

I agree that people here outsource things to others. They seem to think that the NHS service is their warranty for the duration of their lives and if they get sick, they can just go in and fix it, like as if you are going to Curry's to get your telly fixed.

I think anyone who works for the NHS is a saint!

I had a very, very bad experience having my DD (11)- I had pre-eclampsia and wasn’t treated very kindly; I’d done everything “right” in my pregnancy. I never did challenge the “care” I received…

Since then Ive developed a total fear of going to see a GP. I managed to have my smear test last year but that’s it. There are a few things going on with me that I should see a Dr about but I just can’t face it. My absolute fear seems to centre me being told I’m wasting time.

My DD has Swimmer’s Ear a lot (swims for a club four times per week) and I do take her when it gets really bad but I shake and sweat and thank them too many times (have never shared my fear with my daughter).

Signed us up to private healthcare (costs an arm and a leg) as I thought I’d somehow feel more at ease approaching services. Nope! Have not used it in a year.

OP is just being honest and I know people have squeezed the system for all it’s worth.

I don’t get all the fuss about GP delays to be honest.

I live in a heavily populated London suburb often described as a bad place to live, yet when I need an appointment, I can get one within 1-3 days.

I’ve been registered with the same GP practice for 35 years and the original GPs (married couple) are in their 80s and still practising. We have some newer GPS who have a better bedside manner but all in all, I haven’t had any issues, apart from locum GPs who are sometimes arrogant.

OP, I doubt patients have become more demanding over the last 25 years. It’s just that your tolerance is going because you feel retirement beckons.

I am well aware there’s more to being a GP than seeing patients, I didn’t say there wasn’t. I was responding to the OP asking for links of GP surgeries closing for lunch, all 3 of the surgeries I linked to say they close for lunch. Believe it or not, there are some that actually do close for lunch.

TwoNightStand Pretty much. There have been lots of examples in this thread where people have mentioned friends going to the GP for minor ailments which will probably clear themselves up with rest and self-care.

@cbatopainttheshed @TeapotTitties And everyone being sarcastic, why bother posting at all? She's telling her experience as a GP and this is something many people agree on. You obviously don't and that's okay. You're entitled to your opinion and voicing it but no need for the sarcasm.

Presumably the receptionist tells patients; alternatively, some practices have their own website which includes this sort of information.

Step away from MN & enjoy your day off.

It only became a problem 8 years ago- I had used the medication on and off prior to that. But after having my son, had to use it daily, got more ill, got prescribed stronger medication, got more ill, stronger medication etc...
Look up Topical Steroid Withdrawal if you are interested. It's a medical scandal that very few people apart from sufferers are aware of. For your information, I have been very proactive trying to get well- doing yoga, meditation, food elimination diet, acupuncture, hypnotherapy - never understanding why I was getting worse and worse. None of the holistic practitioners advised me about this condition- it is totally unknown.
Do you know how long the withdrawal period takes? On average 2 years. Thousands of people world-wide going through it- well documented resources available online.
I don't think you hate being rude actually, but happy to educate you- you're welcome!

Couldn't agree more. I am so fed up with fellow parents telling me they're taking their kids to the doctor abo this and that which is so easily fixed with somethingn from the pharmacist or booking a nurse appointment. And then the moaning about how awful the Dr was etc. the dr are actually pretty good at what they are meant to do

I could have been seen as 'that' patient the op mentioned in the original post. Recurrent pain, scans, blood tests, samples. One OOH GP asked me how I was coping with my mental health when there was nothing obvious, I felt so small. Another GP read the wrong number from a test result that was a high indication for ovarian cancer, told me it was 120+ when the baseline was 35, scared the life out of me. Only he was massively wrong my result was 37 and the receptionist told me the GP was junior and shouldn't have been giving the results without supervision. I did make an official complaint to the practice, it was an awful few days and I only found the error when I called back for more info on what the test meant as I couldn't take it in when the 1st doctor called. He genuinely lead me as nd my husband to believe that cancer would be the outcome of further tests. Imagine if that had been given to someone with extreme mental health that took there own life after taking that call.

Finally one of the GPS requested bloods for coeliac screening, he even said he wasn't expecting it to be that, just to rule it out. Thankfully for me it was high which lead to endoscopy and diagnosis of coeliac.

At my 1st appointment with the dietician, he was impressed it had taken me less than 2yrs for diagnosis as average is 13yrs and many people are misdiagnosed with conditions such as IBS.

I felt like a problem patient, it took
1 OOH
1 A&E
2 CT scans
6 telephone consultations
1 transvaginal scan
1 colonoscopy
1 endoscopy
Multiple bloods
Stool samples

How can you tell when ear ache is simple or something more serious though? The NHS guidelines say you should call your GP if a child's ear ache is recurrent or lasts longer than 3 days. So recurrent simple ear ache would require a GP appt on that basis.