To think it is a choice for teachers to work during summer holidays?

[antelopevalley]

I know five teachers in primary and secondary schools. During this summer holiday, two are doing work during the summer holidays. These two teachers are younger and very ambitious. The other three openly say they are doing no work over the summer.
So AIBU to think working over the summer is a choice?

In my experience, teacher workload is heavily influenced by individual school expectations and the school culture. This workload can spill out into the school holidays due to deadlines and expectations from SLT.

That. Schools vary hugely in their expectations. I was able to get away with just some evenings planning etc during the holidays, and a couple of days in school. But my daughter's SMT is ridiculously demanding in the detail and paperwork they demand, and the general level of work throughout the year. So she spends at least half of every holiday doing the equivalent of a full working day.

The poster implying that if their kids don't need to be in holiday club then teachers aren't working, is nuts. They WFH like so many people are doing, or take their kids into school because they can. Or like me, they do their work in the evening so they can enjoy the holiday daytime with their families. They can work whenever and wherever they like. There's no formal working day because it's their holiday.

The people who don’t think teachers do any work over the summer- what do you think, we just rock up on the first day in September with nothing prepared for the children? No exercise books, no labels, no plans made, no worksheets or PowerPoints, classroom exactly the same as it was left on the last day of term when the previous class left? How and when do you think all that gets done? OK, it’s not the same as our usual day job of being with the children or being in meetings and having marking and stuff to do, and yes you can do it with the radio blasting while eating sweets and looking after your own children/having them helping you (or do bits once they’re in bed) but there are still things that need done. What would be the point in lying or “having you on” about that?! I’m a primary teacher and in the last week of the holidays my 1.5 year old will be back at nursery (term time only place but I’ve booked her in in the last week, not counting the bank hol Monday) and my 8 year old will be coming in with me or spending time with grandparents while I get sorted.

However, despite needing to do this, YES- teachers do get lovely long holidays both in the summer and regular holidays at half terms. It’s one of the big benefits of the job. And as we teachers always say- to anyone jealous of these holidays and wants to have a go then feel free to train as a teacher!

Please PM me the names and addresses of the school they work at where they are able to put up all displays, tray and peg labels and move all their stuff into a new classroom before the end term - I want to work there!

I'm working now!
We have a new SEND online programme which records all our EHCP/IEP paperwork, targets etc. It will be great when it is up and running but all the historic paperwork needs uploading first. So I'm currently sitting here, uploading files from the school drive onto the online program. It's not exactly taxing but it needs doing. Currently uploading an individual file on my laptop, 57.65mb to go, so I'm being sidetracked by mumsnet. 😁
Once the file uploads, I will sort out the next one, then upload that. 2 pupils done, 10 more to go!

what do you think, we just rock up on the first day in September with nothing prepared for the children? No exercise books, no labels, no plans made, no worksheets or PowerPoints, classroom exactly the same as it was left on the last day of term when the previous class left

For me, this is fairly accurate, tbh. I teach secondary.

Exercise books are kept in the office and taken to classrooms.

We don’t have labels, maybe some secondary schools do.

Planning - if I’m teaching a new scheme of work or starting at a new school, I don’t tend to plan massively far in advance. So while I wouldn’t walk in on the first day with nothing planned, I wouldn’t need to spend days and weeks on it over the summer either.

worksheets and PowerPoints - as above

Classroom - it will have been cleaned and I have the kids their exercise books the last time I taught them. I’m moving classrooms this year so I emptied mine and moved anything I’m keeping to my new room.

I promise I am not being an arse here. If you work in a school where it’s expected everything is labelled before the kids even show up then you have to. But not everyone does or has to.

As others have said it is dependent on school expectations and role.

I don’t do loads in the holidays however do need to set up new classroom, label drawers, pegs , books , update displays etc. create seating plans, and plan the first couple of weeks back, write newsletters etc plus look at subject leadership action plan. I will do much of this in the evenings when the kids are in bed and will go in a couple of days to do classroom based stuff.

When I worked in younger years groups I would have spent more time in school as the classroom would have taken longer to set up.

Which is why pretty much every teacher will have different jobs to do over the summer! No two schools/teachers/SLTs are the same.

I’ve got training to deliver for inset o first Friday back, I work part time and Friday isn’t a work day, but there we go. I’m sure I could say no, but I’ve requested the training be included as it will make my life easier in the long term. I try not to do too much over holidays.

Also individual teachers' needs and responsibilities during the holidays affect how and when they prepare.
When my kids were young, I worked ridiculous hours in the evenings of the last month of term in order to not have to do a lot in the holiday. I was able to do a lot of planning in advance due to the nature of my work and school, so that helped get a lot out of the way. I was also lucky to have several TAs, so a lot of the practical classroom organisational stuff they were able to help with (and actively enjoyed).
I did recognise that I was very fortunate compared to a lot, though.

@Babymeanswashing My school is similar to yours. We do have labels but admin staff do them. I walk out in July and back in September. I may do some subject knowledge stuff if there's a new spec but that's better done as you go otherwise I'll forget it.

I’m in primary and we even have to order our own exercise books. Take stock in the stock room and see what’s already there. Work out how many of each we’re going to need on each class (different colour cover for maths- squares, English- lined, history, science, folders for French, RE etc). Fill in requisition form with products codes amounts and totals and submit to head teacher, also on the requisition- pencils, rubbers, sharpeners, whiteboard pens, glue sticks- if we don’t order them, we don’t get them. Sometimes the head comes back and questions something or quantity of something. Then when the order is delivered we have to check it all off on the delivery note to check correct, then distribute amongst our classes and type and print labels and label the books.

The boards are at least backed. I was a Reception teacher so I would display the paintings the children did on their induction days so they would have something of theirs displayed when they came in.

I know - I’ve always felt primary teachers get a raw deal with workload, tbh. But I also don’t think I’m a shit teacher because I don’t do all these things (I know you weren’t saying this Bernadette but from time to time it is said, or strongly insinuated that you can’t be doing your job properly if you aren’t slaving away in the holidays and I don’t think that’s true.)

Displays used to take me ages, I’m terrible at them.

Teachers who don't work in the holidays will have it all to do at the beginning of term which is much worse. The work still needs doing so it's a question of pacing yourself.

I have teacher friends. They probably work a couple of days, definitely not 40 hours + per week for the six weeks off though!

Plenty of jobs do some overtime, it's not something to fuss over imo.

Heady levels of ignorance, but don't let that stop you.

Probably because the teachers take them with them when they go into school. Last week I was in school along with about half the teachers plus a whole gaggle of their kids!

Reading this thread has reminded me that leaving teaching was a very wise choice.

If you work yourself into the ground, you're still never good enough.

Yet, a well-rested, well-informed and relaxed teacher who has a rich and varied life will always be the best kind of human to teach children, but the system makes that a bit like finding a white rhino.

However, in my 15 years of helping out at out-of-school clubs, i've not once seen a teachers kid attend.

That's because they work in the evenings, when the kids are playing at friends houses and at weekends when their kids other parent is around. Just because they don't use our of school clubs it doesn't mean they are not working.
I know a lot of teachers and I don't know one who doesn't work some of the time over the holidays. Not every day because they are entitled to a holiday too!

Can I ask what you are trying to get at OP? Surely it’s obvious no two teaching positions or schools are the same? I wouldn’t start a thread on doctor workload because I don’t know, and I respect they work hard but don’t feel the need to critique this.

A colleague in my primary school has had to move rooms. A new teacher is going into her old room. Here’s what she had to do last week.
Take down all displays in her old room, tidy all the cupboards, put all the stick away, ensure all the belongings her class forgot to take home are sent to their new classroom. Move al her personal stuff to the new classroom. Clean up.
In her new classroom - back all the boards. All 10 of them. Label trays, exercise books, coat pegs. Put all new stock away. Put all her personal stuff away. Organise reading records / books ready to take home on 1st day so parents don’t moan. Complete all planning and prep for 1st week back.

I’m not disbelieving what you are saying, @Soontobe60 , so I’m not really sure what you’re trying to say, tbh. I know some teachers work over holidays, either because they want to or because they have to. I also know many more don’t.

This. Another teacher bashing thread.

What exactly do you want to achieve, OP?

I go into school and work because I want to be prepared and do the best for my students in the new year. I want to concern myself with getting to know new students, not changes in the curriculum or making materials.

I am currently on holiday and have only bought 'souvenirs' and books for the classroom. Am constantly photographing rock formations (for example) and erosion to be able to give examples to students.

I prefer not to wing it. Of course, that's not everyone's style, but it works for me. (And most other teachers I know)

I've been teaching for 30 years. I can honestly say it depends on the circumstances but I've always gone in at least once or twice.
This year I'm changing year groups so that's a new classroom that needs setting up and new plans. Plus I'm taking on leadership for a different subject and my school has completely revised the whole curriculum so there's no historic planning - all planning is from scratch.
So whilst I'm very experienced, this summer is a 'working' summer whereas in the past, I've had the odd one where I've been able to do less.
But thanks for the inflammatory post OP! A bit of teacher-bashing always goes down well on MN!