Is teaching really that bad?

[Cremeegg456]

I did a secondary PGCE and gained a pass with Merit, and 'outstanding', that was 6 years ago and I've never completed my nqt year.
I know the PGCE isn't representative of what actual teaching is like though but I remember it being what seemed like a lot of unnecessary paperwork, but we also had the assignments on top.

I've done various work with young and elderly people since which I've enjoyed, but I've never made a lot more than minimum wage. Had zero hours contracts, agency work etc.

I did enjoy teaching but I am just not prepared to work evenings and weekends as well, it's just not worth having no life for me. Not prepared to work more than 45 hours a week.

But truthfully if I want a higher and more stable income I think I would have to go into it, if I'm thinking of buying a house, children etc in the next few years.

Would be interested to hear from people as to what their work life balance really is.

I’d like to add, I think the Irish teachers have it right!

I left 5 years ago, was a primary teacher.
Good points - 99% of any interaction with the children, decent wage, good holidays.
Bad points - everything else! Too much paperwork, too much pressure, no flexibility once you have your own children, working all evenings and weekends, no flexible working e.g time off for a medical appointment or a funeral as examples were massively frowned upon,

I'm always in the minority on these threads but I'm a primary teacher and I love it.

I think the school and SLT make an enormous difference, but I work 8-5 and never do anything outside those hours - no evenings, weekends or holidays.

We are a two form entry school so weekly planning is shared and done in PPA. I go in for 8 to set up for the day but the copying will be done for me by the reprograohics department.

We have a no marking policy so I look at the English/Maths books while eating my lunch and make a note of the children I need to check in with during the next lesson.

After school I have an hour long staff meeting every Monday, call parents, do other paperwork, reply to emails, update displays.

Obviously, parents evenings and writing reports take up more time at certain points of the year but then there are plenty of days where I go home early too.

I really do think SLT set the expectations in a school, and many misunderstand what Ofsted or parents are looking for.

The practice of teaching can be really fulfilling.

The crowd management and bureaucracy can be a killer.

Depends which one wins.

I also love the kids and the fact that every day is different. If you want to ditch a lesson to go and play rounders on a sunny day, you can. I think it's the best job in the world.

I'd like to earn more - the pay freeze was a kick in the teeth. And I do find it relentless sometimes - the constant smiling and cheerfulness in front of the children. You can't hide at your desk if you feel ill or have something upsetting going on in your personal life.

But I think the pay isn't bad for 39 weeks of work and there's a lot to be said for job security, a decent pension and generous sick pay.

Husband was an SEN teacher in a pru. No one should have to put up with getting smashed in the face on a weekly basis. A teaching assistant needed plastic surgery following one attack. It's damaged his physical and mental health and management and the government think it's acceptable!

I work in a small indie and on the whole enjoy it. However, I now work PT so I can keep up with what I have to do. I dropped down from a HOF to a PT teacher but still end up working late evenings. I also work on my days off.

The school I am at is a lot nicer than any state school. Classes are a bit smaller and behaviour is fine but the amount of monitoring, meetings, parents’ evenings etc is just too much. Being in the classroom is amazing but the rest sucks my soul.

I have taught for 20+ years and it is circumstances which keep me doing the job now. I would never encourage anyone to become a teacher. I think the difference between now and when I started is that the ownership for the pupils’ grades was on them, now it is on the teacher. We are also supposed to be pupils’ counsellors, social services, doctors, family liaison and often their parent. All the time we are taking full responsibility for their grades but being given no extra time or resources to do any of this. Morale in the profession is the lowest I have ever seen - this includes colleagues in all sorts of schools.

My advice: don’t do it.

This is so disheartening to read. Would people who have been teaching for 15 plus say anything has improved?

No, quite the opposite. It's got worse and worse. I've been a teacher for over 25 years. I mostly do supply teaching these days, because nobody will give me the 'proper' jobs I apply for (but don't really want except for the money) because I'm too expensive due to my experience and they want malleable 25 year-old cannon fodder).

Behaviour has got worse, funding has got worse, parent attitudes have got worse, workload has got worse, scrutiny has got worse (and does not make teaching better). Headteachers appear to have also got worse (presumably because of the type of people prepared to rise up through the ranks in the current culture in schools).

@twominutesmore - wow! That sounds amazing! Two form entry does make a difference and having someone to do copying etc. I am currently in a one form entry and didn't have a TA last year so all fell to me! It was so hard. Having previously taught in bigger schools the workload is definitely less, usually only have to lead one subject too.

I have never taught anywhere I could ditch the lesson and teach rounders though, although remember it fondly from my childhood ,wouldn't have space for a start.

My DH is a maths Lead Prac. He is busy during school hours, never stays more than an hour after school and only has work in evening / weekends if he has exams to mark. Up until COVID he found teaching a doss, now it's a lot more pressure etc. but in terms of workload, he has it pretty easy and never works in the 13 weeks of holiday.

The other problem with the urging people to work in private schools is they aren’t plentiful in some areas. There are only two within reasonable commuting distance to where I live, one is where my own child will go, so if I wanted to work in a private school I’d have the choice of one!

I grew to absolutely hate it.
I am so glad to be out. The holidays are not worth the stress of the rest of the time.

It astounds me just how much teachers are expected to do in addition to teaching or linked after school activity. Going to theatre to see a play also being studied for instance.
Why so much social work? Why expected to monitor friend groups?
Why are teachers expected to ensure trainers and other clothing is kept together?
Obviously depends on age group but some requests on MN about diet and ensuring they finish their sandwich is unrealistic.
Similarly why 'police' lunch boxes at all? It is the parents responsibility to provide age appropriate food to get the child through the day. How they do it is not up to the school.

@Sleepingonmyfeet

The other problem with the urging people to work in private schools is they aren’t plentiful in some areas. There are only two within reasonable commuting distance to where I live, one is where my own child will go, so if I wanted to work in a private school I’d have the choice of one!

The other problem with private schools is that they are increasingly opting out of the pension scheme.

@James83

It astounds me just how much teachers are expected to do in addition to teaching or linked after school activity. Going to theatre to see a play also being studied for instance. Why so much social work? Why expected to monitor friend groups? Why are teachers expected to ensure trainers and other clothing is kept together? Obviously depends on age group but some requests on MN about diet and ensuring they finish their sandwich is unrealistic. Similarly why 'police' lunch boxes at all? It is the parents responsibility to provide age appropriate food to get the child through the day. How they do it is not up to the school.

Parents are the only thing I dislike about the job. Most are fantastic but my goodness the pushy minority can make life very difficult indeed.

I am questioned on every aspect of teaching and receive emails into the small hours about utter nonsense that parents used to take charge of.

Parents used to tell their kids off if they lost their coat or their trainers, or didn't do their homework, or got in trouble at school, or did badly in a test, or didn't eat all their dinner, but now they tell me off instead.

I wish people would understand that we are human and have days where we are less than perfect. I might forget to remind your child to have a drink because I've got 33 other children, and his drink is on the desk right there in front of him.

Today's telling off was one of my children going home without their umbrella. I didn't know they had one. I stopped them at the door and made them put their hood up. Parents need me to find it and meet them in reception before school tomorrow.

All the other bits are ace.

I love it. Most of the time. Its tiring, busy, and you are never done with anything!

But ..I am at a very well managed school with a very fair and trusting Senior Team. I've been there a while and have established some great resources. I teach a practical 'less important' non core subject. I'm not a perfectionist. If I miss deadlines for some crappy paperwork task then I miss it particularly if I've been dealing with a kid who has been bullied/has issues at home etc. I prioritise my workload. We also have a bloody good union at our school.
If I was in some of the schools/academy chains instead about I'd have been managed out years ago!

Wow twominutesmore is this a standard state school?

Our schools have to follow the prescribed timetable and there is tons of marking!!!! I was reading elsewhere about the tons of marking a supply teacher was expected to do.

I havent heard of classes being flexible enough to just go play rounders for many years (but it was like that when i was at school and think your school sounds great!)

I’ve been teaching for 22 and it’s relentless. You can never do everything that is expected and I work at least 11 hours a day and probably 5 hours over the weekend. Parents complain constantly and behaviour is challenging.

There are rewards and positives but, honestly, I’m exhausted. If I could earn what I need doing something else I’d leave.

Another teacher here to tell you that yes, it is that bad. I'm saying this as someone who went into teaching later in my adult life so I do have experience of other jobs and career options.

@OutlookStalking

Wow twominutesmore is this a standard state school?

Our schools have to follow the prescribed timetable and there is tons of marking!!!! I was reading elsewhere about the tons of marking a supply teacher was expected to do.

I havent heard of classes being flexible enough to just go play rounders for many years (but it was like that when i was at school and think your school sounds great!)

It is. I know I'm lucky. We can't be the only one though surely! As long as we teach the objectives over the year, I can plan my week how I want to. All of our slt also have teaching commitments so they are interested in cutting workload and only implement things that improve learning (so no triple backed display requirements). We are Ofsted outstanding and received much praise for leadership and teacher wellbeing. Wish more schools would realise that pointless tasks that don't improve learning are a waste of everyone's time.

I work with schools in a senior role.

I've just returned from one school where today I have

• supported one teacher in tears, overwhelmed by her workload and had been treat terribly by a TA she was performance managing
• supported a deputy head teacher under performance measures
• received two resignations from teachers

....and another resignation from the head!

Awful out there.

Just to offer an alternate view: I'm head of a core subject in a large 11-18 secondary school.

I never, ever take work home in the evenings but do occasionally do a couple of hours of marking on the weekends.

The latest I'm home is 5pm once a week after meetings and I have a 4 year old. I went back full time when they were 9 months old.

Lesson wise, it's just adapting for classes as the specs haven't changed for a few years. HOD wise, I've been doing it a few years so processes are in place and I have a very good and stable staff.

Doesn't need to be overwhelming!

I'm a secondary English teacher, and I'm always so horrified by these posts. I bring work home around three times a year, usually after we've had e.g. mocks, or reports are due, etc. I never, ever work on a Sunday and never, ever will. I get into school around half eight, leave around half four, except on Fridays when I'm out the door about ten minutes after the bell. Off now for two days for St Patrick's Day, and won't think about school, not even so far as to check my emails, until Monday morning. I really feel for anyone teaching in England, it sounds completely unsustainable.

I also never, ever work on a Saturday!

@Cremeegg456

Do you think a PGCE would lend itself to other roles? I have a friend who's a head of department and says she never does any work outside of school of stays late which is incredible

Your friend can do this because she has dumped hours of extra work on her staff. They will be at home working until 11pm and weeping