To get back together with him?

[turtle16]

Hi all, I’m very new to this my first post.
Two years ago I split up with my DP of 8 years (married 5) due to his anger issues and taking it out on my DS and DD. We also have a DD together and he also started to lose his temper with her. He would swear and call them very nasty names.
He was on meds and exercising and we had some great times - years in fact, but then he decided to stop taking the meds, he got injured and stopped exercising and so he was quick to lose his temper again.
I decided enough was enough and we split when on holiday summer 2018.
He had a break down and got help, he’s back on meds and has been seeing a counsellor. He’s in a better place and I can see he is really trying to change, and I think he has somewhat.
We’re thinking about officially being back together as a couple as he’s been staying here in lock down during the week when I only have our DD here and then when I have my other two he goes to his place.
My two don’t want to ever love with him again and say they don’t want to really see him or even try. Their dad also says why would I want to even give him a chance when he mentally abused them.
I’m a Christian and believe in forgiveness and the value of marriage if the other person is willing to fight and change themselves for the better.
But AIBU to even consider it when my two children are so against it. DD that we have together would love nothing more.

[Somethingkindaoooo]

Your updates are awful!!
I don't think I've ever said that, ever.

So you resent your son because you left your husband?

Honestly OP!!

Did you grow up believing that children are important, or that they should be seen and not heard?

Did you grow up believing that men are more important than children?

Of course marriage is important. But only ( only!!) WHEN BOTH parties treat it as such,and treat each other with dignity, love and respect.

Did your partner treat you with respect? Of course not- if he could treat your children that way.

And what was the condition he needed meds for?

[Whiskeylover45]

turtle16 I understand, but if god understands all, he will understand you putting your children first here. If you are both looking to buy separately, then it may be a good idea to nip it in the bud now. How old is your youngest DD?

I only ask because having dad around may confuse her if hes suddenly not there when you move IYSWIM. Then her behaviour might be affected. I do wonder as well how much his abuse affected you, that your prepared to take him back this easily. Also if your ex won't allow the children to be near him unless extended family are there, then again you will have to ask yourself why. Are there elements to the abuse that your not aware of? Such as did it happen more than you are aware ect?

I understand hes done that and I appreciate it. But part of understanding you've done wrong is accepting the other party may not want to know, and to take responsibility for that. He will need to keep on at this with actions rather than words, but ultimately accept they amy not want anything to do with him. If they do it will be down to time and them seeing he has changed. He should also be doing this anyway, and doing it from outside their home to prove he has their best interests at heart. But be prepared for the long haul in this, and that it may not happen.

I think this man has got in your head and distroyed a lot of your confidence and seeing what is acceptable and what isnt, and the best thing to do now is work on getting him out of your head, and doing that means any contact you have is about your DD and nothing more. Explain that your still trying to work through things that's have happened yourself and would appreciate it if he could give you space to do so. Explain that while you are unsure about things, it's not fair to your DD that he keeps coming over. That he did what he did, it's great he accepts it and is working on it? but you think it would be more beneficial to your older children as well if he could give you all space to work through things.

His reaction to this will be telling.

If he is really sorry he will accept this, and do whatever it takes to make you all comfortable for however long. If he makes the right noises but backtracks and puts pressure on you, you know he doesnt understand nor care about the full ramifications of what he has done.

Give it a year, see how his actions match his words as yours pend that time healing yourself and focusing on your children, especially your son as it sounds like he needs his mum to put him first and do whatever it takes to repair the damage to your relationship
. Maybe look at the freedom programme to help. Doing these things will go in your favour for DS as he will see his mum doing everything she can to protect them, and to ensure it doesnt happen again.

[Whiskeylover45]

Also, and again I speak from experience here, if the minister himself is placing marriage vows above children then I think it's best you find a new church. I say that as someone who spent years trying to find the right one after attending a particularly bad evangelical one, where the sanctity of marriage vows was placed above childrens welfare/domestic violence and the man was "the head of the house" which basically allowed him to get away with anything he fancied

[IM0GEN]

Your minster and his wife say that your ex seems like a nice man? Your Minister sounds remarkably naive - is he newly qualified ? What denomination do you attend ?

Most Christian clergy would consider that your husband broke your marriage vows when he abused you and your young children. And that you would be Unwise to get back together with him.

Forgiveness does not mean putting you and your children at risk again.

If you are convinced that he has changed, the way to tell is stop providing meals and sex for him, don't have him in your house at all. Don’t be friends and only have contact over DD.

And watch Very carefully how he parents your DD when she Lives at his house.

Do this for two years and you will then see if his change is genuine.

Then it might be safe to date him again.

[turtle16]

Thanks @Whiskeylover45

I hadn’t heard of the freedom programme I’ve just googled it and it looks really good.

[Magicra84]

Put your children first and stop shagging the man who fucked with your kids heads. It's not on!

[IWantT0BreakFree]

This is quite close to home for me. After an explosive row this week, I am currently weighing up whether to go NC with my mother permanently (already am with my father. They are currently separated for the millionth time) who allowed my father to abuse us verbally, mentally and occasionally physically throughout our childhoods. All she can say is she loves him/she did her best/she believes marriage is forever and didn't want to end it/she didn't want to be alone blah blah blah. Excuses. Similar to the excuses that you are making.

I suggest you think extremely carefully about where your priorities lie. If your children are your priority (which they bloody well should be) then you need to behave like it and don't even suggest that you will bring someone who abused them back into their home. The rejection and pain of knowing that your mother could continue to love someone who she knows has abused you is unreal. It has dogged me throughout my life and I don't think I will ever get over it. On top of the rejection, her allowing the abuse to continue basically signalled that she condoned it and it affected my self esteem massively in terms of the way I was prepared to allow other people to treat me. The impact of this dynamic of abusive father (or stepfather in your son's case) and mother who failed to protect me has been immense. It doesn't seem like you comprehend the hurt that you could cause your son here. He is obviously already in pain if he's acting out at your house.

[WhatIsLife20]

Your knickers need to be kept on and your children put first. Sorry to be so harsh but you probably need to hear it

[Dozer]

Staying with him is not, IMO, even the “Christian thing to do”. When it’s so clearly to your DCs’ direct detriment.

Even if your church leaders/friends are saying otherwise.

[turtle16]

So I prayed and prayed and fell asleep crying for God to guide me. The next morning the first thing I saw when I turned on my phone was this post from a lady at church on our church group page. My relationship is now over.
Thank you to everyone who replied. Some of you were harsh but I would never intentionally put a man above my kids, but I think hearing everyone’s views especially those with a Christian background gave me the wake up call I needed.
Onwards and upwards!!

[Dozer]

Sorry you had a bad night, but glad you’re intending to become free of this person. As some PPs have mentioned, please do look into the Freedom Programme, and read up on emotional abuse.

[Yeahnahmum]

Christian believes can get you in a world of shit sometime... Sigh I am happy you found the only good answer out there :no (to restart your marriage)

[hugefanofcheese]

I'm glad I read to the end before commenting and note that you are not planning to continue with your ex. Good.

The bit about your son not appreciating you leaving an abuser and making yourself a single parent makes you sound very whiny and selfish, possibly due to conditioning by an abusive man, possibly not. I don't know. Your son does not owe you thanks for protecting him, that is what parents should do. He will know you have been sleeping with the ex again. This will make him feel very uncertain and belittled. If you're minimising the anger and abuse, consider would you be doing the right thing if it was sexual or physical abuse instead of mainly verbal? None are any position to put a child in.

Your minister is useless, frankly. If he hasn't had any adult and child safeguarding training giving him an awareness of domestic abuse or toxic relationships he is not fit for the role. I would be thinking of moving to a different church. Reserve your Christian compassion for your kids. Don't use it as an excuse to give this man another chance because you are lonely.

[crimsonlake]

I am glad you have come to the right decision, but deep down I think you will actually let this situation carry on.

[Flyingagainstreason]

I think you need to really try and repair your relationship with your son. You said you don’t think he even likes me- I mean are you surprised. You only left a man who abused him because it was starting to affect your youngest, whilst that night not be completely true, he may well see it like this. And he’s probably scared shitless life will go back to how it was.

Perhaps take some advice from your faith on how to repair the damage that’s been done

[NameChange84]

I’m a Christian. I don’t think God would be ok with me allowing a man to emotionally abuse my children. My parents stayed together because of religion and both emotionally abused me in the process. It scars you for life and makes you more likely to end up in an abusive marriage because you’ve grown up believing you are worthless and deserve abuse. I could never put my own children through that and think it’s awful when people use religion as an excuse for allowing their children to be abused and turning a blind eye.

Your “sacred” marriage is not a good enough reason to stay with a man who’s harmed your children. I’m pretty sure God would agree with me on that.

[MiddleAgedLurker]

A close family member got all the stuff about the sanctity of marriage from her church when her (serial adulterer) husband claimed to be sorry. Cue years more of unhappiness and emotional abuse, and deep lack of confidence/self esteem. That you have been contemplating taking him back suggests that you have low self esteem OP, so get some professional help with that (your GP can signpost). You have been strong before and you can do it again. Your kids deserve better and so do you. Btw, my relative is now in a happy and nurturing relationship. It can be done! Stick to your guns and do what is right, as 100% of people who have no vested interests on here have agreed. Good luck to you

[Divebar]

OP I’ve met lots of abusive men during the course of my work who’ve been absolutely charming... to me and everyone around me. Probably because they were locked up in a police cell for battering their wives and wanted to get out. They were completely believable so the fact that other people think he’s nice or has changed means nothing really. I’ve also sadly dealt a case of child sexual abuse where the perpetrator was a known paedophile who came out of prison for child sex offences and was practically adopted by a Christian family because they believed In forgiveness and thought he’d learnt his lesson. Turns out he hadn’t. Forgiveness was not theirs to give and I don’t think is yours to give either - it’s for your children, and seemingly they don’t want to give it. Incidentally your DS ( as a 13 year old) is not in a position to moderate his emotions very well yet and was taught by your DP at a very early age that shouting and verbal abuse is the way you deal with things. Your DP has imprinted that message on his developing brain. You’ve got some work to do with him to change that because those structures can be quite fixed depending on the age he was at the time of the abuse. Don’t be complacent about that because this is the learning we take into
adulthood. Good luck though moving forward... it looks like your first MN post has proved helpful.

[DPotter]

Turtle

I am pleased you have decided to step away from this man.
I find quite chilling that he started to attend your church and inveigle his way back into your life through charming your friends and the minister. I find it hard to believe a competent counsellor would think that starting to attend your ex's church was a good move for an abusive spouse, without asking 'permission' from the ex.

I think you need to find support away from your church. If he continues to attend your church, you will probably find yourself under pressure to take him back, and even worse, the children may find themselves under pressure as well.
Marriage is only 'sacred' because religious society has deemed it so. What could be more naturally sacred than giving birth to a child.

[JRUIN]

Date him and sleep over at his if you must, but do not let the man who emotionally abused your kids back into your home. That would be horrendously unfair on them

[turtle16]

Just wanted to give an update. I didn’t take him back!!!
I have managed to buy my own house without and the divorce has been filed!!
The children all seem happier and I am happier.
Onwards and upwards!

[eatsleepread]

Are you for real? It would be tantamount to child abuse, shacking up with this man again when your older children don't want it

[tobedtoMNandfart]

That's great news. All the very best to you.

[tobedtoMNandfart]

@eatsleepread RTFT!

[JackieTheFart]

Are you serious @eatsleepread? OP bumps her own post to update and you don’t even read it? Her update will be the only reason you even found it!

@turtle16 well done! Onwards and upwards