To think relying on working tax credits and housing benefit is a bad idea

[InkedGreen]

My sister has a very decent amount coming in every month - similar to what I have as a professional with 10+ years experience.

However it's all top up earnings and she's on a low paid job two days a week.

She's quite happy to stay on 2 days even though all her children are at school.

Aibu to think she's foolish to rely on these topups and not try to get a better job or increase her hours? If they try to reform benefits she could very quickly be very poor and I'm concerned even if she isn't!

[malificent7]

Yanbu to think it is far from ideal but yabvu to start ANOTHER benefit bashing thread.
I've heard it so many times before and it's very clear what society thinks about single mums..."how dare she pop out kids so she can sit on her arse spending taxpayers money/ why should we fund this?..."blah, blah, blah.
Whilst on the other hand deeply criticising any mother who is not there for her kids " what's the point of having kids if you aren't thete for them. " type thinking.
So the ideal woman is a woman who is married to a wealthy man who can afford to take on an undemanding job during school hours so she is there for her kids after school. However, if you are single you are a paracite and should work all hours to fund your kids.
I hate this attitude...and i say this as a hard working single mum who has done ft, pt and all in between. Often in very demanding jobs such as teaching in referal units and nhs work.

[malificent7]

So many work ft and still need benefits...its criminal.
Should have become and investment banker in my youth...dammit!

[ReanimatedSGB]

FFS. Easy to see why this country is such a mess, with ignorant smuggoes ranting on about how benefits should be cut even further when wages have remained stagnant for decades while housing costs have soared; more and more public sector jobs are being switched over to agencies - which take a cut while reducing the wages recieved by the people doing the actual work - and many necessary tasks are now automated out of existence. Lots of people on top-up benefits are working long hours in more than one job and still can't manage to house and feed themselves on their families because of low wages. The fetishisation of work for its own sake is bullshit and does no good: you retain more self-respect by claiming benefits you are legally entitled to than by wearing yourself out doing a shitty, underpaid, insecure job that serves no particular purpose - what benefit is there to anyone in you sitting in a call centre, ringing people to ask them if they want to change their energy supplyer and getting told to fuck off for eight hours a day, for instance?

[DungeonDweller]

Daffodil101 honestly I feel the same. I'm not a huge mega earner but do need a degree, it's not been worth it though. Years at uni doing the masters so I could stand out in a specific area, working for employment at least an hour's commute from home, expected to be seeing clients at 9am so need to set up & logged in by 8.30.. leaving the office at 6.30pm on a "good" day... Getting to see kids for 30min max on a good day!
What the fuck was it all for.
Then I read posts on here from people willingly working 16hrs a week in no stress, no risk jobs getting all the time with kids and same (sometimes better) NET pay!
And that's interesting actually, because while I earn 34k as a professional, I don't see 34k into my pocket after tax, ni, commute cost, childcare, and so on.

While I would advocate my DC getting a professional job, I would also flag that hard work and 60hr work weeks in a stressful job is as idiotic as relying fully on benefits... In short, Don't make my mistake again!!

[malificent7]

Well im on universal credit and im a ft student plus work and i can assure you that i get nowhere near in the region of 34 k a year.
If being on benefits is so cosy why not jack it all in and sign on? Because some people value work personally ( i do) and have what it takes to earn well and others don't.

[malificent7]

Sorry i missread the stuff about you not seeing 34 k. If you got a less demanding but less well paid job during school hours and term time only you could see your kids more? Tempted? Thought not.

[bluebeck]

Totally agree with SGB

Divide and Rule.

[Sotiredofthislife]

@Wonderland18. It is perfectly possible to have 2 incomes and still be entitled to benefits. You may not be entitled to benefits, it that doesn’t mean others aren’t. Some benefits aren’t means tested either, making people on high incomes eligible. Facts are very wrong.

[Doodlebugx]

You should let your sister enjoy this while she can

[Crustytoenail]

Can some of the benefits experts on here tell me how to 'work the system and earn as much as ft work sitting on my arse and working a token 16 hours' please?
You all seem to know it happens, and therefore as someone who's always been a single parent, in a low paid job, working anywhere from 30-60 hours a week depending on work availability, I'd like to know how it works!
I earn a little above NMW, I do currently between 40 and 50 hours a week, DD in ft education but old enough now so no childcare. Social housing (so lowest rent around) and budget everything else and I'm still in receipt of a small amount of WTC and CTC - why? Because even the fucking government realise that what I earn isn't enough to live on, and raise a child on alone. They have chosen to implement things like WTC rather than chase absent parents for their share of bringing up the child they helped create, or enforcing a wage to be paid that meet a basic standard of living. Imo DDs father should be making up that shortfall. I don't have enough to force him legally and the services that are supposed to haven't. My employer should also be paying a living wage, but I count myself lucky I earn more than nmw - because of the hours and dedication I have put in, just about everyone else in the same job role is on NMW. But it's an unskilled job, it's hard work and has a level of responsibility you probably wouldn't expect at all, and employers want to pay as little as possible and not invest in training and retaining decent staff. I'm also paying for courses to improve and increase my knowledge - birthday and Christmas presents from family mainly.
It's fucking hard and soul destroying. It wrecked my mental health a few years ago, and pushed me over the edge. I encounter people with the benefits scrounger rhetoric day in day out who are quite happy to use the services provided by my employer for the lowest cost possible, and yet still demand that people like me are the ones who should be socially responsible. Fwiw I opened my weeks payslip last night - I paid the equivalent in tax and ni as I'll 'get back' in WTC and CTC this week, talk about a pointless exercise.

[Moominfan]

Crustytoenail

It's soo wrong, my child's father pays 80 a month but recently forked out for a hair transplant. Self employed so plays the system

[Silverke]

Tbf it all depends on the age of her children..

I am a single mother with a DD just starting school and I work part time 3 days a week.. The amount I was paying for nursery fees alone was basically mortgage payments.. so my wages were gone. I don't have that kind of support system where I can get someone to watch my child whilst I work or and I am not able to afford childcare either.. so the top ups I was getting would just about cover bills food rent etc..

I would like to work full time or be able to study something to have a career but in my case it is not practical for me right now..

That might be the case with your sister. As I said it all depends on the age of her children.. Children in high school can practically look after themselves but if she has younger children maybe she's just waiting for them to get older...

Try speaking to her and find out where her head is at, then if shes happy doing two days a week then you have to leave her to it.. she's an adult!

[MellowBird85]

@mummymeister

Totally agee

[Moomin8]

It's all very well to say 'get a better job' as if it's really that simple

People like OP annoy me. No empathy whatsoever.

[Moomin8]

I can tell you first hand that the government does not encourage people on low incomes to be in full time work. You generally are much worse off if you are working full time on minimum wage than on 16 hours a week. But you get 'top ups' even if full time.

This is the government's fault. Snooty people whose glib response is to simply 'get another job' would soon be moaning if nobody did the lower paid jobs.

[sammy69]

It a shame you all feel the sister is yaking from someone else she realy isnt she working and raising her children it not the fault of single parents the wages are not at living wage ther alot wrong but it not your sister that the problem. People are also forgetting the children will be looking after and supporting people with disabilitys and illness later on in life they need the care of their parents toteach them compassion and kindness . Im a single working parent i have one full time job two part time jobs and i still need the top ups it doesnt matter what i do or how hard i work unfortunatly i still dont earn enough i also see very little of my children dont penalise this lady for raising her kids after 13years i have three children btw and my eldest is 13 ive realised your attitudes and that of the government are false hope ive paid thousands out in childcare with help from government ive worked shifts studied I also left school with decent gcse im now workin three jobs one is 42hours and the other two are when im availble i work nights and days and what heart breaking is i realise now that ive missed out on those important times with my children due to attitudes like yours thinking i can achieve more a comfortable earning we dont want to be rich and it unfortunate alot of men dont bear the brunt of the cost of raising a child ive realised that im financially better off raising them alone due to the fact the men havent provided by spending the money they earn mainly on themselves if were not raising our children u hav to ask who will taking more or penalising single parents isnt the answer guys and after everyshift i come home clean cook their meal for the next day as my mum is disabled n my dad cares for her so it takes pressure off of them when they have them i also pay for after school clubs so i can work by the time i get to bed after doing all the things your sister does on her days off i may get to bed by one in the morning twelve if im lucky then im up at six the next day i end up pretty much working nearly every day i may have one or two days off a month now ask your selves do u all really want this for ur sister or any single parent i know at sum point il burn out i just hope it after theyve grown so at least they can support themselves at that point. Please wake up people single working parents are not the enemy

[TheCatsACunt]

People are quick to say that living costs are too high so people need to rely on benefits.

Living costs are high due to benefits, in part.

If more people who were able to work actually did so, everyone would be better off.

[InkedGreen]

I resent being said I'm uncompassionate and bashing benefits. I haven't commented about the benefits my concern is my sister's reliance on them and the longer she's on them for the more difficult her life will get when they change.

That's not being uncompassionate or bashing benefits!

[ConfCall]

I don’t see this as a bashing thread. I see this as a thread started by someone who is anxious about a financially vulnerable relative who’s possibly made poor decisions.

OP she’s taking a risk but at least she has a job of sorts, and can request more hours if necessary or go to a full time job in the same industry. I think that when the rug is pulled it will be a lot easier for her than for someone who isn’t in work at all and is starting from scratch. Try not to worry.

[xcxcsophiexcxc]

It's a bit unfair to judge so many parents for not going back full time.
I could go back full time and earn 36k...yet the cost of the childcare would put me worse off plus allowing little time to spend with my two year old . Where's the sense in that. So no I'll keep my 3 day a week job.
More focus needs to be made of affordable childcare to make parents want to work. Even with a well paid job it's not enough for a single parent like me where if I went back full time I'd b more than my living costs for childcare.

[Shutupseaguls]

I hate having to rely on benefits. I'm a single mum of three, work full time and I'm studying. My wages only cover the bills so we rely on the small amount of tax credits for living. We don't get free school meals etc because I work ft.

Meanwhile my ex is fighting having to pay an extra tenner on the £200 month he pays towards his children while boasting about his new bikes and big bonuses.

[Silverke]

It's a no win situation for single parent households. You're damned if you do and damned if you don't. If they made childcare more affordable more parents would work more hours.. but the more hours you work the worse off you are.. I know parents working full-time that are struggling and are considering cutting down their hours just to get a little bit of help.

[ReanimatedSGB]

@TheCatsACunt "People are quick to say that living costs are too high so people need to rely on benefits.

Living costs are high due to benefits, in part.

If more people who were able to work actually did so, everyone would be better off"

Spectactular economic illiteracy there. Living costs are high due to wages being held down and property speculation.

And low pay is actually harmful to the whole of society. When the vast majority of people are paid less than they need to live on, the economy goes into decline: the quickest way to fix the UK's problems would be to give poor people more money, unconditionally.

[HelenaDove]

"In the 'olden days' people's attitudes were very diffferent to benefits. My grandfather was very proud of the fact he didn't ever receive any, my great grandma proud as punch that she was the only one in the care home paying for herself"


My exes dad was the same Proud as punch that he never claimed anything.

His son who i was dating told me the other side of it, When his dad lost his job and was unemployed for months he refused to claim because he was too proud. What his son and his other adult children remembered was that every meal at home was mushroom soup. Breakfast lunch and dinner. EVERY MEAL for months on end.

My ex got incredibly upset and angry when telling me about it and the resentment was still there decades later. Yet the old man would moan at his three adult daughters for not doing his ironing.

He put his pride BEFORE his kids. You are supposed to put your kids first.................not your fucking pride.

Decades later my ex could not even look at mushroom soup without feeling ill.

[HelenaDove]

Can i ask if there are any on this thread who employ cleaners or
childminders?

Do you pay them enough so they dont have to claim top ups?

Do any of you have an elderly relative in a care home. Would you be okay with a demand for you to pay an increase in fees from said care home so the care workers there can have a wage rise?