Making another adult say please/thank you!

[mummyhaschangedhername]

For clarity, I often have to shake myself because I say thank you so often and often at inappropriate times. Like those people how say "I love you" to customers or their boss, it a bit of a brain fart for me. My emails automatically Sign off Thanks as I use it so often.

Anyway. I help out at a school, I'm on the PTA and a Governor, but I also help out with whatever needs done and volunteer for most things going on there.

There is a new temporary office staff, I often have to ask her for things as we store PTA money in the office or to get keys etc. I usually use her name and will say something like, "can you do me a favour" and request what I need. She has three times stopped me and asked me what the magic word was and twice said "if you were a child I would be telling you to say please and thank you". For reference I do always say thank you anyway. But I am getting irked by being called out in an office for being impolite. One of the times she did this, I had just said "that's great, you're a star" and she still called me out on this.

All my kids reports always say how polite they are.

There is some undercurrents in the school so I am not sure if this is to do with this, but frankly I'm fed up of it. It happened so many times now. I'm in the school helping them out, all staff have to go ask to get stuff, I'm not making more work, In fact the opposite. As it is we "borrow" staff from other schools to support our office staff as there are some major issues going on, I am involved in some staff disciplinary actions and while I know the staff don't know the details I think they don't like me because of that. I don't care if she likes me or not, but she doesn't dare do it in front of senior leadership and I can see her smirk 😏 when she does it to me to the kitchen staff.

I guess I find it irking that an adult would instruct another adult in this manner. I am being grateful, I do say thank you, I can surely express gratitude my saying, "that's brilliant" or whatever without a script saying "please may I".

I'm not confrontational but looking for a funny reply that gets my point across but isn't too catty. Unless everyone actually believes AIBU and my conversations need to be scripted that that manner.

[Michaelbaubles]

I’m thinking about my daily interactions with people I work closely with and if we’re all sitting near one another and need a favour I don’t think we’d say please. We might say “X, when you have a moment could you read this through for me?” - and then a thank you if if they say yes - but you’re all there to do work surely and don’t need effusiveness at any stage? The please is implicit in asking in a polite tone.

“Hey X, could you pass me that stapler that’s next to you? Cheers.” That sort of exchange is most often used. If I say “excuse me, X, please pass me the stapler when you have a moment. Thank you so much” they’d all think I’d gone mad.

[mummyhaschangedhername]

@Michaelbaubles - YES exactly ... that's exactly what I do and what I thought was considered normal.

But i am fully prepared to just say it from now on given the feedback on here. I have ALWAYS said thank you or thanks, I just didn't expect to have to say please every time as well when I am asking what I considered to be politely. But like I say, clear at least half the people on here consider me rude so I'll definitely try harder with her.

[Joey7t8]

I hate it when people think saying please and thank-you make it ok to ask for something in an arsey tone of voice. They’re not magic words.

[mummyhaschangedhername]

@Joey7t8 - I know. I've encountered a few people like that, who SAY all the right things but imply very different things with their tone, .

My Dad once taught me that one sentence can mean many different things, for example "I never said she stole the money", if you out intent on anyone of those words it can make the sentence read very differently.

It's weird in this case as she seems happy for my help, she is chatty with me but her comments have Bebe notice but i May well be because I am in the wrong. So lesson learnt.

[bluegreygreen]

Please and thank you are absolute basics - that's why they are taught so early to children.

To me, asking for something without saying please sounds much more like an order, and I would find the 'gushing' gratitude you describe really annoying - it's just waffle, and isn't likely to be needed in any scenario you've described so far.

[FriarTuck]

@FriarTuck - so why is ok for you to drop the please I'm an email but not verbally?
Because in the email the thank you is clearly seen straight after where the please would be so I think the thank you (in whatever form) is effectively a please and thank you in one. In conversation you might be saying thank you after someone has done something so the first bit needs an acknowledgement e.g. you say 'A, could you chuck me over the stapler please?' She passes it over. You say 'thank you'. If you'd left the please off it doesn't sound as polite and she might throw the stapler instead of passing it because she doesn't know you'll then say thank you.
As a note - if you email a request with a thank you in it, I think you should still email another thank you afterwards when the person has replied.

[HollowTalk]

When my son was little he had a friend who would blurt out "Please, sorry, thank you" all the time in the hope that one of them was right

[mummyhaschangedhername]

@FriarTuck - I do reply with thanks you after the reply or completion of task.

Thank you for explaining.

[SleepingStandingUp]

Just say please.

it's just I'll count up trip money and ask her to counter check "can you count this please?" Wait for her to do it. "" Thanks!"
I'll ask her for an envelope or stapler" ooh can I borrow your stapler please? " wait for her to hand it you" thanks"
I will then maybe ask for the class lists "have you got a copy of the list please?" wait for her to hand it to you "thanks"

Surely that's normal manners? You don't get to opt out of being polite because you volunteer, and buying chocolates at Christmas to show your gratitude to them doesn't make it OK to be rude.

[SmarmyMrMime]

Please and thank you can be said with great sarcasm in a very rude way

Tone and a polite manner of asking matters more to me than the exact words of please and than you.
She's been rude and patronising to talk down to you like a child, much more rude than expressing gratitude without an excplicit usage of "thank you"

[mummyhaschangedhername]

@SleepingStandingUp - fair enough! Point taken! 👍

[Armadillostoes]

OP YANBU-The majority of posters on here are confusing form with substance and worse encouraging pandering to this genuinely rude woman!

[SleepingStandingUp]

I'm just annoyed at using please to ask she she wants something filed
Well "do you want me to file anything" isn't a please question
You don't need to ask "please can you tell me what you want filing". You just ask if there's any filing or other work to do. Then she should say"oh yeah, can you file this please?" and you say" yes sure" and she says thank you.

I just find it monotone well I find "can you" monotone so in future I'll just say"pass me the stapler" and hold my hand out. Does that work for you??

[sweeneytoddsrazor]

@Michaelbaubles you can say please without all the extras though. A simple can you pass me the stapler please fred is perfectly polite and acceptable. No need for all the when you have a minute nonsense.

[ReleaseTheBats]

You sound an intelligent and socially competent person OP. The fact that you are having to analyse exactly which words you use when asking for a stapler to avoid offence or being spoken to like a child suggests to me there is more going on in this situation than your manners or lack thereof. Sounds totally exhausting tbh. I'm just wondering whether the member of staff wants you to be helping her.

[mummyhaschangedhername]

@SmarmyMrMime - I did use thank you, I just didn't use please as well!

Given so many people said I was in the wrong I'm guessing she just thinks the same way so I'll make sure I include in future. Glad I didn't say something sarcastic now!

But I agree with you.

[Wellfuckmeinbothears]

You honestly sound quite rude. I taught my children “please” and “thank you” from toddler onwards...what are you finding so difficult to grasp? “Please could you”, “thanks so much”...it’s not rocket science.

[mummyhaschangedhername]

@Armadillostoes - I totally agree with you. I think people clearly don't understand there are other ways to show gratitude but given so many people thought it was rude not to use the "magic words" I can safety assume she's the same and I'll just adjust.

[littlemissquiet]

Saying "You're a star" isn't too bad of a replacement for thank you because you've acknowledged that she's done something to help, but... asking for a favour without saying please is a bit rude, she does sounds like she's on a power trip though so I get why you would be annoyed especially if she's talking to the kitchen staff badly too and behaving differently around senior members of staff. I would carry on as normal but adding please at the beginning, then continue the way you would normally say thanks. It was drummed into from a young age to say please and thank you and I've done the same with my children because manners are extremely important.

[mummyhaschangedhername]

@SleepingStandingUp - there is no reason to come over so aggressive sleeping! I agree with you and said I was clearly being unreasonable.

[Hahaha88]

I'm with you here mummyschangedhername I would feel the please is implied in the way a request is said, can you pass me the remote Hun? Is just as polite to me as please pass me the remote. In fact, to my ear, the first way is politer as it doesn't sound as much of a demand. But I think we are in the minority. I too have had a friend call me out on not saying please, despite thinking I've asked polite and the please was implied, apparently some people just need to hear the please. Perhaps they were raised differently to you and I? I would say I'm a polite person, I'm always grateful when people action a request from me, I do use the word please, Albeit not every time I ask for something, and I always say thank you. But some people just won't see it that way. I'd be extremely irked with her treating you like a child, but I guess she's as irked with you not saying the word please. I'd just bite my tongue and try to remember that she prefers the word please x

[cordeliavorkosigan]

I'd be tempted to point out that she has not thanked you for your help and time, which you are giving for free. And to just be direct about it -- you don't need to be there. If she does not understand that gratitude is not equal to uttering precisely the word thanks, and regular small interactions can be requested nicely without the literal word please, and that this comes across as snide, rude and a power trip, then maybe it's time you volunteered somewhere else where you are appreciated.

[mummyhaschangedhername]

@ReleaseTheBats - I do agree with you. Although I ask if she needs help and she often gives me tasks. I don't think she doesn't like me, I think she's playing loyalties. The member she is covering for us suspended, along with another member of staff and the other office staff had herself signed off for the last year-ish ... she only knows what these colleagues have said to her and a lot of the gossip seems to radiate from the office and kitchen staff. I'm not sure they know the outcome of the disciplinary yet but we had to remove one member from employment. None of the staff know what we and the senior school management team do and the senior school management team have been fantastic at keeping things away from the staff and just taking the rough that comes from rumours.

I think, she's playing loyalties as she wants "in" with me but she also wants to rightly appear loyal to the staff.

So part of me thinks I should just take it on the nose as the head does but part of me wanted to stand up for myself a bit!

However, having read this thread, it could simply be that she thinks I am being impolite and really it's just easier to go along with her requests.

I think the school mess as worn me down and I think I was too ready to challenge something I clearly shouldn't have. So I am grateful people have "put me in my place". Although I still believe gratitude is more then please and thank you.

[mummyhaschangedhername]

@Hahaha88 - yes I'm with you. However, as you said, some people hear it differently and in this case I think I was being unreasonable and should just address her as she needs.

[Magenta82]

I don't think you are being unreasonable at all she sounds like a nightmare.

By now I would have turned around and said "I am here volunteering to help out and you are being extremely rude and patronising, would you rather I go?"