What is best for DC, their Mum moving out or staying when a shit Mum?

[Crackerjackerknacker]

Interested if anybody out there knows about children's phychology, mental health. If your mum is loving and things good most of time but she regularlly loses it (shouting, screaming occasionally hitting), is it better for her to move out (but you still see her). I'm thinking of doing this, DC (age 8 & 12) and DH don't want me to. I think it might be best as I'm an awful mum at times (am already on anti depressants, getting outside support, been on parenting course etc) still awful sometimes. Older DC has Apspergers. Their dad is a good one.

Firstly, why are you discussing this as a possibility with or in earshot of your children. This is a decision to be made by the adults in the situation ffs!

I'd also like to challenge the posters that have said you need to stay for your kids/get CBT etc This would absolutely not be the response if a man had posted the same.

Abuse is abuse, it doesn't matter which parent is the perpetrator.

If you cannot parent without screaming, shouting and hitting your children then it is probably best if you live separately. They deserve to grow up and live without fear and pain and in a home with consistent parenting and love. At the moment you seem to be unable to provide that.

What help are you getting as individuals and as a family? Any social care or children's centre input?

Op,
Don't move out. you will be letting your lovely children down.
From today, right now, make a plan as to what you will do when you feel the rage coming on.
When problems start if Dcs are in a safe space or at home,
go and march fast up and down the road outside the house for 15 minutes. Say 'Stay here' to dcs and just go immediately.

Do it as often as the rage starts, (really think about how it feels as it starts and be ready to recognise it)
Whilst marching fast, concentrate on talking really deep breaths and count them in and out, 4 in, 4 out. 15 minutes later the rage should have subsided.

If driving stop the car safely, and march fast,up and down the road and do the same.

If in a public place, sit Dcs somewhere you can see them and do it in eyeshot.
This can be an emergency go to when you feel your anger start.

Once you know how to identify the anger coming on and what to do to remove and calm yourself, you should work on your parenting skills to avoid the dcs triggering this.

Sit them down and explain you are not leaving as you love them far too much.
Apologise for the hitting, say it won't happen again.
Tell them what you will be doing when your anger gets out of control.
Tell them that from now on you will be much calmer and in control.
MEAN IT.

Identify where your frustration comes in at home and make changes, discuss this with them.
if it is because they don't do something when asked , tell them calmly you will tell them twice, then there will be X consequence, it could be losing a phone for a day/x box/outing.
If your frustration is with DH make a plan with him and stick to it.

Bailing out on your family is not an option, they must be feeling horribly insecure and hurt. You need to take responsibility for your actions and take a good hard look at yourself then make the changes.

Op, I think you’re best posting this on the SN board. Do you have access to a disability social worker? I think that may be what you need. Does your SN DC have a PDA profile? Have two SN kids and I have to say I do often shout at them. Frequently when I have told cahms I am not managing, I get the response, wel, your dc has ASD there is noting we can do. We have good moments and bad moments. The good now outweigh the bad. My dc also have violent meltdowns and destroy the house. You can learn techniques to manage violent children and cahms should run them. I don’t hit my dc, but I do frequently have to restrain them from physically hurting themselves or others.

You do need to stop telling them you might leave, OP. You are doing them as much harm with those words, if not more, than you do when you lose your temper, with them. My mother used to say that and it terrified me.

I have a child with ASD and challenging behaviour. I also work and carry the home load. This can do awful things to your mental health if you don't have support, down time or an outlet.

can you make other changes to your life which would give you a break? reduce working hours or get DH to reduce his so he spends more time with the DC, does things at home to reduce your mental load.

Aibu is not a good place for these questions as most posters do not understand the the huge impact bringing up a child with ASD can have on a paren't es when they are largely unsupported.

hope you find a way forward!

So your husband is 'a good dad' but it sounds like he is doing less than half the work of parenting than you, so perhaps not surprising that he is getting to be calm and contented - he doesn't have the mental load of organising, planning, disciplining.

Generally I'd say being together was better and you have been doing the right things - working on your mental health, parenting courses etc.

Perhaps a temporary break would make your DH step up and do more, plus give you space to work on yourself a bit more before moving back in?

Are there any additional sources of support available to you or your family?

Them wanting you to stay even though you shout/scream/are violent is a sign of trauma bonding - as well as being the perpetrator you are also their closest attachment point so they want you to stay. Similar to how an abused spouse defends or returns to their partner even though they are the cause of their trauma.

Do you have a safe environment to go to as you work on the aspects of yourself that you aren’t happy with?

Dragongirl10 Say "Stay here" to a child who has Aspergers and is in the middle of a meltdown??

I would repost on the SN board. You are at the end of your tether as a carer. You need practical advice and support on how to cope with a difficult adult sized SN child (the advice above is good about leaving the scene when it is all too much for you). Support from SS may be a way forward- but take their advice about the other services too.

I don't see how you leaving is going to improve the children's lives. There is not a nice ever patient 24 hour a day carer going to come in behind you and replace you. Your husband needs to work, you need to work p/t and care for the kids.

Stop talking about leaving to the children and continue to get support and help for yourself in this situation.

For starters I think you are incredibly brave for posting on here. You can see there is an issue so that's the first step for getting help. Now you have done the hard part, go and seek extra support you, and your children and DP deserve. Good luck!

You just need some respite time and proper support plan.

You aren’t a shit mum. I promise. Shit mums wouldn’t be asking what is best for their kids on Mumsnet.

I’ve got an ASD/ADHD son, and it was brutal. He saved all his worst behaviours for me, would lash out at me during meltdowns and even ended up being arrested for assault, unable to contact me for a month due to bail conditions.

We did get through it though, he’s 18 now and at university (he spent all of year 8 at home, scraped some GCSEs, did better at A level) and all the hard work was worth it in the end.

The two things that helped us most were occupational therapy (I partially redecorated to make a more calming sensory environment using his preferred colours, made a huge difference) and Multi Systemic Therapy (MST) which is a very intense form of family therapy. Both were funded by the NHS but I had to pretty much beg for them.

Best of luck x

Jesus fucking christ @zippey You are actually blaming children for their parent being abusive. No-one is saying that parenting is easy and particularly hard if you have a child with additional needs but that parent is still the adult and needs to learn to walk away and manage their own anger in a way that their children maybe aren't able to.

What the hell is wrong with some people on here. Dads are abusive and women should LTB if he shouts even once but mothers should stay because their children need them. Mothers screw their kids up too you know.

Really regretting I mentioned it now.

The children and thier bad behaviour are causing these issues. If the children weren’t there, they wouldn’t be using rocks to scratch the OPs computer etc, to which the OP, naturally loses her shit. I’m sure if this didn’t happen her mental health would be better. The children with bells on!

But the solution isn’t to walk away. This has been caused by either lack of or bad parenting, so it sounds like you need expert advice to try and parent better.

Walking away will only make the kids behaviour worse, and it’s the reason why kids go off the rails (when a parent abandons them)

Work together to better thier behaviour.

I also

You just need some respite time and proper support plan

you don't get this unless shit his fan. Unless she moves out and things totally derail, social services would not want to know (I have a child with severe Asd/LD and I never had respite in 12 years despite being on my knees and numerous pleas for help).

worraliberty I said if Dcs were in a SAFE SPACE, and the op was likely to really lose her temper and end up hitting.

Moving out would be an extreme response and I wouldn't go it unless you've exhausted all other avenues of treatment and therapy.
I don't think abusive people ever question their behaviour. My sister has had a string of abusive partner and they have never ever accepted that any problems in the relationship might be to do with them. They might apologise for an outburst but they always twist it so it ends up my sister and kids fault and not theirs.
You aren't doing this, you are fearful and anxious about your own behaviour not looking to blame them for it.
You sound exhausted and at the end of your tether, who is looking out for you and supporting you? Tell SS everything don't try to paint a positive picture they need to know how bad it is so they prioritise you for help.

Don't regret it. Take on board the positives, as you already know the negatives, and speak with your counsellor/support person.

If you are seeing SS this week, then focus on that.

It sounds as though you need respite amd a reorganisation of your house.

You have a child with additional needs, he is going to have meltdowns and possibly try to destroy things.

You have to arrange your house to suit that.

Are you in burnout and just need a break?

SS may suggest that you stay elsewhere for a while, if so.

People with children with disabilities, can't just work in the jobs they want, doing the hours required and not go into burnout.

This is why Families with a disabled child are more likely to face poverty or low income.

Your DH needs to make practical plans with you about how it would work.

What outside help do you have?

Is it possible you have some undiagnosed SN yourself, Cracker? Pretty certain I have ADHD based on what I now know about DS - I only bring it up to you because if your eldest is having meltdowns and his meltdowns trigger your own anger response, you might actually be feeling very similar things in very similar circumstances, only your fuse is a bit longer because you are an adult?

If so, then the same techniques you can learn to identify his meltdowns before they blow can also be used to calm yourself.

meorhim20, it must depend on what's available in your area.

Respite was easily available were I live.

I think it would be a lot better and easier for you, but harder for your dc and your dh. You have a lot of value to your family. I would ask him if you can agree to change some things around eg he works part time you work full time, or you both work part time. He takes on some of the conflict points and shows you how to handle them. While you keep on doing the areas that you are good at. You work together on reducing stress and improving quality of family life.

And although I agree with pps about getting help, I also know that help is limited. Try to find a family support charity who can coach or support you. If you haven’t been on an ASD specialist parenting course, try to do so. I think the girl with the curly hair group do online webinars for parents (not sure if its mainly girl centred, although of course that was the ethos they started with).

p.s. when I was a teen my DSF was terminally ill and my mum was his carer and very depressed and didn't cope well with having two teenage girls constantly pushing the boundaries and frequently exploded at my and my DSIS including occasional physical violence out of frustration when we pushed her too hard.
We all got through it but it took medication and counselling and me and DSIS had to learn to stop behaving like selfish twats.
25 years on we are very close as a family this doesn't have to be the end for you.

Thank you. There is some really good advice on here.

You should have removed yourself form their home the first time you hit your child.

The fact that you've stuck around to assault them a second time is unforgivable.

Assaulting children is never acceptable.