If your friend is gay

[DrowningEveryDay]

and he just recently told you but you suspect he's known all along, and he has a family, would you encourage him to be true to himself and embrace his sexuality?

What would you do?

My current stand is to stay away from this issue, but my other fried (who is gay) says it's hard to not be true to oneself so he's encouraging him.

[CoughLaughFart]

You ‘suspect he’s known all along’? I ‘suspect’ you’re massively over-simplifying. If this is a genuine question, I think you know the answer has to be ‘be honest’. It will be far worse for his wife if she finds out further down the line. The rather simplistic assumption some have made that this is an excuse to go off for lots of sex while his wife sits at home crying and cooking fish fingers ignores the possibility that this may be a chance for her to find something better too.

For the record, I know three fathers who came out as gay to their female partners. One continued to be a very active parent and later developed a very good relationship with his ex. The other two both eventually became the primary caregiver to their children.

[AskBasil]

" Worth noting that when they married the hostility to gay men was more than today."

His oldest child is 9. It would have been the noughties when they got together, not the seventies.

I would have lost interest in this friend tbh and be much more concerned about how I could support his wife and be a friend to her. She's going to need her friends. p

[chocatoo]

I believe that sexuality is more fluid. Is he gay or is he bisexual? If the latter, is it a particular person that has turned his head now? In which case, like any other affair, he needs to decide whether to try and make his marriage work or not.

[CoughLaughFart]

You’re assuming the OP and this man’s wife are friends.

[SelkieUnderLand]

I agree, he should be having the conversation with his wife and he should never have married. It's dragging somebody under your bus.

My first every boyfriend was gay, as it turned out, and it did mess me up a bit afterwards. Felt like I should be grateful for any attention. Felt like it must be a penance to be with me. Not rationally, of course, but I FELT that.

[Cwenthryth]

I think it completely depends on what you mean by “be true to himself and embrace his sexuality”.

If you mean pursue sex with men behind his wife’s back then hell no.

If you mean tell his wife that he is gay, gracefully and kindly end the marriage ensuring she is not disadvantaged by any earning potential she has given up in order to support the family they have created together, and come to a fair co-parenting arrangement long term, so he can then live as a single gay man and be free to meet a male partner, and his wife be free to meet someone who would truly love her -then yeah, encourage and support him as a friend through that. Although he also needs to face up to what he has done in lying to his wife until this point, creating a family with her under false pretences, no matter how well intentioned, is an incredibly cruel thing to do.

[SelkieUnderLand]

I think the decent thing for him to do would be to end the marriage cos it's not working (and I bet if he's gay she'll agree)and then only when she's 'over it' (?) announce the gay bit. She'll feel her whole life has been a SHAM.

[DanceDisaster]

I’d be in the “being true to himself / being honest with his wife” camp. If my Dh was gay, I’d like to know.

I hope he is telling the truth re continuing to look after dcs. That’s the best possible outcome in the circumstances. I also know two families where this happened. One was utterly crushed (teenaged children). The other couple (who had one very young child) have managed to make it work really well. The (gay) man has a new partner but he coparents brilliantly with ex-wife and they’re great friends. Obviously just anecdata but I do think the age of the children has something to do with it. The teenagers took it really, really hard. So I’d say best all round to be honest now.

[Mousefunky]

If this were the 1970s I’d totally understand why he’d masked his sexuality under the guise of a marriage and family. But it’s 2018 and he’s in the UK (I’m guessing) where it’s legal for him to get married and illegal for him to be abused because of his sexuality. So in ways it kinda angers me that in the early-mid noughties someone still felt so ashamed of their sexuality, they felt the need to cover it up in shame.

I feel very, very sorry for the woman involved. Marriages break down for all sorts of reasons but to find out you have basically been duped in this way must just feel horrendous. Poor woman. I think he needs to come clean.

[theunsureone]

I'd encourage him to be true to himself, he can't hide it forever and the more he hides it the more damage he will do to himself and others around him. Wait till he weekend when kids aren’t at school/family not working and then tell everyone. Its not fair on anyone keeping this a secret

[T2517]

A close family friend came out as gay (to close friends only) in his late 40s (except to his parents who are old and set in their ways). He didn’t have children but his wife was devastated. They still live together but neither of them look very happy.

Your friend needs to discuss this with his wife and stop talking about it to you. His wife will be crushed but if this happened to me and I found out he’d been talking about it to others - that would be a betrayal in itself. Your friend will not have an easy time and exploring his sexuality should be the last thing on his mind. He created a family and now his focus needs to be on that family.

[hibbledibble]

I think it is nothing to do with you, it between this man and his wife.

[Chinesecrested]

He has to come clean now, not leave it any longer. Not for his sake, but for hers. I know a woman whose H came out as gay after 20 years and 2 kids together. She'd wasted all that time getting older, with someone who didn't love her, and was devastated when he finally had a breakdown and confessed (although various bizarre behaviours of his along the way finally made sense).

[pigmcpigface]

I think that there's a peculiar and old-fashioned view on here that the absolute worst thing you can do for children is to break up a family.

It's not true.

The worst thing you can do for children is to have them grow up in a dysfunctional family, where adults aren't behaving to each other with love and care.

I know children of couples who haven't split up who are miserable and exhibiting MH problems because the issues of the couple are affecting them. And I know children who have been through divorce who have ended up with four loving parents, all of whom have their best interests at heart, and who coparent brilliantly. I know gay couples with beautiful families, single parents who more than make up for not having a second parent, and even families with open relationships that work.

My point is that successful families come in all shapes and sizes. And so do miserable ones.

I think the best thing in this case is not to live a lie for years on end. There is no reason why a separation and divorce can't take place, allowing both parties to move on (devastasting though this will be for them both) while remaining effective coparents.

[expatinscotland]

It's his business, leave him to it.

[SusanBunch]

Hang on.... Just because he married doesn't mean that he knew at the time that he was gay. People can change you know.
It's not going to help anyone if he stays in a marriage just for the sake of the kids. It's kinder all round to end it. There is nothing to stop him from being a good and involved parent and being open with his sexuality. Yes, it will be difficult for everybody, but I don't think anyone owes it, even to their children, to live a lie. Chances are that they will adjust, especially since they are so young.

[Toomanytealights]

It's so hard being a gay man,so much stigma which can cause repression and self hatred. Utterly unfair to berate him for having feelings now.

I'd suggest he gets counselling and support from somewhere and encourage him to talk to his wife. Other than that I don't think there is much else you should do.

[PlausibleSuit]

OP, you keep using the phrase be true to himself. It's rather vague and euphemistic; what exactly do you mean by that?

For context: I'm a gay man. I'm almost 40. I came out when I was in my teens. Although many things about coming out were hard, the self-acceptance part was easy for me, because I was under no illusions about who I was. I knew I was gay when I was about 7.

But not everyone finds it this easy. Human sexuality isn't always simple. The internalised shame around homo/bisexuality can be huge, even now. For some people, it's less clear-cut. (None of this is an excuse for shitty behaviour, by the way.) I can tell you from my time as a single person that married (to women) men on Grindr/Gaydar/etc are depressingly common.

The thing is, being true to himself isn't just about his sexuality. It doesn't exist in isolation. He has a family and he has to be true to that situation too. So, if he is genuinely gay or bi, I think the best way forward would be for him to open up to his wife. They need to have a conversation. It will undoubtedly be painful for both of them. But they both deserve the chance to live their lives knowing the truth about each other. The only way to create any kind of equable situation is for them both to view it from a position of full knowledge.

If he continues to hide it, he's not being true to his family situation. So he won't actually feel any better, long term. And his wife is living a lie without knowing it.

[TerfClub]

Women have been encouraged to leave their husbands for less than this in the relationships section.
I honestly don't know what the answer is here, but if this had been in relationships and was about the mother I wonder if the advice would be different.

[BarbarianMum]

Ive known several women leave their husbands and choose lesbian relationships in their 40s. Never felt the need to castigate them for marrying and having children when they "knew" they were gay. Lots of people don't know, or are in deep denial, in their teens/20s. Or fall in love without sexual attraction.

OP your friend should speak to his wife. After that, it's up to them.

[NoKnownFather]

Well said, Plausible.

[Socksey]

He definitely needs to be talking to his wife.... the whole find g himself thing is a bit of a red herring g here.... yes he needs to be true to himself what ever that means but it's not just him any more but thete is also his wife who he mist and must have lived deeply (Not just about sexual orientation etc) to think about .... as well as his young children

[Socksey]

Totally agree with @PlausibleSuit

[SusanBunch]

"be true to himself" - surely that means put his young children first? What about being true to the promises he has made?

Can you explain how it is in his children's interest for their father to hide his sexuality and remain in an unfulfilling marriage? It is a myth that staying together is always the best thing for children. It is not. Do you not think cracks and resentments would begin to show and that the kids will pick up on this? Wouldn't kids rather that their parents were happy?
Also, we live in an era where we have this thing called divorce, so actually making promises 10 years ago does not mean we are bound by them forevermore.