to be worried that we are heading towards a cashless society?

[WaitingforGalGadot]

I read an article a few days ago about how the Government would like to phase out cash so that everyone is compelled to pay by card or bank transfer, supposedly to make things easier and quicker and destroy the black market.

I actually think this is really ominous as once there is no more cash, there is no more anonymity and your spending habits and lifestyle can be tracked even if you are not doing anything illegal. Big Brother watching your every more.

It also means the banks can impose negative interest rates (where you have to pay the banks to hold your money) on savings accounts to get people to spend rather than see their savings reduced and of course also means that you don't really have control of your own money since the banks can collapse, bail in your money or appropriate it (as has happened in places like Argentina, not too long ago).

Cash is also really useful and personally I don't find it a faff to use cash. I think this is really scary.

[ohfortuna]

Modern technology means that it would be possible to have a sophisticated barter system when you trade favours or trade skills with other people
I think there are already local economies, eg www.letslinkuk.net/index.htm

[danTDM]

What about homeless people/vulnerable people/tourists? What about if the system goes down/crashes or you lose your card/need it replaced?

Are you talking about just the UK?

I live in Spain, it would not go down at all here, everything is cash!

[TheInimitableMrsFanshawe]

I think the overwhelming message here is just how weirdly paranoid some people are.

[ohfortuna]

You call it paranoia
I call it totally Justified cynicism 😉

[TheInimitableMrsFanshawe]

Justified by what though? What evidence is there that the government is interested in tracking our every move for Orwellian purposes?

[HidingBehindTheWallpaper]

I only use cash for the car park.

[Marmite27]

Err the banks are not mostly run by the government, they have their own board of directors and CEO’s

[RedSkyAtNight]

If you're working on the basis of an evil government scenario, then not sure having cash will help you at all. You'd have to have loads stuffed under the mattress to keep you going for any length of time if the government were to block access to all your accounts.

One thing to remember about data is that although companies collect an increasingly large amount of it, very little is actually looked at or analysed in any meaningful way. Under GDPR you will have the right not to be profiled and the right to refuse consent for any of your data to be used except for specific purposes.

[splendide]

It wouldn’t bother me in any practical way - I hardly ever use cash now. I do see the privacy concerns but that would apply to me now I guess.

Governments deciding to keep all your money - no greater concern than now. Most people keep almost all their money electronically already so they could do that now if they wanted/ were able.

[LoniceraJaponica]

“I absolutely hate the new five and ten pound notes.”

I love them. They are small enough to fit in the wallet part of my purse without me having to fold them.

I don’t see how a completely cashless system would work yet. This weekend I went to 2 church Christmas fairs. It would have been totally impractical for each stall to have debit card machines for transactions of £1.

Would you really use a debit card for little sundries like parking, a newspaper , a coffee or a bottle of water? What about non uniform days at schools where the children bring in £1 to not wear a uniform. I can't see many parents paying £1 via parentpay on every non uniform day.

[FloweringDeranger]

MrsFanshawe, try looking up the Investigatory Powers Act, which is illegal under EU rules. Oh but we're leaving.

Every rules that has been enacted favouring security over freedom since, eg, 9/11,, could be included too. Trump is demonstrating just how quickly democracy can be perverted. When do you think it is legitimate to start worrying?

[Birdsgottafly]

"Justified by what though? What evidence is there that the government is interested in tracking our every move"

Right Wing Facism is building across Europe and there are concerns there.

When you apply for benefits, they ask for three months (at least) Bank Statements and people who are claiming Disability benefits have been asked about their movements.

We have a benefit system in place that is becoming punitive.

Once the change is made, it won't be overturned because the Government is using the information however they decide.

It's very naive to not consider what could be controlled by going cashless.

I agree about bantering, though. My great grandfather had numerous affairs and my Nan said you always knew who he was 'at-it' with, because the kids would be in the street chewing on Pork ribs (he delivered meat with a horse and cart).

She told me tales of many Women having 'arrangements' with the Butcher/Backer/Grocer in the 30's.

[CurlsandCurves]

Just back from a food festival. All stalls trading using cash. No card machines. Will things like this die out if/when we go cashless? Will small local businesses suffer? Probably.


I wanted a bag of £1 coins for my sons dinner money this week. My local bank has closed down, nearest branch is a 20 min drive away. No other banks would give me any coins because I don’t bank with them. And the one bank that is part of the same group that I bank with and could have given me the coins, weren’t able to because (wait for it...) they didn’t have any! Yes folks a bank that has no cash...

I despair...

[splendide]

Would you really use a debit card for little sundries like parking, a newspaper , a coffee or a bottle of water?

I use a card for these. Or rather I use my phone usually.

[FloweringDeranger]

I can understand the concerns over fraud, tax evasion, and safety too. But who guards the guards, and how trustworthy are they? All these rules somehow never hit the biggest offenders at the top.

[SylviaTietjens]

I worry more about what would happen if there was a massive hack on bank accounts. How many people have written records of all their bank statements? And where would you take them to to prove that you had money in your account if almost all the branches are shut?

[honeyravioli]

Cash isn't going anywhere for a very long time. It simply isn't going to happen in your lifetime, so you can stop worrying about it.

[Glumglowworm]

A few years ago there was lots of noise about getting rid of cheques... while they’re becoming less common, cheques are still very much around

So I’m not worried about getting rid of physical money because I just can’t see it happening. Or certainly not for several decades at least.

[Birdsgottafly]

Loniceria you would get around that by having a central booth were you buy tokens and then the stall holders are credited straight into their accounts at the end of business.

I don't carry cash, because I feel vulnerable now I'm disabled. So I do buy single items on a Debit Card.

It wouldn't have to be ParentPay if we went cashless, Schools would have PayPal type accounts, or you would put their details in your internet bank, to pay from your phone.

[metalmum15]

curlsandcurves dc school doesn't accept any cash now, all dinner monies, trips, club payment etc are done online. It does make life so much easier than having to scrat about for dinner money change every week.

[Madbengalmum]

Internet banking and debit cards, not using branches? Do these and you are contibuting to a cashless society.

[Madbengalmum]

To add this as somebody has already mentioned is part of the fascism that our friend Mr Mcdonald wants to see if he becomes chancellor. Not good at all.

[Finderscrispy]

it’s a worry when you consider the range of government and non government agencies that already have access to your internet history.

Cashless probably won’t pose a big problem for majority as long as you don’t deviate from the norm, but get into arrears with your gas bill, council tax etc.. and will we have energy supplier, local council trawling through your accounts to reprimand you for frivolous spending?

Likewise can see it being used similarly for people claiming benefits.

Pregnant women could be stopped from buying cigarettes, alcohol and other restricted products and so on...

Like I said probably wouldn’t effect most, but bit like the boiled frog , you won’t notice your freedom and privacy being slowly eroded until it directly impacts you.

[PerkingFaintly]

One thing to remember about data is that although companies collect an increasingly large amount of it, very little is actually looked at or analysed in any meaningful way.

That simply isn't true.

It might be true that the percentage of the data that is analysed is low, but because the volume of data collected is now unimaginably huge, in absolute terms the amount of data being analysed is very, very, very much larger than 20 years ago.

It's also not the case, in practice, that you have adequate control of how your data is used. In the first instance, T&Cs are frequently that "we can do what we like with your data or you can't use the service".

In the second instance, organisations frequently breach the DPA because they don't understand it or just don't care. Or they get hacked

In the third instance, even when an organisation has wrongly collected or processed your data, have you ever tried challenging them on this?

I have, and it's an almost entirely fruitless process. They deny, then obfuscate, then finally say, "OK we did but so what? We'll stop now so what are you complaining about?" Unless you can prove certain specific types of harm, they suffer no penalty in practice. So why on earth wouldn't they misuse your data, when it's almost risk-free to them?

I wait to see if the GDPR proves more effective in changing the behaviour of organisations. But I'm not holding my breath.

[LipstickHandbagCoffee]

Illegal to have over £5k what utter shite.i love that folk are so brazen to make stuff up