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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to expect to reproduce without all the financial burdens humans have to suffer!

72 replies

springbean · 12/04/2007 14:55

Animals don't have to check their finances are in order before they plan a family - why should we have to? Something's wrong with the world we live in...rant rant

Sometimes I'd much rather we all still lived in caves/ primitive dwellings and only had to worry about hunting animals or gathering choice juicy berries. All this worry about paying the mortgage, covering all the bills is getting a bit too much....

Surely society should pay SAHMs more so people can actually afford to have kids before they reach the grand age of two humpty and humpty four...

Thoughts please..

OP posts:

LadyMacbeth · 12/04/2007 19:42

borry = borrow. And when I said my parent's creaking estate I meant car, not house!!

(wine getting to me)

chocolattegirl · 12/04/2007 22:41

I had my own car, mobile and a slightly unreliable pc but not internet (don't think broadband was around then so paying for it by the minute was out of the question!) but no tv.

I did go as a mature student fairly recently though hence my having my own (decent) car.

I was though when some students had houses bought for them by their parents to live in instead of grotty student digs. Where's the character building in living in a double-glazed centrally heated house with good drains ?

cat64 · 12/04/2007 22:52

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

chocolattegirl · 12/04/2007 22:55

I bet you used to read books as well Cat64

custy · 12/04/2007 23:18

and she is in the judiciary?

scraps.

yes. indeed.

MissTFied · 12/04/2007 23:22

I can understand where you are coming from, Springbean, but don't you think people expect more these days?

The simple life sounds great but I should think the reality is bloody hard work.

Dp and I knew having children would be expensive and so waited until we were settled in our own house before we tried for our first child. We are now having our second and would like many more, but expect to pay for them by sacrificing material things which many people think they have a right to have.

I agree with Xenia in that it appears all too easy to have children in this country without having to 'work' for them.

3andnomore · 12/04/2007 23:30

Xenia...but if a sahm doesn't claim benefits and the family just live on the partners income...surely then no one pays for teh sahm, but themselfs...as childbenefit and childtaxcredits ...well, everyone gets those, don't they?
HOwever, we don't claim Family tax credits, because I am not working, only dh is...so....dh's taxes do pay for a working mum to claim family tax credits...
to me it all swings in roundabouts, anyway...

3andnomore · 12/04/2007 23:33

by the way, I am not begruding that, or anything...just making that point.

Londonmamma · 12/04/2007 23:45

Greensleeves - good point. They do seem to think we HAVE to stay in our house because we don't have an office to go to. I get out FAR more than my poor DH!!

3andnomore · 12/04/2007 23:46

maybe the the saHOME bit is confusing, and you know how we are also called HOUSEwifes....lol...maybe people think it means you sta in the house

hatwoman · 12/04/2007 23:53

a PC in yer room? a pen? by eck lasses. when I worra student weyad chalk and a slate and wor bluddy grateful

Judy1234 · 13/04/2007 08:40

I didn't say I suppose SAHMs. I said tax payers support those on benefits with or without children. In otherwords anyone who wants a complete life of leisure who takes their pleasure from a walk to the library, doing their allotment, sitting in the park the activities which cost very little can indeed pursue a life not working in the uK. Some people manage it from cradle to grave. It was the aim of the upperclasses, wasn't it, never to work. Work was looked down on as a thing plebs did, even the professions.

On lifestyles as a whole plenty of people manage to form different lives on communes and in religious and other groups in the UK and abroad. Many women in the 1500s I think in the UK who didn't want to be tied to a man and babies would enter convents often just to escape that life of motherhood and domesticity and even men.

On the issue of university students (as I have 3 at the moment) it's bit more complex. When we bought our first computer and mobile phone they were very expensive things. Prices have come down. I don't say they're cheap now but they are relatively cheaper. I took my typewriter to university - no computers really in those days. Some parents do manage to keep their children away from materialism and possessions. My sister does fairly well at it but you need to be good at either isolating the children or bringing them up with others of a like mind in your village, religion, commune or group and ideally ensure they don't watch TV etc either.

kimi · 13/04/2007 09:05

I dont see why anyone should be paid to stay home.
When I choose not to go to work and be at home with my children we have to get by on one wage.
When I work don't want to pay for other people to sit on their backsides.

My sister has worked fro the day she left school, always paid the higher tax and never claimed a benefit in her life.
She got cancer, had chemo, could not work. Her DH f**ked off and she needed help. She was treated like a bit of crap and after 3 months of form filling she got the grand sum of £44.00 a week.

Thankfully she is doing well in remition and working again (yep paying 40% again)

Eleusis · 13/04/2007 09:25

Oh FFS, nobody owes you anything. Too many people go round moaning about what they are owed by society. Why don't you start asking yourself how you can contribute to society rather than how society can contribute to you.

I can sympathise very much with your moan on the cost of childcare. It is cripling. And I do believe that we as a society would be better off if mainstrean parents of young children could reasonably afford childcare, a mortgage, and be able to go to work. I personally, have chosen childcare and work. Not sure what I'm going to do about the mortgage. We rent now. And if I still can't afford a house I want to live in in the next 2 or 3 years, I may petition my DH to pack up and move to the states.

idlemum · 13/04/2007 12:52

I think it goes back to the fact that having children is not a right it is a choice; as is the number of children you choose to have. You cut your cloth according to your circumstances.

custy · 13/04/2007 14:18

idlemum i didn't chose to have twins.
i actually think that in many cases there is no active choice as is suggested. just piss poor education and role models.

that aside.

kimi's post was confusing whilst saying she isnt going to pay for people on benefits bemonaing the treatment of her sister on benefits.

if you want to stay at home, grow herbs and fingerpaint whilst other people chose to work and both be financially rewarded for their work - why the fuck should i pay for it?

Judy1234 · 13/04/2007 14:38

Read a good article by Caitlin Moran in today's times where she mentions her abortion, would have been 3rd child in her marriage but she knew she couldn't cope with 3.

MissTFied · 13/04/2007 21:53

If Caitlin Moran knew she couldn't cope with three children, then she should have ensured she didn't get pregnant in the first place. I think that is far simpler than having an abortion. Still, it gives her something to put in her column.

lillochum · 13/04/2007 22:25

On the whole I agree that people relying on benefits as a sort of lifestyle choice isn't a good thing. Mostly, I get the impression that living on benefits is very hard, especially as a parent, and I certainly hope I never have to. One angle that hasn't been considered on this thread though - at the moment our birth rate is falling quite dramatically - it doesn't matter how hard our generation works, if we don't have more children in this country (or allow more immigration), the future could be distinctly tricky. However, the extra kids needed will need to grow up happy and willing to work hard....

kimi · 13/04/2007 22:32

Benefits are there as a short term safty net for those who need them as a stop gap.
Trouble is a lot of people see them as a life style and a right. THEY ARE NOT.
DH1 wanted 6 kids, in the real world we could afford 2, we have 2.

We have been abroad as a family twice, that's what we could afford, we have one car, that's what we can afford, we live with in our means that's what most people do.

NO ONE owes us a living

expatinscotland · 13/04/2007 22:39

Custy for PM!

kimi · 13/04/2007 22:43

Can Mn become a political party ????

expatinscotland · 13/04/2007 22:44

There seems to be a sense of entitlement that supercedes personal responsibility prevalent in some repsepcts.

kimi · 13/04/2007 22:56

My son's are 10 and 6 and they know there is no free ride in this world, they know this because DH1 and I have drummed it in to them.
You go to school you work hard (DS1 is already thinking about uni) you get a good job you work hard some more, you get a nice house and car and holidays, you pay in to your pension, and you don't look for someone to carry you.
This is life.

nightowl · 13/04/2007 22:59

grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

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