AIBU to let my nephew move in

[lalalalyra]

My bully of a brother was arrested early in the week for punching my lovely SIL. I've been NC with my brother for a while (many threads at the time) and I've come to the realisation that he is far, far more like our abusive father than he realises, and than any of us realised for a long time.

My SIL is lovely. She has been like a big sister/aunt/Mum/friend figure to me since I was young as she and my brother have been together since high school and we lived with our grandparents since I was 7. She has stayed in contact with me and my children against his wishes. She was the one who made sure I could go to the church for my older nephew's wedding despite the fact he wouldn't let me be invited to the whole thing (nephew didn't want to fall out with his dad just before his wedding, I understand that).

SIL says it's the first time he's been violent. I believe that as she's always been the one that kept him in line and has never taken any crap from him. She has spoken to him and they are going to relate and she wants to give him one last change. That's entirely her choice.

However, my 17yo nephew doesn't want to live at home anymore. He wants nothing to do with his Dad. He's been staying with friends all week. He asked me if I could speak to my DH and our kids to see if they would consider him coming to live with us until he goes to uni next year. He can't live with his older brother without moving school and his sister is away at uni.

SIL has asked me to say no. She thinks if nephew moves out his relationship with his father will be over. She wants him to come home and work on it.

I don't want to end my relationship with SIL, especially as I think she'll be at her most vulnerable home alone with him. However, I don't think my nephew will go home and his other options will negatively impact his education.

[lalalalyra]

BTY, I wouldn't have much respect for a woman that chooses an abusive husband and possibly abusive father, over their child.

I wouldn't either. It's one of the issues I had counselling for over my mother - she effectively chose drugs, my father and self-preservation over her children.

My SIL's children have always been everything to her. I don't get it.

[emmyrose2000]

SIL has asked me to say no. She thinks if nephew moves out his relationship with his father will be over. She wants him to come home and work on it

Honestly, SIL sounds pretty selfish in this regard. It also sounds like she wants nephew/son there as a buffer. Why would any parent want their child to remain in an abusive situation when there's a perfectly safe alternative?

If your brother never speaks to his son again, that's totally on your brother. In no way would it be your nephew's fault.

[CoolCarrie]

It's your brother's loss in this situation, he has already lost his relationship with you and your own family, though his own terrible behaviour. In your shoes I would let your nephew stay with your family and make his own choices about his vile father. I understand your SIL doesn't want to influence her son's actions, but he, and she are better off away from him.

[SabineUndine]

I don’t understand why your SIL has a problem with your nephew ending his relationship with his father in the circs unless she’s frightened she will bear the brunt in which case she needs support.

[Neverknowing]

I'll reiterate that there will be a reason for nephew doesn't want a relationship with his father. 17 year olds don't do that without a reason.

[Puzzledandpissedoff]

Arrange a meeting between your dn, sil and yourself. Explain you are more than happy to have him but don't want to fall out with SIL (who clearly needs support). Ask them to reach an agreement whereby this works

I think this is far and away the most sensible suggestion yet. Obviously the 17 year old must be the priority, but DB will almost certainly claim you've "stolen him from his family" and I'd worry what might happen if he convinces your SIL of the same (after all, if she wants to try to repair the marriage, is she really in a place where she'll see his stupidity for what it is?)

If you get them round for a proper discussion, a lot more might also come out which will help with your decision; either way, surely it's worth trying?

[WhereYouLeftIt]

"SIL has asked me to say no. She thinks if nephew moves out his relationship with his father will be over. She wants him to come home and work on it."
And if his relationship with his father is over - what? I think she may be trying to hold their relationship together because if she doesn't, it throws her own relationship under the spotlight.

You say she's kept him in line, but what a feckin' way to live, married to a bully who disowns his own sister and now his son. Does she then have to choose between husband and son? Is her asking you to say no her attempt to not be put into that position?

I think you should say yes to your nephew. This will put your SIL into a position where she has to think about her future, but honestly - I think she should be doing that anyway. I wonder if she's blinded by the 'sunken costs' fallacy, i.e. if she has to rethink her marriage, has she wasted all those years she remained with him? It can be hard for some people to look back on their life and regret some of it, I think she's trying to avoid this. But she shouldn't. Those years produced her sons, who she loves.

Say yes to your nephew, and be ready to support your SIL.

[ThumbWitchesAbroad]

I think there is more to your SIL's pleading for you to say no - perhaps he has threatened her? Or perhaps she just can't bear for her husband to be no-contact with her son, as no doubt he'd forbid her to have any contact with him either.

Obviously the right thing for her to do would be to kick his sorry arse to the kerb completely, chuck him out and keep the son at home - but I guess she's not there yet.

Also, if this genuinely is the first time he's actually hit her, then he probably has done the "first response" thing of sobbing and apologising and seeming genuinely shocked that he did that - and she's possibly fallen for it. However, he has done it, and once an abuser does it once and gets away with it, they'll do it more.

Your SIL isn't very safe. Having her DS there with her might make some or no difference. I hope that your SIL can get proper help and advice from somewhere, to help her understand that her situation is now only likely to get worse.

As for "should I offer DN a home" - well, he's nearly an adult .There are people on this forum who left home as soon as they every could, some at or before they were 16. He is 17 and nearly old enough to make his own decisions - your SIL needs to recognise that too.

In your place I would let him come if he wants. I would also try to find out what potential ramifications there would be for your SIL, but I'd still let him come. Too much long-term trauma if you refused. :(

[lalalalyra]

I'll reiterate that there will be a reason for nephew doesn't want a relationship with his father. 17 year olds don't do that without a reason.

The reason is that my brother punched SIL in the face. That's his reason, and it's a perfectly acceptable reason.

It's not that I think my nephew should forgive him, it's really not. It's just that any chance of any relationship between them will be forever gone if nephew moves in here and I don't want him to make a hasty decision he will regret. Not for my brother, not because it would be his fault if my brother never talks to him again - just because he's 17 and I don't want him to regret it.

If he was moving in with his brother, my other brother or my sister I'd be helping him shift his stuff. It's not at all about my brother (well obviously it is because he's his father, but it's not about any concern for my brother). I just don't want nephew to hit a point in a couple of months or years where he realises that a fixable situation became unfixable because of my relationship with my brother.

[lalalalyra]

I need to go and do the afternoon of being the kids taxi. I will come back though. I don't want folks to think I've just abandoned the thread.

I'll speak to my nephews tonight (niece is away at uni so I have no idea what she does and doesn't know), have a chat with my older 3 and then we will go from there.

[lalalalyra]

Thanks everyone.

[Livingdiisgracefully]

It sounds like your brother pushed you very far if you are actually NC with him. You are talking about him as if he has no choice but to cut off your DN if he lives with you. But that's just not true, is it? He's choosing to behave in a domineering and, frankly, abusive way. He doesn't have to make people choose loyalties between him and you. Your DN have every right to protect himself from bullying and abuse.

Your SIL has also made her own choices and she has no right to sacrifice your DN's wellbeing to validate those choices or protect herself from the consequences.

Bear in mind that he may regret for ever being forced to go back into that abusive home. And he may resent you forever for making him do it. It's always easier to live with the consequences of decisions we have made freely, rather than those we have been forced into.

[StigmaStyle]

It's just that any chance of any relationship between them will be forever gone if nephew moves in here and I don't want him to make a hasty decision he will regret.

It's not your nephew's responsibility - he's not making a decision that will end relationships. His dad is the one who won't speak to him if he does this perfectly reasonable thing - go and stay with an aunt and cousin. Your nephew is just going somewhere safe to escape from an unbearable home situation. I really don't think you should see it as "something he might regret," but as the best option for him, for now.

[RunRabbitRunRabbit]

I just don't want nephew to hit a point in a couple of months or years where he realises that a fixable situation became unfixable because of my relationship with my brother.
What's this future scenario? The boy is a young man and thinks I wish I had a better relationship with my violent bully of a father? I wish I had appeased him so he didn't cut me off when I objected to him punching mum in the face.

A child in an abusive household has asked you for help and you are thinking of refusing to help because the abusive man will be utterly vile to the son if he dares to leave the abusive household.

What message does that send to your nephew?That the abusive bully is all powerful.

Even nice aunty says to appease above all else. Lovely mum is OK with being punched in the face in the end. Nobody is in custody, abuser gets his dinner cooked by the victim. Lovely mummy wants to cut off his exits so he has to stay with the mother puncher and play nice, "mustn't upset dad he will take it out on mum and it will be my fault."

[SparklyUnicornPoo]

DN has been staying with friends all week, if this had been a hasty decision he would have come to you a week ago, as it is he has taken some time to let things calm down and decided he needs a long term solution. He clearly doesn't want to go home and I don't think you saying no will make him go home either, more likely he will carry on staying with friends with no idea where he will be from one day to the next, which will damage his education and possibly even put him in danger.

[picklemepopcorn]

Tell SiL how much you resent your mum for not choosing you over your abusive dad.

Tell her you love her and want to support her and are surprised she is having your brother back.

Tell her she is being unreasonable to make Her DS live with his dad.

Tell her you desperately hope that this won't spoil your relationship but that after lots of thought you can't in all conscience turn him away.

[ItsNachoCheese]

Id say yes to him moving in with you. He knows how your household works, is in the same friend group as your ds and you dont mind him being there. It seems like it would give him a bit of stability too

[teaandtoast]

Is he trying to make a point to his Dad, by choosing your house rather than his brother's, his uncle's or his other aunt's?

[krasnayaplats]

For uni funding issues for young people with no family support standalone.org.uk/students/

[Nanny0gg]

Your SiL is being very unreasonable here. Her son saw her being punched and he's supposed to forgive her attacker?

And I thought joint counselling wasn't advised in abuse situations?

[BoneyBackJefferson]

There are many possible reasons for why your nephew wouls like to move in with you.

Occum's razor would suggest that he doesn't want to be in the house with someone that abuses his mother.

from that point on the situation doesn't get better, only worse.

[lalalalyra]

Thanks everyone.

I had a good chat with my nephew tonight (and his older brother) and he's moving in with us.

He's actually been amazingly mature about it. He accepts that his choice of here will cause an issue with his father, but he is of the opinion he'd have ended up NC with him eventually. His reasons for choosing here as opposed to my other brother (sister wasn't an option - she doesn't 'do' children) were very well thought out so I'm happy now he isn't reacting hot headedly. He's just of the opinion that once is enough.

My kids are happy with the plan for him to move in. Turns out the big 3 (18, 14 & 14) had already discussed speaking to me about him coming here as they didn't like the idea of him sofa surfing with friends. I'm very proud of them and their reactions tbh.

Thankfully I was able better to explain in words what I was thinking face-to-face and he got it, he had thought the exact same which is why he didn't come here on Monday or Tuesday. So, I'm happy he's thought it through and he's not trying to wind up his father by coming here and he is aware of how his father will react and is confident and happy that that is my brother's issue.

He's very, very shocked by the whole saga. In his words his Dad is a twat, but he's never been violent. He's hoping his mother will leave, but says that's her choice. I messaged her to explain that I had spoken to the boys and I didn't believed that nephew would come home regardless of what I did and that I felt it was in his best interests to come here.

[lalalalyra]

I'm a little pissed off with myself tbh, I doubt myself a LOT in decisions when it comes to that part of my family. However, we sorted it all within a day so I'm getting better - previously I'd have tied myself in knots for weeks.

Thanks for all the help folks.

[GlitteryFluff]

Hope your sil can see you've done the best thing for your nephew. How has she reacted?

I think if your db has taken after his father, you have to stop the cycle somewhere, and hopefully with dn leaving the situation now he will hopefully avoid turning into that when he's older. If that makes sense? If he was forced to stay it could end up becoming the norm for him, thus turning him into his father.

Glad he has you/your family.

[CakesRUs]

If he's off to uni next year, he's old enough to decide where he wants to live. Horrible situation OP