AIBU or cleaners?

[Moominmummyzzz]

Background: We have been using a cleaning company to clean our house for the last three years. We had seven different people and all of them (bar one) left the company. The last five months, the owners (age 72, 73) have started doing the job. We employ them to come to the house two hours twice a week (4 hours a week in total). They have also done a deep clean of the house (8 hrs) in April. We pay £12.50 per hour so around £200-225 a month.

DH and I have a toddler and we both work full time. I mainly work night duties. DH and I are really knackered as we have no family nearby to help us. We have someone to help us clean our house for our mental well being.

Since the owners have taken the role, I have noticed the following

• cancelling the job at the last minute (like texting at 12:00 to say they cant come in for 12:00 noon job)
  
• charging us for days they did not turn to work (this happened twice but did not question it for goodwill as we have used them for three years)
  
• last week owner/cleaner was to do a two hour clean but she left after an hour but still charged us for the full two hours.
  

The owner/cleaners were suppose to come yesterday but they didn't turn up. We got this email from her today:

_______________
Dear Moominmummyzzz,

I have given the cleaning of your home considerable thought, and no matter how I try I can no longer contend with the state we find your home in each time we come.

I really do not want to offend you but when we spoke last you asked me to be honest, are efforts are in vane, the constant wiping of the sofa which is covered in dried on food, picking up stuff from the floors, clearing food and cereal bowls, clearing food and various other things.

Putting washing in the baskets picking up toys and various other things from the bath.

My staff and I are not servants having to clear up behind people.

You are a young couple and there is no reason why you cannot pick things up so we are able to clean, you have the capabilities of making your home a well kept and pleasant place to bring your little toddler up in.

Please take all this on board as being constructive. You are really nice people and I have enjoyed knowing you.

I put your key back through the door yesterday I hope you have found it . If I can be of any help please let me know.


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I'm just confused at this. It sounds like we're disgusting pigs but we are just a real tired couple with a small child. AIBU?

[maninawomansworld01]

YANBU, you need to find cleaners who offer a more comprehensive service.
Don't get me wrong , they were fucking rude but if they don't want to do certain jobs then they are entitled not to.

Our cleaners come in twice a week and they do EVERYTHING!
Literally, they will wash dishes, dry and put away, put laundry out for a laundry lady who comes in once a week (we don't leave out anything with baby poo / sick or anything like that for them), they clean very thoroughly and if there are shoes etc on the floor they'll pop them away before starting.
However, we pay them a good rate by the hour so the tidier our house when they turn up the less we pay.

[Moominmummyzzz]

7 cleaners left the company.. not because of us..

[Moominmummyzzz]

sorry meant to say 6 left the cleaning company and 1 died. nothing to do with us.

[Moominmummyzzz]

Lemon.. we do clean and tidy in between days. Our house was like a showhome pre-kids. I despair at the clutter and mess now. :(

[MovingOnUpMovingOnOut]

1 died. nothing to do with us.

Glad you clarified that. I'd hate to think your poor cleaner had suffocated under some untidy laundry...

[MillionToOneChances]

I think you need an individual cleaner, and just be very clear when discussing the work that the job will involve some tidying. My cleaners have all relished this and most have only left when genuinely leaving the cleaning business.

[venys]

As others have said probably wrong fit. I have had my cleaners for 3 years. I am a SAHM mum with 3 young children in a half renovated house. She KNOWS I don't even have 5 minutes to tidy, or when we do, it's no point as stuff just gets hauled out of cupboards, drawers, and left, well, anywhere!! She and her mate get paid by the hour. She knows to shove stuff in buckets, boxes, whatever she can find and clean. We clean different parts of the house each week so I don't expect perfection. It's a shame that your cleaners couldn't bring the issues to your attention without quitting so you could come to some arrangement. As pp put it though, 2 x 2 hour stints would mean they would spend more time tidying than cleaning rather than 1 x 4 hour shift . It's also got to be worthwhile for them to come given they need to move from place to place each day so a longer shift might be more beneficial. I think you still need to wipe your couch if there is a spill though..even we manage that!!

[TheHuntingOfTheSarky]

I pay my cleaner to do whatever she can get done in the 4 hours I am paying her. I do a bit of a tidy up before she arrives, but we have a 4-bed house and she still manages to clean it all including some ironing, changing all the beds and the dishwasher (if it needs doing). Wooden floors downstairs get hoovered and mopped, kitchen and utility thoroughly cleaned, all dusting, upstairs hoovered, two bathrooms cleaned properly every week. Plus she'll do extras if she has time like clean out the fridge or do the windows. I'm by people whose cleaners seem to think basic tidying is beneath them. However do they fill their time if you're doing all their work for them before they even get there? I honestly think some of you are being taken for a ride!

[MonkeyPJs]

Hard to say without seeing your house tbh.

I do often wonder about the 'my house is a mess because of my DCs line' - for 9 out of 10 people who say this, the house is filled with the sort of clutter and mess that is to be expected, but there are also people that say this as a sort of cover for a house which is really filthy in a bad way. Everyone knows it's hard to have a clean house with kids, but no-one really knows what the different scale of messy can look like.

I once visited a relative who is the first to share 'I'd rather have a messy house and spend time with my kids' type posts on FB, but her house was terrible - think mould on laundry and rotten food type dirty. I honestly think she didn't realise that her house was so much worse than other people's, because mess is to be expected when you have DCs. Mess, yes, but not like hers.

[Willow33]

You are so NBU. It is unbelievable that they are complaining about cleaning! They need to shut down. Cleaning houses is a physically demanding job and it can't be easy at their age to be doing that all day.
Look in gum tree - lots of agencies who are pretty good.

[Shelby2010]

4 hours of cleaning is a lot for one small household, unless you live in a mansion?

I tidy up before my cleaner comes because I can only afford 2 hours per week & I want that spent wiping down the bathrooms & washing the kitchen floor etc.

In your case I think you should find a cleaner who is happy to do eg an hour of general tidying each time and then clean/Hoover the upstairs one day and then the downstairs on the other day. If you're paying them for 4 hours work then you just need to set out what is expected and accept that there will be less cleaning if they have to do more tidying.

[ChatterNatterer]

Sounds like they're too old to be in the business they're in and are winding it down.

I think the amount of hours you're paying them for is crazy if they can't put a few dishes in the sink and put some bath toys to one side whilst they clean.

Definitely look for a new cleaner and set clear expectations and asked to be billed based on that.

I'd also chase up the incorrect billing and missed hours if they are going to have their arse in their hands over some tidying.

[WingsToFly]

That email was outrageously rude and seems to me a personal attack to draw attention away from the problems with their business: leaving early, charging in full when they didn't show, staff retention issues - as in they've all left - could that be due to how they treat people?!

As pps have said, you might be better of getting a more individual service now. Get a good rapport with someone more flexible. You're happy to pay a decent rate so it should be possible to get someone ok with tidying when necessary. It's only if you're taking the piss they resent it (or if you're not open about what you need in initial discussions.

[Willow33]

Yes definitely, as pp said, chase up the incorrect billings.

[Out2pasture]

I would expect a 72 and 73 to tell it like it is. I don't find the letter rude as long as it's the truth.
I presume that they may not be up to the job as well and their age may play a part in what they are willing to do or not do.
dd has a housekeeper and she tidies ahead of her so she deals with the bathroom, floors, and a proper wipe down of flat surfaces.

[IPityThePontipines]

YANBU

If your house required more time to clean then what you were paying them for, then that's all they had to say. No need for a long, insulting email.

It seems they weren't working out for you anyway, so get on Hassle.com (or something similar) and get yourself a new one.

[IPityThePontipines]

And at But posting about an untidy home on an anonymous forum? shock I'd be so ashamed I'd dare not whisper it to the wind.

[RubyCav]

Their message was incredibility rude. However food spillages not being wiped up, dirty dishes left around the place and dirty laundry left on floor is not normal clutter. Its unhygienic.
Also if you both work full time then the toddler is hardly there to make a mess with toys, so I wouldn't call that normal clutter under the circumstances either.

You do sound down and struggling though. Do you think it is just tiredness or could there be some depression there?

[Atenco]

I think you should look for someone who is willing to do that work, it is work and it is being paid for, so there is nothing wrong with it. As long as you can reach an agreement about how much work you can reasonably expect them to do in the time limit.

[SpecialAgentFreyPie]

food spillages not being wiped up, dirty dishes left around the place and dirty laundry left on floor is not normal clutter. Its unhygienic.

Yep

Also if you both work full time then the toddler is hardly there to make a mess with toys

Bingo.

I think the letter was ruder than needed, but I strongly suspect the house is in a much dire state than let on.

[AnotherPrickInTheWall]

YANBU; cleaners are there to clean up your mess. Toddlers are messy sods, that is to be expected.
There are plenty of other cleaners out their who are not too up their own bottoms to scrape a bit of food off the sofa.
I could understand their being disgruntled if they were faced with piles of cat poo on the carpet or flea ridden carpets.
Good riddance to them I say.

[JenLindley]

at that email!!

I am a cleaner. Quite frankly you could live in a manure heap and I would still come and polish the turds every week as long as you paid me my rate. Why does it matter to them what they're having to clean as long as you are paying them for their time? Surely you aren't expecting them to pick up all the stuff and then do two hours but rather the picking up stuff is part of the two hours? I really don't see why it's such a problem unless you have been complaining that they haven't been cleaning properly.

[Moominmummyzzz]

if you both work full time then the toddler is hardly there to make a mess with toys

I work nights and my husband work days. We take turns in childcare. No other form of childcare but hopefully our toddler will go to nursery next month. Zombie is what I call myself after a night duty.

do sound down and struggling though. Do you think it is just tiredness or could there be some depression there?

"struggling" is the word DH and I use all the time. He does wonder if has depression. Maybe I have? I'm unsure. I have a medical condition that makes me tired and my work pattern have messed up my sleeping rhythm.

We didn't have a baby when our cleaners started and our house was always pristine. Our cleaning/housing needs changed since the last three years

[AnotherPrickInTheWall]

I did a brief stint as a cleaner. I was more put off by super clean houses as I really didn't know what I was expected to do . A messy house was far more rewarding as I could get stuck in and make it look like a home again.

[Moominmummyzzz]

Jen.. No we haven't complained. We were very happy that they were there to help us. We always chat whenever they are in the house and they haven't mentioned this to me. I wish she could have said this to me and I could have done something about it or at least ended things in a nicer way.