to be cross that dd is repeatedly hurt under cm care

[wheresthel1ght]

Dd's cm is lovely. She is very sweet, buys the kids birthday/Christmas/Easter etc and is brilliant with endless activities, days out, toddler groups, parks, play enter, city farms etc.

However, yet again I have had to sign the incident book tonight because the same little girl has again hurt dd. This child is about 5 months younger than dd, a lot less verbal but seems to have real problems with sharing. Dd has an inch long scar by her eye where this child scratched her because dd had the toy she wanted, she has hit her, kicked her and other general toddler stuff. I have overlooked all of it and shrugged it off as kids being kids.

Tonight however I have collected dd and had to sign again because this other little girl has bitten dd. This happened about 1230, I collected dd at 230 and it was still bright red, as if just done, so it must have been one hell of a bite. In this instance the cm told me dd had wanted the toy that the other girl had and tried to snatch it, rather than say no the other girl has bitten dd. This is the first time cm has said that dd's actions have caused he response. Normally she is completely faultless which is a surprise cos she can be a swine at home

I know cm cannot watch every last second and I have told dd off for snatching but I am starting to get really cross that dd is being hurt. The scar is very noticeable and dd is still upset by it as she will see it in the mirror and get upset saying "X scratched me mummy"

Wibu to explain to the cm at I am getting quite cross about this behaviour from the other girl and that if something isn't resolved I will have to look for alternative childcare?

[Booboostwo]

I am a bit surprised at the answers you are getting on this thread. While DD didn't have a single incident at nursery that was because she was a very timid child, weary of physical interaction and she kept herself away from any confrontation or rough play. DS constantly comes home with bruises and scratches, either self-inflicted or from scuffles with other toddles - then he does the same at home.

[wheresthel1ght]

Juggling - I think the grown used to the general bickering and just not switched on enough to the more serious stuff is probably what is happening. I am hoping now I have said I am not happy that she will be taking more care.

And there is lots that can be done to control and deal with this behaviour, not least separating the children and keeping a very close watch on the one who is prone to violent outbursts. Stating no every time they hit it go to hit, kind/gentle hands only, time out, naughty step, loss of time with whatever toy has caused the issue. Lots can be done to teach and encourage sharing better so yes there is lots that can be done by both the cm and the child's parents. So far they appear to have shrugged it off

[wheresthel1ght]

Devil I am fully aware she cannot prevent the general tot for tat but I do expect her to prevent the physical violence that dd is being subjected to.

The picture of the scratch is 3 weeks after the event and the bite 18 hours after - for them to still be that red and visible shows they were not done in a minor scuffle there was intent behind her actions to hurt dd.

[FuriousFate]

I don't think there was intent as at two, the biter wouldn't have known what they were doing. However, I would have said the same to the childminder as you. She is clearly not able to keep your child safe. I have two small DCs in nursery and over two years, they have never come back with anything like your pics. They are very well supervised though. I think the CM is not stepping in as quickly as she might.

[Hissy]

I'd not be happy leaving my 10yo with a cm this hands off.

One incident is enough. The bite is horrific. I think you're not over reacting. Far from it.

Just because someone passes an inspection in isolation means nothing. The cm in our area are so ridiculously sought after, pretty much anything goes. It's not good enough provision tbh.

I've had to reduce my hours to come home for my ds. Flaming cm shouted at me. Wtf am I doing paying hundreds of quid a month for someone to shout at me. My vile ex did that for nothing!

[catewood21]

If you move her, you are just a s likely to find a similar child in the next setting.

[Hissy]

.. With a cm who DOES give a shit...

[JugglingBabies]

Hissy It's a shame you've let your own bad experience taint your view of an entire profession.

OP - I also agree with others, that at 2 years of age most children do not display 'intent' to injure their peers. For the most part, they are learning how to manage their emotions. This can be made even more difficult for those who's communication skills are not fully developed. But there are ways and means to discourage the negative behaviour. And to help children communicate in other ways.

Your CM may be doing everything she possibly can to manage this situation. That is for the two you to discuss. But perhaps the bigger problem is communication. If she was forthcoming with information and able to TELL you what she was doing to address the issue, with both the child & their parents, you would feel more reassured.

[Devilishpyjamas]

The only way she can guarantee it will never happen again is by never having your child in the same room as the biter (or any other child come to that). (Is this child a regular biter or have ther just bitten once?)

And all the things you have suggested are fine (I would add others as well) but won't necessarily stop it With a child this young & with limited language parents can only work on biting at home if the child bites at home. If they don't then they cannot do anything about the biting.

[Devilishpyjamas]

And of course there wasn't intent! This is a baby! There may have been intent to get the brick off your dd or keep hold of whatever it was your ds was trying to remove from the child but of course there wasn't intent to hurt her.

[Devilishpyjamas]

*dd

[Blondeshavemorefun]

Squabbles happen with children

What would happen if you had another child and they kept biting your eldest

Or if you had twins so same age and one started 'attacking' the other? You couldn't split them up

Yes you want your dd to be safe and unharmed.

If cm are in such high demand then guess cm will say to you that she understand how you feel and you accepts you leave and she knows she can fill your space easily maybe by your friends child

Basically - You did say the reason you leave her there is as no choice - no other cm and you can't afford a nursery

P's. Cm are self employed they can chose who to have at their setting

[Hissy]

Doing everything she can to prevent further bites is NOT what the cm here is doing.

Like I said. There are cms that are good.

There are others who aren't. They at one thing and do another.

At the end of the day a little child has been hurt quite badly on multiple occasions and dippo cm hasn't worked out how to prevent that.


She's probably got too many kids for her attention span. Just because she has the quota, doesn't mean the kids are safe.

I'm not tarring all cm with one brush, I know several parents who have absolutely awesome cm. Cm who I actively recommend to others that are looking for after school care.

One or 2 of the cms I have had have been great, others only on it for money and because nobody would pay them that kind of money in a more traditional role.

A bad cm damages a child's esteem. As a service provider a parent relies wholly on trusting this person to provide a safe, stimulating and positive environment.

When it works it's like a right hand for a left.

[Devilishpyjamas]

How do we know the cm isn't doing enough? Short of putting them in separate rooms (not really workable) then she cannot 100% guarantee the children will never prod/bash/thump or bite each other. She would be lying if she said she could. Particularly if this was a first bite as the behaviour will have been unpredictable (once a behaviour is predictable you have more chance of managing it - but even well managed behaviour can have incidents).

[crabbiearses]

its upsetting when your child gets hurt but speaking as mum of 3 i would say you get this sort of thing all the way through nursery and school, its not ideal but thats life, being over emotional about it doesn't help, children occasionally bite and scratch each other, it may even be your child being the perpetrator next time.
Id ask the childminder to work with you and the other parents on sorting it out but threatening to leave or suggesting they get rid of another child isn't reasonable.

I was called to school because a little boy who had problems controlling his temper lashed out at a few students including my child, all the other mothers were baying for the little boys blood and suggesting he be removed from the class, i agreed with the teacher that every child is entitled to an education and trusted they would do their upmost to keep my child safe.

[Devilishpyjamas]

I was asked to sign a petition to boot a kid out of school. I refused.

FWIW if this kid has bitten once I would expect a closer eye to be kept for a while & for things like seating arrangements/space to be considered. If he continues to bite & becomes a predictable biter I'd expect any setting to have an individualbehaviour plan for said child. But you can't have that for a one off incident.

[WaspsandBeesSting]

Calling the CM names Hissy helps no one!

[Duckdeamon]

I have used CMs and nurseries and am used to the odd incident and cuts and bruises. It doesn't sound like your CM is handling the situation well or takes safety seriously enough. I would be explaining my concerns about the repeated incidents and her manner in discussing it, and looking for alternative childcare options in case this continues.

[TooExtraImmatureCheddar]

Look, I'm not trying to be mean here, but you are over-reacting to the scratch and the bite. I thought you were a year down the line and the scratch had actually scarred. It's not going to scar your child permanently - it's healing nicely. DS had a nasty mark last year across his mouth after the dog wrapped his lead around him and gave him a rope burn. It faded gradually and now you can't see a thing. This scar will do the same.

My DD bit and lashed out at nursery. Other children bit and scratched her. It happens. Now she is 4 and DS bites her (he's 21 months), although he hasn't done it at nursery. I try to stop him but he's bloody fast (and sneaky) and even if they are both right beside me or on my knee I can't always. The childminder is trying her hardest.

[wheresthel1ght]

Hissy whilst I appreciate the support name calling really isn't fair.

As I said below, I think juggling had the right idea when she suggested that cm had become a bit blind to it all.

I don't know if X has a habit of biting, she has never bitten dd before but I wouldn't know or expect to be told if she had done it to someone else. Neither will I be telling my friend whose dd is also with the same cm that this has happened as it is between myself the cm and x's parents.

If she can reassure me that she is taking precautions and that X's parents have taken on board that this behaviour is not acceptable and needs to be dealt with in an appropriate way then I am happy with that. Accidents happen, what I guess I probably didn't get across clearly enough as I was quite upset about how upset dd was yesterday, is that my biggest concern was the feeling that it was just being brushed off and not dealt with.

Cm may have just been having a rough day, she says she was stood there and monitoring and she assures me she will keep a closer eye. X definitely has an issue when it comes to sharing so hopefully now that cm knows I am upset about it she will be looking more closely at situations where sharing is a problem and intervening before something occurs.

As long as she is trying to stop it and the other parents are prepared to work at helping their dd then that is fine.

This thread has got more than a little nasty in some of its posts so I will be leaving it now.

I came for advice, received it, acted on it and hopefully that will be the end of it.

Thank you to everyone who has taken the time to post. I may not agree with some of what has been said but I do appreciate the experience of those of you who have been through this yourselves or in a work capacity. So thank you all

[GreatFuckability]

A just turned 2 year old isn't 'delibrately' hurting your child. they dont have the capacity for that kind of behaviour at that age, they simply lash out. it happens. I think you are being slightly OTT in your reaction tbh. your dd snatched a toy which instigated the biting incident.

[Blondeshavemorefun]

at. Accidents happen, what I guess I probably didn't get across clearly enough as I was quite upset about how upset dd was yesterday

Dd can't have been that upset as when she told her dad your dh she mentioned her scratched face not the bite mark

[TiredOfSleep]

I totally sympathise, but from the perspective of the mum with the biter and hitter, it's a hugely difficult situation.

DD bit one of the other cm mindees twice when she 18-20 months, one left a vivid bruise on her arm.

She has also lashes out but not harmed this mindee to extent of leaving other marks.

The problem is, it's really unpredictable. They spend 8 hours together, often playing closely and are usually in each other's space. It happens in the blink of an eye once in a blue moon.

My cm was really good and took it seriously. She would hover when she was concerned and responded appropriately to any incidences and DD has broadly grown out of it now.

I'm convinced though, that you get a lot worse with siblings, which is what they essentially are at the cm. I have several scars from my brothers and being bashed was par for the course, with appropriate sanctions of course.

[honkinghaddock]

You shouldn't mention the other parents at all when talking to your cm because their parenting has nothing to do with you.