AIBU to think not enough people are aware of the proposed changes to social housing?

[StripeySherbert]

The housing and planning bill is going to the 3rd stage in the House of Lords but I don't see much about it, it is going to affect so many people!

Pay to stay will be introduced, households with a 40k income for London or 30k elsewhere will pay local market rate rent, this extra rent goes to the government, not the councils. People who start paying private rented levels of rent will maybe expect more for their money? There will be no extra money in the pot, it's going to Central Government.

The new national living wage being introduced, the sums show that most households with 2 working full time will hit the 30k.

New tenancies will have a fixed term of 2 to 5 years. Meaning social housing will only be for those who have no other way to find housing themselves, whilst they get on their feet, most would think this should be the case, I use to think that should be the case myself, but that's not how communities form, being friendly with the neighbours, instead this could promote "sink estates?"

Councils will be forced to sell high value council properties that become empty or face a levy charge if they don't. Again, this money does not go to the council, it goes to Central Government.

This is only it in part, yet it seems to be flying under the radar!

Some of the changes wouldn't be so bad if the money went back into the local area/ local housing.

i suppose these new policies wont affect pensioners again

wow up to page 3 before someone mentions pensioners

If the cut off amount is going to be 30k or 40k I doubt that it will affect many pensioners the state pension of course is nowhere near 30k or 40k unless there is a private pension to top it up, even a couple getting top whack state pension would only clear about 20k between them (and that's both of them working for 40 odd years each and both getting basic plus serps (which BTW is based on what I would get if I was able to get my pension tomorrow plus what my DH is getting now so fairly accurate I would say)

Pensioners in sheltered housing will be affected.

Joe Halewood explains it well on his blog.

Wow 30k cut off. Me and hubby don't earn that and have been told previously we don't have a chance in hell to get a HA property.
We struggle to pay the private rent and are soon to move for the second time in 12 months as the house we signed upto longterm has been sold by our bastard landlord 6 months after we moved in.
I don't know enough about this to comment on what is/should be done but I would happily pay market rent for HA if it gave me the security of me and DH knowing we had the chance to stay where we were for 5 years

YY Gabi And the fact that its the young people in the house paying the rent has GOT to cause a shift in the power dynamic too.

With a private rent you get carpets, curtains, painted/ wallpapered walls and possibly fitted cookers white goods lamps, light shades etc.
With a council house you get a shell with no flooring and quite possibly graffiti on the walls.
The rents should not be set at the same level.

This is only council houses NOT housing association properties.
ItsAllAboutMe could you not buy your current home? You wouldn't need a deposit.

Seven it does affect HA properties.

I meant pay to stay won't affect HA tenants not the bill in general sorry.

Ah no worries.

Can someone please confirm whether it will affect ha houses?
People have said conflicting things like it does and then it doesn't .

People are going to be very annoyed as when you move in a council house/ha house it is a shell no carpets , walls usually no wallpaper etc, and what about people who have already spent thousands on their house thinking it's theirs for a long time and then they have to move as they can't afford it.
You can't compare rent on a council house to a private house.

It is really shitty to amend people's tenancies retrospectively , fair enough if they bringing this in on new tenancies but how can they legally change a tenancy?

Regular google Joe Halewood and read his blog. speyejoe wordpress

It's so predictable how the government are able to manipulate the general public into blaming the poor for being poor again.

Be real for a minute, on what planet is an income of £30k poor?? I know there will be cases of numberous children and high childcare fees, but many people manage to get through life without subsidised rents on less.

In an ideal world, there wouldn't be this "race to the bottom" and everyone would have affordable rents. But thats not the world we live in. There is too much demand and not enough supply, and its basically turned into a lottery type system where if you genuinely need social housing now, the chances of you getting it are miniscule unless you score incredibly highly on the points system (i.e, you are homeless with children and have literally no where to go, and even then you will likely be put into a b&b!).

Yet, there are people who don't genuinely need the housing, who would literally have 0 points if they applied today, who have guarenteed secure tenancy with low rents because they got in there first? How is this fair?

We either have a system which is based purely on luck, and open to everyone, or a system which is based on need and only for those who actually need it. This half and half approach is brutally unfair. The only thing I dislike about the proposal is that the money raised is not going towards building more social housing- that should be a no-brainer! But alas fairness and equality is not the goal of the tories.

Hamiltoes - not suggesting £30k is poor. Also, I can't comment on every situation because they are all different but in the case of my family there are particular circumstances which would make them struggle big time. I can't go into details without outing them unfortunately. But like I said, the solution wrt the lack of social housing is not to take it away or make it more difficult for people who already have it and have built a life for themselves in their homes. This policy is clearly not designed with the interests of those in need of housing - if it was, the additional money raised would be ploughed back into building more houses. That would at least make it understandable to a degree. Also agree with you that you can never expect fairness and equality from the tories, just won't happen.

How can this be fairly rolled out? If you live somewhere which has become a London dormitory town where market rates are through the roof (talking at least 1500 for a small 2 bed house) compared to somewhere a hell of a lot cheaper those who hit the 30k level will struggle enormously.
Will it affect those with existing tenancies?
Sorry..... might have missed a post where this has been covered

In order to make social housing available to those who need it, there can't be a load of people who are there for life regardless of earnings or household make up. So I agree that something needs to be done

Ok then I'll move.

Please find me a wheelchair accessible property anywhere in the UK, go on, take the challenge.

BTW I already pay market rent, my 2 bed place is twice the rent of the 3/4 bedroom properties that surround me (council) my council tax is band C theirs is band A, but hey I should be able to live here for life unless the tories shit on me again.

Sashh I'd argue if you can't adequately meet your housing needs otherwise then you do need social housing, which is exactly what the post you quoted is saying.

Imagine it wasn't there for you when you needed it because the accomodation you need, presumably wheelchair accessible, was already taken up by people living there who are no longer in need of accessable housing.

But you're already paying market rates anyway as you say... So I'm not entirely sure how your situation fits into the debate!

I'm not looking forward to this, and their turner our town into conmunter land si no doubt market rent is going to be even worse than now.
30 grand really isn't a lot, especially in south east, my ha rent for a 2 bed flat is nearly £700 ATM, market rent for the same flats over the road that are private is a fair bit over £1000. Joy

DD works in housing and she says there isn't a massive difference between private and council rents where she is. As usual the major problem will be in London and the south east.

tit you hit the nail on the head there 'lets force people to move around like chess pieces,'. Unless you're very wealthy this government treats everyone like a bloody chess piece.

We live just outside London HA 5 year tenancy. 2 adults 3 children.
We both work bring home £35000. But the market rate is £1600 a month. £19200 a year on rent. We are still paying off the credit card from when we moved in and had to spend £1500 on flooring and cooker and curtain poles and curtains and lamp shades and we've got no wallpaper on most the walls but that's fine because we're secure for 5 years and finally free of housing benefit this plan would mean we would have to apply for housing benefit.
I don't disagree with the idea but the amount needs to be much much higher.

Of course one of tha basic problems with housing is the housing shortage. In my district we need to build some 10,000 houses just to accommodate the existing adult children living with their parents. Then we need another 14,000 over the next 15 years to provide for demand.

But trying to build 25,000 houses is goinng to make a mess of the existing villages and towns. Whilst trying to build new towns and infrastructure will have to get past the EU regulations.

My first home as an adult was a housing association flat. After that it was private renting, and now we have a mortgage.

Private renting was THE WORST. More expensive than a mortgage per month by several hundred pounds, plus the letting agent fees were comparable to the estate agent fees when we moved into our own property... only we had to pay the letting fees every six months (for renewal of contract, or when the landlord decided to sell up), as opposed to the one time.

And at least with HA/council housing, you have some degree of privacy. When private renting, we couldn't decorate, or even put up our own pictures or mirrors. The Letting Agent came in every three months whilst we were at work for inspections, taking photos - it felt really invasive.

It's going to be horrible if they push the HA sector to be more like private renting, especially in terms of costs (and especially with the changes to council tax, where they're removing the exemptions and single person discount), and a disaster if they force HA to sell their properties.

In an ideal world, there wouldn't be this "race to the bottom" and everyone would have affordable rents. But thats not the world we live in. There is too much demand and not enough supply, and its basically turned into a lottery type system where if you genuinely need social housing now, the chances of you getting it are miniscule unless you score incredibly highly on the points system (i.e, you are homeless with children and have literally no where to go, and even then you will likely be put into a b&b!).

Yet, there are people who don't genuinely need the housing, who would literally have 0 points if they applied today, who have guarenteed secure tenancy with low rents because they got in there first? How is this fair?

We either have a system which is based purely on luck, and open to everyone, or a system which is based on need and only for those who actually need it.

Excellent post, completely agree with this.

Of course one of tha basic problems with housing is the housing shortage.

the problem is our government, backed by the people, are unwilling to deal with it. I was surprised at how little priority housing get in the last election. People are completely in line with nimby attitudes.

If we had to pay market rent that would be all of our earnings gone on essentials.

Rent 1200
Council tax 150
Food 300
Fuel 300
Electricity 130
Car insurance 30
Contents insurance 10
Car tax 15
Tv licence 15
Water 30
Pre school 15

2196 which is £26,340 per year. We do get child benefit and a small amount of tax credits which currently covers what we're paying in debt from when we moved in.

Obviously this doesn't include dd's swimming lessons (she has a physical genetic condition these are important), clothes, shoes, school trips, savings (ha!), car problems, birthdays and Christmas etc etc.

I just can't see us managing, the rent would go up more than I earn so it wouldn't be worth me working (I still would because I love my job!).

I consider myself really lucky to have this house though and know I probably wouldn't qualify for it now. We would consider moving away but dh wouldn't be able to earn the same as he does here elsewhere (plus our family etc are all here and dc's school, dd's amazing doctors). Eventually I would love to own my own home and hope to do part rent part buy but we currently don't earn enough to be eligible.