to think this is not a workplace culture that should be encouraged

[jazzingaround]

A friend's son has just started a new job and was telling my friend that 'it's not the done thing' to leave the office at your contracted time. Apparently everyone hangs around, not wanting to be the first to go, finding stuff to do, deliberately sending emails to their managers so the time will show up etc etc.

AIBU to find this increasingly prevalent attitude sad and unhealthy? Obviously, in some jobs, long hours are unavoidable. In others, staff are overloaded and unwillingly working ridiculous hours.

But people deliberately and needlessly hanging around the office after their contracted working day is finished, and management encouraging and rewarding this kind of behaviour, seems like a backward step to me.

[ToastedOrFresh]

Some years ago a friend told me that in Germany, if you did not leave on time, there would be concern that you were not up to the job.

The very first office job I ever had, I overheard the boss remark to a co-worker, 'why can't she get the work done by five o'clock ?' By implication, why is she so slow ? I.e. she's in the wrong job.

That was nearly 30 years ago.

[Whiskeywithwater]

I've worked on a trading floor all of my working life - it wouldn't function if everyone started at their contracted time if 9am - 7-7.30am is the norm - possibly secretaries between 8-8.30. Traders and Sales will be out close to 5.30 - they're judged on their p&l rather then hours at the desk! Reality is support staff will be there late, but it's because of volume of work, not presenteeism ...& then we're on blackberries for the remainder of the evening & weekends. It's just the way it works ..

[LiviaDrusillaAugusta]

I work in a firm which doesn't have a culture of late working.

Because of the type of work we do in our department however, I am expected to work when it's necessary (so it doesn't always mean there is a lot of work, but the work is time sensitive).

So working until 10.00 pm isn't unheard of. But it's just how it is, I knew what I was getting into when I took the job, having worked in the same sector and for the same person before. I don't organise anything outside of work during the week, or on the odd occasion I have to, it's always on the basis that I would have to cancel last minute.

Luckily my boss is flexible, so he doesn't give a toss if I'm a few minutes late in a morning, have to go early for a doctor appointment/early train etc.

The hanging round trying to be the last to leave is crazy though!

[LiviaDrusillaAugusta]

I do have a rule about not starting until 9.00 am though but that's only because it's impossible for me to get out of bed early enough to arrive at work before then

[JassyRadlett]

I knew my current workplace (where I am now quite senior, definitely career job, big multinational) was the right fit for me when my first manager informed me that she would think less rather than more of me if I was in the office all the time as it would clearly mean that I couldn't manage my time.

This. I was in an office with a horrible presenteeism culture until we got a new boss, who said 'if you're having to work long hours as a regular thing, either I'm not managing your workloads well or you're not managing your workloads well. Which is it?'

The culture changed, and productivity improved. It's an approach I've taken to management ever since. My staff (and I) work late when needed, but it's not a regular thing and we give staff lots of flexibility in return. Staff retention is more important to me, and treating people decently is fundamental to that.

[Unexpectedsocialist]

This. I was in an office with a horrible presenteeism culture until we got a new boss, who said 'if you're having to work long hours as a regular thing, either I'm not managing your workloads well or you're not managing your workloads well. Which is it?'

You don't work for me do you? I use this all the time. If you do, then it only looks like I am on here in work hours.

[Jux]

The only time I worked my contracted hours was in the 70s in a shop. I never worked in a shop again, and never stuck to my contracted hours either.malways worked late, always took work home with me.

[JassyRadlett]

You don't work for me do you? I use this all the time. If you do, then it only looks like I am on here in work hours

Judging by username alone, I'm guessing not! I use it all the time now - best lesson I've ever had.