to object to after-school activity finishing at 9.30pm

[kitnkaboodle]

... twice a week, including term time! Am I the only person here who feels this is too late for pre-teen kids (or even early teens)?

I raised some objection and have definitely been made to feel that IABU by the organisers.

Not wanting to out myself, but it is a musical activity, so if my DD opts to leave early each night, she will obv. be missing some practice/instruction. What do others feel about this? DD is 12 and normally she's in bed at 9, lights out 9.30 - and my DH usually goes to bed at 10!

[OrangeVase]

9.30 pm fine. My DCs late to bed. If too late don't do it - it isn't compulsory.
Does your DD really enjoy it?

[Jeeves93]

It sounds a bit late as a regular occurrence for primary age kids, but not for secondary. I run a cadet unit (year 8 and up though) and we are 19:30 to 21:30, and that is a standard across the country (apart from CCF - they tend to be just after school). The time is probably chosen to suit the adults like ours is, but if it didn't we wouldn't have any and it would happen.

[BarbarianMum]

YABU I'm afraid.

Age 8-18 is a wide spread of ages. But your dd doesn't have to participate.

[MamanOfThree]

My 11yo would not cope with such a late bed time twice a week.
There is no way I would let an 8yo doing that!!
As for the 18yo... I supose it depends on the 18yo but then I wouldn't cope with it so.....
However, it clearly depends on the time said children are getting up. Mines are up between 6.30 and 7.00am wo a fail so it doesn't work.
If the dcs participating are getting up at 8.00am (as a lot of the children in the dcs class seem to do), then I suppose that 9.30pm isn't that bad.

Fwiw, my 11yo went away recently with school and the children were told to go to bed at 10.00pm and get up at 7.00am. Most seem to have coped well with it. My dc took 2 weeks to recover from 2 nights....

I think that making the comment to the organisers is OK.
As is asking your dd to leave earlier and making clear to the irganisers WHY she is doing so.
Maybe other people will follow.

[MamanOfThree]

What I would say though is to keep a close eye on her.
A lot of teenagers (and adults) are knackered but they are so used to it that they don't even realise. They just carry on on adrenaline instead.

There is also this idea that it's better to go to bed late and I've met more than one adult (and even more teenagers) who think that going to bed before 12.00 is like a weakness.

seen that a lot of reports are blaming the lack of sleep for the not as good results at school....

[ChaiseLounger]

Scouts for 11 year old's finish at 9pm here. Not a problem to me or ds1.

[Iliveinalighthousewiththeghost]

No YNBU. By the time you get home it would be around the 10 pm mark, then it's getting ready for bed which takes time. Therefore you're looking at around 11pm for bedtime. Which is far too late for a school night.
Also you say the organisers are making you feel like yabu. But I'd there not the option to go to another club. I mean surely if they don't cater for their customers needs they lose them and you can't possibly be the only parent who has complained. Can't you all get together and request a better time slot. People tend to listen when people are in numbers

[MythicalKings]

If anyone tried that with my group they'd be told to get stuffed.

When volunteers run activities for other people's DCs then they get to set the agenda. If parents don't like it then they can find another group. I can't believe that anyone would have the cheek to try to organise parents to forces volunteers to change the times. A new level of "entitled".

We have a waiting list for our group and they'd be told to piss off and take their DCs with them. Shame for the DCs but parents don't get to dictate how I spend my free time.

[OddBoots]

Try it and see. My dc started Scouts aged 10 1/2 and I was very worried because it was on a Monday and finished at 9.30pm but actually they coped okay and didn't seem to get too tired.

[OddBoots]

Iliveinalighthousewiththeghost - why would a 12yo take an hour to get ready for bed? Mine takes 10 minutes, maybe 15 if she needs a shower.

[TeenAndTween]

Odd My DD takes an hour to 'unwind' after an activity, so it wouldn't take an hour to get to bed, but would take her an hour to actually get to sleep.

[MamanOfThree]

The thing is MythicalKings, if the group run by volunteers has no one coming over because it's not suitable, what's the point in running the group at all?
These volunteers are as dependent on the children coming to see them then the children are dependent on them to do said activity. From that pov, everyone has to make an effort and be ready to listen.

If the volunteers were only available between 12.00 and 3.00pm weekday, I doubt that any children would be able to come.
If they wanted to really run that group, they would need to make an effort to do it out of school hours so it can work.

The OP has never been about 'forcing' the volunteers to have a different time as such. She is saying she thinks the times are unsuitable for a 12yo. Which I, and others, agree to.
On the pov of the volunteers, knowing that might lead to different possibilities.
Review the times so they have more people coming (esp if they have some issues with the size of the group)
Think that actually the group isn't suitable for young children such as an 8yo and stop catering for the yongest ones.
Review everything and actually come to the conclusion it's the best compromise for everyone in the current situation.

[MythicalKings]

Maman I said we have a waiting list, so that just doesn't happen. Not in my group or the others know of in the area. Our parents are grateful for our time and what we do and wouldn't be so rude as to suggest we changed how we work.

If they wanted to really run that group, they would need to make an effort to do it out of school hours so it can work.

Not sure what your argument is there, it doesn't make sense. When you volunteer for something you choose an activity that fits in with the hours you can be available. Our group already works perfectly well and has done for years.

Review everything and actually come to the conclusion it's the best compromise for everyone in the current situation.

We don't need to. We have never had less than 12 or so on the waiting list. They can start at aged 8, like the group in question.

Parents have a choice about whether or not to send their DCs to a group that finishes at 9.30pm. If they don't like the hours they can look for something else.

[MamanOfThree]

we have a waiting list, so that just doesn't happen

That's your answer then. You don't have the need to make allowances/efforts because people are queuing anyway.

I'm wondering why you are feeling under attack though. My point wasn't about you in particular and your group. It was about the fact you seem to think no one should ever ask anything from the volunteer because they are volunteers.
What I am saying is actually in some cases they would. I have no idea of that is the case for the OP and the activity her dd wants to do. But this is something worth mentioning. That's all :)

[Scholes34]

As others have said, once DCs move up to Scouts from Cubs, there's a much later end time which initially seems very late. Changes in life always seem a big step, but they quickly become the norm.

One change for parents to deal with is their children going to bed later than them. Now my DC are teenagers, they are invariably up later than me. Eventually, you get to trust them to put the cat out and lock up.

OP, if it's too late an end time for your DD, then it's not the activity for her. She might, however, be more resilient than you think.

[MythicalKings]

I'd already said in a previous post that we have a waiting list, Maman. I was tetchy because you obviously hadn't read it.

I agree that groups need to review how they work from time to time if they are losing members, but that isn't often he case with theatre, choirs and dancing.

[budgiegirl]

I'd have no problems with my DCs attending an activity until 9.30, although I can see that this will not suit all children. I am lucky that mine seem to cope with a bit less sleep for one night, as long as they catch up the next night. But I do know some children that are a wreck for a week if they go to bed late even once.

You need to decide whether this activity, and the time it is on, is suitable for your DD. It's not compulsory to attend.

I don't think it's unreasonable to politely say to the organisers that DD will not be able to attend because the activity goes on too late. But you would be very unreasonable to try to suggest that the times should be changed to suit your DD.

I would think that if the volunteers found that lots of people were leaving due to the times, they may try to rethink the times. But presumably the timings work for enough people, as the activity is running. And it may be that this is the only time the volunteers are able to attend.

[fortyfide]

Talk to the governors or your local MP about the late finishing. Heads are capable of silly rules at times.

[CloserToFiftyThanTwenty]

What on earth do you think an MP can / could / would do about activity finish times?!

[Quartermass]

There's nothing wrong with talking to the organisers about the timing issue. If it suits the majority of the children/parents for the activity to start and finish earlier, and the volunteers can accommodate that, then why not? A nasty attitude here by volunteers who say that just because people come to their group (which may be because they have been given no choice over timings and have nowhere else to go) they will tell anyone who asks about the possibility of shifting the time (if that would be practical for the organisers and would suit other parents better than the current time) to Stuff Off!

[MythicalKings]

A nasty attitude? Do you know what volunteer means? If I am giving up hours of my time not just on the night but also making costumes then I think it's only fair that the hours suit me and the other adults running the group. A nasty attitude is people who don't help at such groups telling us to change our hours. Fortunately our parents are lovely.

[Quartermass]

If you run a group, you should not get in a strop if a parent politely asks about the possibility of something changing if a change would suit the other people involved in the group, including the volunteers.

[MargolottaOfUberwold]

It is quite normal for guides

[Jeeves93]

You may find that the times are actually out of the control of the people running the the group - I am told my times by people higher up the food chain. Also because we rent space in a community centre, it is often not possible to do any other time as the building is in use.

Remember that the people running it will probably be working during the day. I get home from work at 6pm or just after. I then need to have dinner, get changed and possibly print out some paperwork that has come through during the day. By the time I can leave the house it is 7pm. Doing anything earlier simply isn't the case. Add to the fact that our existing 12-13yos don't complain about the timings and I am not inclined to try and change anything.

[redskybynight]

I don't think there is any harm in asking but chances are that the time IS set because an earlier time is not convenient to the organisers and/or a lot of the participants.

DS has just started advanced karate which finishes at 9pm - he is one of the youngest there at age 11. When he moved up the instructor apologized about the late time but said it was because there were more adults attending than at "normal" karate and hence they couldn't start until 7 at the earliest to give people a chance to get home from work, get changed, have something to eat etc. Sounds like it might be something similar with OP's group.