To rally Irish voters here and ask is anyone voting No tomorrow?

[LayMeDown]

I know there's lots of Irish on MN. I don't know anyone in RL voting No. But polls indicates it's tightening a lot. I'm getting scared it won't pass and my lovely brother and his partner will be left out in the cold again. What are you all hearing in your circles?

FYI for any non Irish there is a referendum tomorrow on introducing same sex marriage in Ireland.

[chaletdays]

I think that's a bit unfair mad. I know gay people, in civil partnerships, who are voting no. It's a complex matter and there are myriad reasons why people are voting yes, no, or are still unsure.

[Lorelei353]

ApocalypseThen I don't understand why, if you're so passionate, you didn't re-register where you currently live. It's not hard and could've been done ages ago.

Always used to drive me mad when students would give out about elections being held on days when they were at University instead of back at their parents where they're registered. It's not hard to register where you live!

[TheVeryThing]

I think MIL is voting No, my fairly religious parents are both vehement Yes voters. My Uncle and Aunt (Opus Dei members) are voting No, hardly a surprise.
Apart from that I would expect most people I know to vote Yes.

I am worried that those who are undecided will vote for the status quo and i think it'll be really close.

It's encouraging that there are so many newly registered to vote as I imagine the vast majority will be young and Yes voters.

I will be very depressed if it's rejected as it will be quite a few years before it can be revisited.

gabsdot45 you do realise that many people don't believe in God but are still married.

What gives you the right to impose your religious views on others? Nobody will be forced into a same sex marriage, or forced to attend one.

As has been pointed out above, this is about civil marriage only and nothing to do with religion.

[MitzyLeFrouf]

The No brigade have been wheeling out their No voting gay man Paddy Manning all week but I'm willing to bet the percentage of gay people voting No is extremely low.

[MitzyLeFrouf]

Oven glove manufacturers say No!

[leedy]

I love the fact that Paddy Manning is now actually going round with a sign on saying GAY MAN. I would also imagine the percentage of gay people voting No is very very low (I certainly don't know any): I don't think it's one of those "ooh, it's very complicated and nuanced, there are loads of good reasons to vote against, lots of gay people are voting No" issues at all, really.

On the other hand, there is the No Equality Oven Glove: twitter.com/TJ_Politics/status/600993777977860096

[leedy]

Damn, cross-posted with Mitzy! THE OVEN GLOVE COMMANDS US.

[ApocalypseThen]

ApocalypseThen I don't understand why, if you're so passionate, you didn't re-register where you currently live. It's not hard and could've been done ages ago.

I thank you for your concern. I have specific reasons which are no business of yours and which I'm under no obligation to explain to you or anybody else. You will have to accept my assurances, as a fully grown adult woman that I do know what I'm doing, and why.

[MitzyLeFrouf]

We must do as the holy oven glove tells us. Point the way oh holy oven glove!

[leedy]

Genuinely, if it is indeed "complicated", can anyone provide me with a good argument for voting No? That doesn't involve God or a hypothetical constitutional right to procreation for married people?

constitutionproject.ie/?p=503

[Lottapianos]

'I know gay people, in civil partnerships, who are voting no'

I would love to know more about their reasons. I'm in an opposite sex partnership myself and I have very many problems with marriage. I would be much more comfortable with a civil partnership personally and live in hope that my DP and I will get the chance to have one here, like opposite sex couples in other EU countries do.

However, even if you are a strong critic of marriage (which I completely get), I don't understand why anyone would deny the option to others. If opposite sex couples have the option to become legally married, then that same right must be extended to same sex couples.

[chaletdays]

"ooh, it's very complicated and nuanced, there are loads of good reasons to vote against, lots of gay people are voting No" issues at all, really.


Any particular reason you put in the 'ooh', Leedy?

[leedy]

"Any particular reason you put in the 'ooh', Leedy?"

Because Mumsnet has yet to provide me with an eyerolling smiley?

[leedy]

But genuinely, as I said above, I'd like to know what these supposed "good reasons to vote No" are. Because I haven't heard any yet.

[leedy]

Also, like Lotta I have a lot of problems with marriage myself (and indeed am not married to my partner, though if the referendum passes one of my major objections will be gone), but I still think that the option should be available to everyone.

[chaletdays]

Ok. You obviously think I'm ridiculous to see that people may have valid reasons for voting either way.
I think you're ridiculous to not see that.

But that's democracy. We're both entitled to our viewpoint.

[MitzyLeFrouf]

There is no valid reason to vote No on this issue. None.

[leedy]

Yes, I think it's one of those issues where we don't need "balance" and "seeing both sides", because one of those sides is clearly wrong. It's why I get so annoyed when RTE keep hauling out the bloody Iona Institute every time there's discussion on a social issue to provide mad right-wing "balance".

[TTWK]

but for me, marriage is a union between and man and woman in the sight of God.

So would you also vote no to civil marriages between straight people, as they are not in the sight of god, or would you vote no to Hindu marriages, which are in the sight of the wrong God(s)?

I can't really get my head around that.

[MitzyLeFrouf]

The church are too scared to actually stick their head above the parapet so instead they get their nasty puppets the Iona Institute to do it for them.

[chaletdays]

"Yes, I think it's one of those issues where we don't need "balance" and "seeing both sides", because one of those sides is clearly wrong."

In your view. Regardless of the way the voting goes tomorrow, I respect the right of people to feel they don't want the definition of marriage to be changed.

If they said gay people should be locked up, or barred by law from living together that would be different, as that genuinely is intolerance.

[MitzyLeFrouf]

A big hurrah to Sr Stanislaus and some progressive priests who came out publicly in favour of Yes especially the priest (whose name escapes me) who came out to his congregation when urging them to vote Yes.

[Lottapianos]

'Yes, I think it's one of those issues where we don't need "balance" and "seeing both sides", because one of those sides is clearly wrong'

I tend to agree leedy. Its just so blindingly, screamingly obvious that there is only one fair, reasonable and sane option here. But never, ever, underestimate the prevalence of plain old, dunderheaded stupidity. And issues like this demand just a little bit of thinking, and some people will do almost anything to avoid doing that. Ever.

chaletdays, opposition to civil marriage for same sex couples is intolerance, every bit as much as the examples you gave. All couples should have exactly the same rights under the law. There is no good reason why they shouldn't.