Advice on this - DP feels left out

[chumrun]

I have one brother. He is 18 months older than me and we lost our mum when we were 15 and 17.

It's fair to say our dad went a bit 'strange' after this and although this affected both of us my brother was most impacted and turned to drugs. It was a long and slow decline if you like but he seems to be out the other side now.

Then 3 months ago Dad died and it's brought my brother and I closer together in a way but I've had to take on the supportive role I've always had to.

DP is a relatively new addition (met him in April so he never met my dad) and anyway I was talking about a holiday we are having at the end of this week - just a 3 day break - and I mentioned maybe my brother would like to come and he went absolutely nuclear at me. Said he was sick of hearing about it, he felt pushed out of this shared history (never met my dad or my mum of course) and while he was at it my house looks like a bloody shrine (!)

I of course started crying and he did calm down then and said sorry sorry sorry but if we were going to move forward he had to admit he really dislikes my brother and he thought at first it was cause brother was grieving but he just dislikes him.

I don't know, I can't just leave my brother to it but I can't choose between my brother and DP either. And I'm so pushed for time anyway!

Any suggestions?

[LoveBeingInTheSun]

32 is not old, this is not your last chance at happiness. You have oy know him since April, he is now trying to distance you from your brother .

[feelslikeshit]

OP, it sounds like you've got an enormous amount on, and, leaving aside the question about whether your current DP is right for you or not, I think any partner isn't going to be too keen on spending a lot of time with your brother from the off as it is easier for you to fit in.

Would you willingly give up your volunteering or part time job so you could spend more time with your partner? If you don't want to, then it sounds like you're not that into him.

It also sounds like, whatever happens, you need to gently get your brother used to the idea that he's not going to be able to tag along with you all the time.

Would it be worth having a break from relationships for a while until you sort your head out a bit, and see how you feel after a few weeks? If DP is worth it then he'll understand why you can't have a full on romance at the moment.

[chumrun]

I don't think I am grieving to be honest. Obviously I was upset at first but really I lost my dad - the dad I knew and loved - when I lost my mum.

Oh and my brother isn't a smackhead he became addicted to prescription drugs.

I don't think my DPs response was reasonable - neither does he - it was completely out of order BUT I don't think it necessarily means he's a terrible person either. I'm going for some middle ground here.

I could give up the volunteering or the part time job but they both need me, and I feel bad! Need to think about this: being pulled every which way at the moment which is the source of the problem.

[needanew]

sounds like your db is very dependent on you , im not surprised your new bloke wants a 3 day break with just you and him , you dont have to choose over them just spend a bit of time away from your db and see how you feel about the new bf .

[AskBasil]

chumrun the reason I think you sound scared to be alone, is because you are so determined to ignore the red flags for the sake of a relationship which has only been going for a few weeks. You have very little investment in it, the guy has shown massive red flags and yet you are unwilling to even consider whether it's worth bothering with. The default position seems to be that you need to bend over backwards to find a way to balance everyone's needs. You don't need to balance anyone else's needs if you don't want to.

[heraldgerald]

^^this. Sometimes it's a relief to hear someone say that you don't have to try to meet or even balance everyone's needs, especially if that's the role you've always taken in a family dynamic. I can relate to that.

[chumrun]

A few weeks is a bit of an exaggeration; it's 5 months! It pales into insignificance against 5 years of course but just the same it isn't like we met in July and have had a few dates.

I'm not remotely afraid to be alone but nor do I want or intend to throw away a relationship because of one argument. DP was out of order and has apologised profusely. If he does it again well I would take that as a red flag and walk away but I think frustration and upset can make people say things they don't mean.

But I know what you mean about trying to balance needs - I do. I just don't know how to do it!

[Nanny0gg]

I know the OP hasn't been in the relationship long, but if it may be long term, should she really put family first?

Most MNetters with 'difficult' families wouldn't dream of putting them ahead of their relationships.

chumrun Do you not think you've taken on too much? At your expense?

Job 2 and volunteering may need you, but they will manage without. No-one is indispensable!

[PenelopePitstops]

I agree with need a new.

It must be wearing for your dp to have to see you and your brother all the time. He is in a relationship with you, not your brother.

Otoh he was quite harsh to you about it. Perhaps he just snapped and had been wanting to talk for a while but your brother was always there.

[chumrun]

I think the problem is that since DP and I don't live together we have spent a lot of time 'out' and this obviously is extra 'work' for me; I'm going to see about spending more time actually at one another's houses than going out for a meal or away on weekend breaks etc.

[LatteLoverLovesLattes]

You said you met him in April, it's only August. 4 months. 16ish weeks. Even if it was 5 months - 20ish weeks. Less than half of one year. No time at all and he is going Nuclear at you, telling you he doesn't like your brother, doesn't want to hear about your family, can't deal with your history and thinks you house is a shrine??

You say -

You aren't grieving
You aren't in denial/ignoring the red flags
You aren't afraid to be alone

But are -

Looking at giving up volunteering or your part time job.
Saying you can't choose between your brother and your boyfriend.


I think you need to slow down a bit & breathe. Your Dad has only just died, I know you 'lost' him a long while back, but he was still here, you still had 'someone' or 'hope'. You are now an adult orphan - it's a weird thing to come to terms with. I think you are trying to brush those emotions 'under the carpet' and just 'crack on with it'.

He had nothing to be 'upset & frustrated' about. You made a suggestion, that's all. He might have had a point had you just invited your brother along without discussing it, but you didn't.

He's known your brother 5 minutes at one of the worst times of your brothers life and he has decided he doesn't like him?! Where's the empathy? Where's the concern for YOUR brother?

Even if you house is a shrine to your Dad/Parents what's it to do with him? and 3 months after you Dad dying is NO time to be addressing this, even sympathetically, let alone angrily.

This guy has issues, you will regret it if you stay with him.

[chumrun]

No, it's 5 months but anyway I'm not splitting hairs. I was just pointing out that it isn't as if I've been on two dates either.

DP has spent a LOT of time with my brother. My brother is in all honesty 'difficult' - has few friends , lacks social graces, that sort of thing.

I haven't said I'll give up my PT job or volunteer work? I said I could do with dropping one of them but I can't as I feel too guilty!

I'm really fine with losing my dad. Maybe that sounds heartless but I'm 32, it isn't like I was 5 or something. Sad but things we don't plan for happen all the time and hey that's life. I think DP was saying be felt like there was too much emphasis on the past not the future and - I really hope the future includes him. I really do care about him but fitting him in and brother and work and work2 and volunteer work and friends and hobbies is I don't know - overwhelming.

I need to decide what can give.

[SaskiaRembrandtWasFramed]

You might not feel like you are grieving, but you will be. It's quite normal for people to go through a long period of feeling okay after a bereavement, but the sense of loss does catch up sooner or later.

Your bf sounds like a bit of a twat tbh. I can understand why he wouldn't want your brother to come away with you, but his other comments are nasty.

[chumrun]

Saskia at first I was very upset but I can honestly say right now I am very happy and I'd go as far to say happier than I've been in a long time. Not because I've lost my dad but because I'm free of the anger and shame he evoked in me.

It's frustrating to be told you 'are' doing something, when you're not. My feet are very firm on the ground and I know that I'm not sad or grieving, not really. I'm free, is what I am.

I grieved for him years ago.

But all this is beside the point - I guess I just posted wondering how to sort the DP/brother issue and the consensus is LTB and grieve even though I want to do neither

[Viviennemary]

You've only known your DP since April. I think he has shown his true colours by being insensitive and selfish. I'd ditch him.

[LatteLoverLovesLattes]

OK - let's put aside the grieving issue.

Your boyfriend has said he dislikes your brother. Is that something you can live with?

[chumrun]

Latte - as I've said I can understand this.

My brother is no saint: he's an ex drug addict, unemployed, virtually friendless man and he's virtually friendless for a reason. I can understand and see the links and see why things happened like that but it doesn't change the fact my brother is as I have said 'difficult'.

I need to have another talk with DP i think.

[Madamecastafiore]

Stop thinking abut what everyone else needs and start thinking about what you need.

If you have such limited time that you can't sustain a relationship and give your brother the support he needs then other things will have to give.

Personally, I would ditch any man who said something so nastily about any member of my family. Especially someone who has always relied I me and is still grieving. I really could not see myself going forward in a relationship with someone who lacked empathy to such a degree.

[chumrun]

So do I then have to devote the rest of my life to my brother !? Great! Do you see my quandary! I need a life of my own but I'm being pulled every which way.

[Yambabe]

You are not your brother's parent, and you are not responsible for his life and happiness.

I'm not seeing anywhere in your posts where your DP is saying you can't see your DB if you keep seeing him as others have inferred, just that he doesn't like him much? I think that's allowed.

To be fair to your DP, he has already had one holiday with you cancelled and now you want to bring your DB on another break? I think I'd go a bit nuclear in that situation too if I'm honest.

We can all say stuff we don't mean in the heat of the moment, if you are prepared to give your DP the benefit of the doubt and forgive him I think that's your right to do.

It does sound like you are stretching yourself too thinly at the moment though. I would suggest that maybe job#2 or the volunteering needs to go, because at the moment it doesn't sound like you are getting any "you" time!

[LatteLoverLovesLattes]

Yep - I think that's about your only option right now. Tell him that you cannot and will not 'abandon' your brother, so what does he suggest/what can he handle?

... and yes, going out all of the time is exhausting, stay home more - at yours, at his.

[QuacksForDoughnuts]

Clearly 'going nuclear' is unreasonable and OP's partner needs to work his arse off to come back from that. But do you all remember the thread the other week, the lady whose husband had invited his sister along on holiday and refused to budge on that even though her tendency to drama had ruined the last one? Very few people thought that lady was being unreasonable for not wanting SIL along on the trip. (btw I agree she wasn't) Hell, she was the one getting LTB-ed from many quarters. Why shouldn't OP's partner want their relationship to be bilateral, just sometimes, rather than always being part of a trio with someone he wouldn't choose to spend time with?

On the other hand, there's a case to be made that everyone who is reliant on OP and clamouring for her time should step back a bit and let her breathe.

[PosyFossilsShoes]

You've been mothering your brother for seventeen years. That's longer than George Martin has been writing Game of Thrones.

If he'd only been a baby when your mother died, he'd be seeking independence right about now. He's not "stuck" at home, he's made the decision to be - and why wouldn't he, when you look after him and provide him with a ready made social life for which he needs to put in zero effort? It was really good of you to take on that role for your brother. But now he needs to take some responsibility for himself, and that might be difficult but how long are you going to let him do this? He's 34 now… 44? 54?

Your DP was wrong to go nuclear & it's good he's apologised. But if I was looking at the prospect of a future in which a difficult, friendless, former addict was stuck to my partner I think I would be expressing some serious concerns as well.

It sounds like you are a very generous, giving person - to your brother, volunteering, extra work - but maybe you need to learn how to take and not just how to give.

[Topseyt]

I would agree with those who are saying that the DP is getting too much of a hard time here. If my husband wanted to bring someone (anyone) else along on a romantic break we had both been looking forward to then I would not be impressed. I wouldn't go nuclear, but would make my disappointment apparent.

The OP and her DP were already forced to cancel one holiday due to her brother's behaviour. It sounds as if he accepted that and has put up with a fair bit from her brother over the few months they have been together. Who can blame him for not wanting another one to be spoiled??!! Give him the benefit of the doubt this time, but if it happens again then reconsider. That is what I think.

My BIL too as a lot of problems (alcohol & drugs) which are similar to those of the OP's brother, so I can speak from a certain amount of family experience. It has been very difficult for my husband. They too lost their mother three months ago, and BIL has been virtually impossible to deal with since then (long story). Hubby has had to step back from dealing with his brother for the sake of his own sanity. It was just way too stressful. They are now virtually no-contact.

OP, I think that you too do need to step back from your brother's problems. You are not responsible for him, he is responsible for himself and you will drive yourself crazy if you keep dropping everything for him. I am not saying go no contact, or stop seeing your brother, just slowly start to disengage a little so that he gets used to standing on his own two feet and is less dependent on you. His problems can only be sorted out if HE wants them sorted. He needs to realise that he makes his own bed, and has to lie in it.

[AskBasil]

I think the problem is that the DP has no right to "go nuclear" at this stage of the relationship. 16 weeks in and 3 months after a bereavement. A reasonable person has every right to want to spend time with hteir DP without their needy relatives present and to discuss that reasonably with them, stating their case. But to go nuclear on them when they simply suggest something inappropriate, in these circumstances, is just not something I can imagine a reasonable man doing.

It's the entitlement of it that keeps niggling at me. The thing about entitlement, is that it doesn't suddenly go away because someone objects to its expression; if the OP tells her DP that she doesn't want any more nuclear scenes he may well adapt his behaviour; but that feeling of entitlement will still be there and that's at the root of why some of us are seeing red flags.

OP, I think you need to find out if the nuclear stuff was simply pent up frustration as you want to believe, or if it in fact signifies unreasonable assumptions of entitlement on your DP's part. It may well be the former (you know this guy better than we do) but if it isn't, then this relationship will cause you no end of trouble and you need to know upfront that that's what you're signing up for.

FWIW I think the role of a partner in the honeymoon phase of a relationship at a generally acknowledged difficult time (whether you feel it's difficult or not) isn't to cause you extra stress in trying to balance meeting everyone's needs, it's to take some of the weight off, so that you feel supported at a time like this, isn't it? The fact that this guy is adding to your feelings of being pulled in every direction instead of making you feel that at least there's this lovely, supportive, joyful part of your life in among all the obligations, is a large part of what feels wrong about this. He should be the good thing in all this, not part of the problem.