to think you have to be either rich or poor to live in London?

[manicinsomniac]

After another fantastic day in London yesterday I'm in one of regular 'boo hoo hoo, I want to live in London and I'll never be able to' moods.

Please tell me it's possible. Is there anybody in the middle income bracket living there?? (I know logically there must be!) Please tell me how you do it!!

I'm a single parent of 3 children and earn too much to get HB or WTC. There's no way I could pay more than 800 in rent and I'd need a 3 bed house in order not to be squashing my children in for my own selfish reasons (I'd put us all in a 1 bed to be in London if they weren't actual real people!! )

Ugh, it sounds even worse written down - it's not going to happen is it :(

Maybe if I save for a deposit to buy a London house instead of a reasonably priced one then I can eventually become a cool child-free Granny living it up in the capital!

I'm mainly just on a bit of a lighthearted but totally jealous of all you Londoners rant but, on a serious note - is there a danger of our capital city becoming completely out of reach to the majority? Has it happened already?

Most people I know who live there are either very wealthy or single people in houseshares

[SqueezedMiddle]

I shouldnt have assumed - just get exasperated when people complain about London schools as of London is the problem. Youth violence isnt a London problem - but I certainly dont mean to make light of your situation. It sounds awful.

[FidelineandFumblin]

Fair enough. Maybe I am wrong to assume it's an urban problem. I hope not .

[fuckinglondonballs]

We pay 1100 for a one bed flat in a very nice area, zone 3. The landlord could get 1400+ for it really so we're 'lucky' I guess.

We're looking to save £40k for a deposit (and stamp duty) on a three bed house in a not so nice area. But by the time we get there I imagine we'll be needing more than £40k...

DH works in the city, and already commutes two hours a day.
Currently wondering where to move to. Both have very London based careers. Friends and family in this area of London.

Terraced 3 beds where we live have increased 50% in value over last two and a bit years to approx £800,000. Those are the small ones... I have no idea how people are affording them. Friends have inherited/been given large cash gifts.

Should probably think about DC soon as we're old now. But the £1300 a month nursery fees will more than wipe out saving potential.

Don't know what to do.

[Laquitar]

That link with a 3 bed flat in Maida Vale must be a mistake. Those flats in that area are at least 2K per month.

[NigellasDealer]

if it is not a mistake it will be gone in 5 mins flat

[Fairylea]

Come and live in south norfolk. Beautiful, low crime and cheap and when you want a day out in London trains go into London Liverpool street in an hour and a half for £6 return if you book in advance. I moved after 26 years in London and I'd never move back.

[NigellasDealer]

come and live a mere 210 miles away and you can rent a lovely old stone cottage with a huge garden and sheds for just £90 a week! (smug, I just found this!! so happy! planning chickens polytunnells and bees)

[fuckinglondonballs]

It is DEFINITELY a mistake, haha. It'd go in five minutes if it was double that.

[NearTheWindymill]

To live a comfortable life and be able to take advantage of what London offers I think you probably do have to be rich or poor now.

Where we live (zone 3 nowadays) what were originally very small 3 bed terraces go for more than £1 million. The primaries are fine; the secondaries are dire. I don't know who can afford it any more although a local estate agent was telling me that a lot of it is being done on family money with £4-£500,000 mortgages which don't bear thinking about. Where we used to live in zone 2 is now restricted to magic circle, investment bankers and the family money they tend to bring with them.

Paradoxically though, if the cost of housing is taken account of, I think it is cheaper to live well in London than elsewhere largely due to competition. I know when we eat out in Yorkshire we end up paying £150 for four for something purporting to be a nice restaurant but which is usually very mediocre. We get better food here for much less and we have theatres, Lastminute.com and Leicester Square booth for tickets, etc, and the museums are free and easily accessible.

I love London and living here but I wouldn't want to have to do it on a low income. How real Londoners get allocated social housing is a mystery - I don't think it happens nowadays and I think that's rather sad. Although London has always been transient it has never before been as transient as now, I don't think.

[Fairylea]

www.rightmove.co.uk/property-for-sale/property-43588472.html

5 bedroom house under 200k in south norfolk.

Couldn't get a flat in London for that.

[andsmile]

Just come to live in Brum OP - you have massive benefits of city life without the hassel of congestions and prices that London has AND..you can always nip to London quite easily via train.

Our 3 bed house is 200k. Quite affluent area. One of the best places to bring up kids

If you yearn for a different life then change, move. Cease the day n all that

[fuckinglondonballs]

Fairylea: what's the job situation like in Norfolk? I know you could earn less but DH and I are quite ambitious and enjoy our jobs and are looking forward to the rest of our careers. Are there any big companies there? If so which ones?

[NigellasDealer]

Bernard Matthews fucknglondonballs

[fuckinglondonballs]

Oh hold on, I've just looked at train times. 15 mins to the station, 2.5 hours to Liverpool street then 45 mins to where our friends live. Bit of a treck for a day out.

[fuckinglondonballs]

NigellasDealer: oh.

[GotMyGoat]

Me, DH and DD found somewhere at the very edge of London for under £800 a month!

We live in a house share, and all 3 of us sleep in a very cramped room.

Yay for Poverty! We are probably going to move out in a couple of years to more affordable pastures...

[FidelineandFumblin]

Yay for Poverty!



How old is DD?

[TondelayoSchwarzkopf]

School children in London do better than pupils in the rest of the UK even when you control for socio-economic factors.

Also the jobs are here. There's a reason why things are much cheaper outside London. My job doesn't exist in any other part of the UK.

[Cuteypatootey]

800 pounds a month won't get you a decent flat in London. I left after have Dc as the expensive Childcare was not enabling me to do anything fun. Living there is a lot different from visiting for the day. I do love London and enjoyed my time there but I am happy now to visit as a tourist and seeing the nice stuff without having to deal with commutes, unmanageable Childcare and all the other day to day stresses.

[FidelineandFumblin]

In terms of surving stab wounds you mean?

[littleducks]

We love in a northern London Borough. Rent for 3 bed houses are about 1300/month. I think lots of family's do live in flats, though probably not as many as in more central London.

I'm not sure about housing benefit etc and rates but I exist people do have to claim to help pay the bills if there is only one income.

What about somewhere like Watford, it's not London bur much cheaper council tax but overground and mainline trains mean quick link into central London? The must be articular pages to the South too.

[littleducks]

Tondelayo, you have to pay our register or something for that link. Could you C&P the salient points it sounds really interesting

[FidelineandFumblin]

In all seriousness, school violence is a serious problem link (Guardian) and countering that by pointing out that average exam results are good is somewhat missing the point. The success, even adequacy, of an education cannot be measured by academic outcomes alone.

[TondelayoSchwarzkopf]

Guardian link about the same story.

Your link doesn't say anything about London schools and violence compared with the rest of the UK Fid

[FidelineandFumblin]

TBH I'm not sure I care Tonde. If it extends country-wide I think I'd rather not know; I find it all genuinely depressing. Anyone reading this, Londoner or otherwise, can compare with schools they have knowledge of and judge for themselves whether it might be an issue that is worse in cities or not. If they are considering a move to London from an area without knives in schools (supposing such areas exist) then it's just a heads up to look closely at potential schools/areas. No harm done.

Anecdotally, non-London friends with DC seem shocked by some of what has happened here, except a few in other v large cities.

It shouldn't ever happen anywhere. Schools and teachers should have tools to assist them in dealing with violence. They have quite the opposite. Every measure they had at their diposal has been removed or diluted.