WTF? "Half of all uncircumcised males will, over the course of their lifetime, develop some kind of medical issue related to their foreskin."

[missingwelliesinsd]

Question as a Brit in the USA. I just read this news article on the never-ending debate (in the USA at least) of whether it's better to circumcise male babies. Some paper just issued by the Mayo Clinic concluded that the benefits out weigh the risks 100-1 and it would be unethical to not circumcise a male baby just it it would be if you don't get immunizations for your child. WTF?

I know that circumcising can help reduce STD transmissions - but hey, just use a condom! What I can't believe is that "50% of non-circumcised males have medical issues with their foreskins." That would make 50% of most of the male population of Europe having foreskin issues at some point. Can this be right? I tend to think it's just American prejudice against foreskins after decades of snipping. I'm TTC and if I do and we have a boy, no way am I snipping the poor thing.

Here's the article:
jezebel.com/circumcision-rates-decline-in-the-u-s-1557539810

Told you so, dontforget. Here comes the abuse,

And it's no more a minor op in a baby than an adult.

It just means you can hold down a baby to mutilate it but sn adult might possibly object and punch you in the face.

shak not abuse love.

I don't mutilate babies. I don't abuse.

at Shatshuka

You know what this reminds me of.

Back in days of yonder women were made to give birth in the most brutal of surroundings, shackled and their husbands weren't allowed to go in the room. The women were given drugs so that they would forget the experience. Because, people believed that even though they'd gone through the pain it didn't matter because they'd never remember it. It was called 'twilight sleep'

www.feministe.us/blog/archives/2009/09/15/on-birth-and-fog/

We'd say this was barbaric.. would we not? Even though they can't remember it?

So why the hell is it okay to put a baby through pain, condoning it because it's 'easier' and saying 'they forget the pain'

Animation

Shouldn't no mean no?

and if someone can't consent then it shouldn't be done?

Boney

What?

No mean no?

Yes agree. Nursey

If it's so good why arnt adult makes queuing up to have it done to them without anaesthetic. After all the health benefits are so good.

You're welcome shatshuka. Only I'm not uninformed. Or did my posts about having two Nigerian midwives for sister in laws for the past 30years and being married to a Nigerian where cultural practices abound are as common as anything pass you by?...

Animation it's reverse psychology. Now come on you must keep up the pretense of being the uninformed ones!

"What I can't believe is that "50% of non-circumcised males have medical issues with their foreskins."

Yep - I'm with OP!

but an adult might possibly object and punch you in the face .

That's better Animation we'll make a convert out of you yet!

If I opened a church called the 'geraldine mutilationist anti earlobe congregation' and decreed that all children should have their earlobes removed at birth (girls and boys, lets not be discriminatory) because they don't need them, they serve no purpose and I'd be reducing the number of earlobe cancers. Oh yeah and because my imaginary friend said I should, I would be arrested and rightly so. I can't see any difference in circumsising boys or girls and find any suggestion its better for babies to have bits removed frankly ludicrous.

thebody

if you actually did some research then you'd know that, in fact, it IS a very minor procedure on a newborn baby as opposed to an adult or older child where it is less straight forward and more complex. Nothing to do with holding them down, for gods sake. Again, that's just the hyperbole on this thread.

I'm sorry Animation was that too fast for you?

If someone can't consent then it shouldn't be done.

You shouldn't be able to force something on someone that they are unable to consent to. The default response should be no it can't be done.

Not hyperbole at all. If you've done research you'd know they did indeed hold them down.

Boney I believe Animation is being sarcastic.

Shak - I was about to post the same thing to you! I agree this is pointless.

Caruthers, speaking for myself, this thread illustrates prejudice in that many of the posters do not have any knowledge of what they are talking about and yet do not have an open mind when presented with evidence which challenges their beliefs. So they have effectively 'pre judged' the issue, not on a rational basis.

This is made more frustrating by the shrill tone adopted by some, the accusations of abuse, etc. I see this as a way of obscuring the debate -it puts off anyone but the toughest posters (hats off, Shaks) from contributing to the debate. It also makes me wince when I see posts such as the 'glad to be a Brit' above. I am a Brit, too. We don't speak in a unique voice.

There is also an element of demonisation of 'foreign' cultures - there is often an undertone of contempt to the American private healthcare, for instance.

I say that as someone who is not Muslim, Jewish, African or American and with a DH who is none of these things either.

Boney - I'm with you on this!!

Primafacie you're wrong and it is ignorant to assume others don't have the knowledge. I've stated it several times that I for one have knowledge of how the cultural excuses reasons are given out. Medical and religious reasons go without saying. I vehemently opposed ds being done as the only reason for it was that 'it was tradition'. Tradition is not a concrete enough reason to put my ds through an unnecessary minor op.

Shak yes you don't need to hold down a baby as they are helpless arnt they. Helpless and trusting.

The radio 5 interviews about FGM with women who had been cut involved sitting in the girls chests while they were cut with blades/scissors but they were 9 so more able to fight back. Obviously though they could not.

There is absolutely no evidence that routine circumsicion has health benefits. There just isn't.

The research comes from America where the Jewish Lobby is huge.

Research from Europe refuted this and there are many male groups around the world who have suffered greatly from this procedure mentally and physically.

It's cruel child abuse. It's vile, it's torture.

Those who allow it or participate in it are abusers.

Primafacie the removal of a healthy piece of skin from a babies genitals in the name of religion/culture is disgusting.

You're trying to rationalise an outdated and frankly disgusting practice.

I for one don't care who I upset when I condemn it and neither should I.

Their feelings on this issue are of no consequence.