isn't a bit of 'benign' neglect' a better parenting approach than helicopter parenting ?

[calopene]

.....By that I meaning giving kids a bit of responsability to do their own thing , helping them put up withand develop a bit of resilience to situations which are difficult/ uncomfortable. Also exposingthem to a bit of problem solving etc. Kids thrive when not cossetted/controlled and 'protected' to within an inch of their lives.

[SmallTorch]

Depends on the child too I suppose.

[wordfactory]

subliminal that is refreshingly honest of you!

[LoolsLikeTheBackOfABus]

Usually I'd agree with you OP. My son, 13, has been very unsettled since going back to school this term and has been sobbing about being left on his own in the dark later this week until 9pm (something we've done many times). Should I just say 'tough'? Or shall I cancel my meeting?

[Dawndonnaagain]

LooisLike is he being bullied at school?

[SubliminalMassaging]

Well word while I can be a slightly over-involved mother in some respects, I am extremely laid back in others. I've always been supportive at school but never pushy or competitive for them and in retrospect that has been a mistake. I think they have all developed a habit of looking at the high achievers and thinking 'they are not like me, I cannot be like that.' But so much of it is in the mind, and in the way you are conditioned to think.

I've always wanted my children to be secure, happy and popular more than I've wanted them to be disciplined, focused and super-clever.

They are all of above average intelligence I think (not that that's saying much, really) but none are overly blessed with self discipline and focus, and I am starting to wonder if just 'being happy and popular' will seem like all it's cracked up to be, when they are 35 and can't can't get a mortgage.

[HepsibarCrinkletoes]

I am more in the benign neglect camp. My older children are very capable and independent and have all been absolutely staggered at the sheer number of 'children' starting university with them. 18/19 year olds who are incapable of anything because they've spent their whole lives being cosseted and fussed over.

Re the tube. People do jump, but it is not an every day occurrence. Mine have all been taking the tube themselves/with friends since they started secondary. Youngest is only 4, but I expect I will give her the same length of lead that the others have had.

I've always said that one should give them more than one is comfortable with, but less than they want. How else are they going to learn. It is my job as a parent to raise confident able children, not ferry them everywhere always and then expect the poor fuckers to manage perfectly when they head off to uni. The worst request for help from DD1 since starting last year was 'how can I jazz up value baked beans'. Friends of hers couldn't boil a fucking egg because their mothers had pretty much done everything bar wipe their arses. That is WAY more damaging.

[Awomansworth]

Well there is risk everywhere. You make choices as a parent and have to be comfortable with that choice. Should something go wrong will you be happy that you had your child's safety as a priority when you made that decision. I do believe that sometimes it's for the benefit of the parent as they just can't be arsed dressed up as giving the dc some freedom.

A few months back I had too go into the house with one 5 year old child leaving the other 5 year old in the garden playing. We have a big garden but it is secure in that they can't get out.

In that 5 minutes whilst upstairs the dc in the garden had managed to nearly hang himself from the climbing frame rope. He got tangled and couldn't free himself and was getting very distressed. Had I had just been sitting in the house giving him some independent time who knows what might have happened.

You don't need to be a helicopter parent, but you do need to be vigilant from afar. When at the park, I let them get on with it, but I can always see them. Someone in charge of children needs to be competent in any situation that may arise.

[TantrumsAndBalloons]

See, I have a problem with this.

I am not helicoptery at all. My teenage DCs take a train/bus to school, ds2 is 10 and has just started riding his bike to school.
We live in north london, not in an especially nice part but they are allowed to go out and meet friends etc.

The teenagers are very responsible. They can cook, iron, do laundry, all the normal stuff that they should know how to do.

It's not neglect in any way shape or form.
It's teaching them life skills. It's not a case of sitting back and letting them get on with it without any guidance.
I didn't send them out of the door with an Oyster card and map and hope for the best.

I object to the point that you either have to be helicoptery or neglectful.
IMO it takes a lot of work and guidance and teaching in order to raise independent capable young adults.

I don't think anyone would advocate teaching them nothing and hoping they just pick it up somehow.
That is neglectful.

[HepsibarCrinkletoes]

Sublimnal I'm pretty like you, but the one thing I've always said to them is work as hard as you can - your results will ONLY affect you and your lives, so it's up to you what you do. My daughters are very high achievers (A/A* all the way) and DS is average, with brilliance in the two subjects he wants to study at Uni. He fucked up two GCSEs that he must get a grade C for - his fault and he knows it. But, it's given him his own massive kick up the bum and he will make damn sure he passes his resits.

[AtiaoftheJulii]

It's not neglect in any way shape or form.

Absolutely, Tantrums. I sometimes say BN as a joke, but imo it takes at least as much effort to help them learn how to do things for themselves than to do everything for them.

[wordfactory]

See I agree Tantrums.

I actually think that giving your DC the skills they will need to be independent takes a lot of effort on a parent's part. Soem parents will do this consciously, others unconsciously.

But it is the antithisis of benign neglect, which is middle class complasent smuggery at its worst IMVHO!

[clam]

Anyone who read Tantrums' hilarious thread about babysitting her friend's 3 year old recently will know for sure that she's not a helicopter parent!

[Thepowerof3]

I do hope you're not suggesting that watching our kids swim is helicoptering as that would be a thread about a thread and a sad indictment of your parenting. I don't get why you don't believe that some people enjoy spending time with their kids

[Thepowerof3]

And I second that you have no idea of the distinction between helicopter parents and normal parents

[Retropear]

I think a happy medium of both is best.

I also think only the wealthier parents can actually do BN.

Parents stuck in tiny houses in dangerous areas with kids in crap schools I 'm sure would love to kick back and let their kids play in the orchard,rampage through the large house and leave it to the uber good private school to get their kids into a good uni and have all the chances in life.

But they can't.

[cory]

Good point about teaching being the way to independence. Imo helicopter parents and neglectful parents have a lot in common: they are the ones that can't be arsed to do the teaching work.

[Thepowerof3]

I'd agree with that Cory, a lot of thought goes into knowing when to let go and how much. Kids with no street smarts ( for want of a better word) can get into much more trouble.

[Bonsoir]

"I sometimes say BN as a joke, but imo it takes at least as much effort to help them learn how to do things for themselves than to do everything for them."

It is, IMO, easier to outsource "doing everything for them" than "helping to learn how to do things for themselves". Where I live there are a lot of DC whose nanny/housekeepers wait on them hand and foot.

[Thepowerof3]

Oh and sending your kids to classes with their Nanny is NOT the opposite of helicopter parenting Calopene

[MrsMook]

I've seen too many Brownies/ teenagers being unable to complete basic skills, daft things like washing their own hair. The worst one was my friend at school who was 17 and didn't realise she was washing her hair with conditioner while on a 5 day residential trip. It was her mum's fault for packing the wrong shampoo It tends to be some kind of combination of babyfying or lack of patience or time to teach the child.

I think I'd have a tough time helicoptering DS1. I need to improve my running speed for one. He is very focused and independent and doesn't often like me lurking/ interfering as he plays. Sometimes he needs some encouragement and gentle pushing if his confidence is wavering, but by and large he's very capable and aware of his limits and thinks about what he's doing before going gung-ho.

His cousins are very helicoptered. Their parents are very meticulous about any kind of mess, can't play outside if it's slightly dampish. His 6yr old cousin struggles to use a knife to cut his own food- where as DS (nearly 3) is giving it a good try with his child-size knife and just needs a little help finishing the tough bits. I think I know which child will have more survival skill when it's time to leave home.

[dapplegrey]

Our neighbour is very careful. When her daughter went to London by herself for the first time aged 18, she was given a list of instructions for the hour long journey saying things like 'when the train stops at Waterloo that means you have arrived. Now you must get off the train.'

[MrsOakenshield]

I think watching from afar, as a pp put it, is a good way forward. Be ready to step in when needed, but let them get on with it too. And absolutely yes to teaching life skills, I was astonished when I started uni at the number of people who couldn't cook a proper meal.

[sarahtigh]

benign neglect is not letting toddler on the tube alone or crossing the road alone the key is the word "benign" ie harmless

when benign neglect is used as a parenting term it does not mean neglect it does involve teaching children skills it just means not doing anything for them they are capable of doing themselves and encouraging them to do more and to explore and investigate their surroundings, it also means not over structuring their day with activities but allowing free play

freedom within safe parameters I let my almost 4 year old run around the playpark on her own from sitting on the bench I can see her she can see me but I am not standing at base of slide waiting to catch her or standing behind her as she climbs so my hand is never more than 30cm from her back, it is true she may fall over running but being 20 metres away is fine,

she plays in our back garden alone she is allowed to go upstairs without me following her be in different rooms, it is allowing them to be bored sometimes, not always playing with them or providing activites

my DD is happy content, adventurous and independent for her age

[Bonsoir]

My DSS1 has just started university and he is, sadly, one of the ones who cannot cook a proper meal. He doesn't know how to go shopping either. Or a million other basic life skills.

I am very sad that this should be so, and it is not for want of my trying. But there is only so much you can achieve with a DC whose own mother taught him nothing, outsourced everything and just doesn't care. Getting him to a very good university was as much as DP and I could reasonably achieve without all the life skills stuff on top.

Thank goodness for text messages and iPhones - I have told him to use technology as much as he needs to stay in touch and ask questions as they arise.

[SubliminalMassaging]

I agree with WF that there is a big difference between BN and trusting yourself to know when to back off and let your children learn from their own mistakes, but I think we are all talking at slight cross purposes on this thread. The ones of us with older children are talking about encouraging personal responsibility and independence, mostly in relation to educational achievement, time management, etc, whereas the ones with younger children seem not to be able to think further than 'of course I won't let him go to the park alone - he's only seven, and I don't allow painting in the house because it gets in the carpet, but that doesn't mean he never gets a chance to be creative. I just make him go in the garden and I stand over him with a cloth in my hand.'

I don't think the real Uber Helicopters recognise themselves as helicopters at all - they just think they are highly organised, pro-active, supportive and driven and while they may begrudgingly admit they are a tad pushy and controlling at times they don't see it as a bad thing. To them the crime is in not caring enough to want to steer things.

Likewise the slightly apathetic parents who think that almost any attempt to control the way their children play, learn, socialise, is to be sneered at. We all look for evidence that our way is the right way and we all look for a reason to feel a bit smug that someone who does it very differently is getting it wrong. We have to - it's the only thing that keeps us sane.