To not see the point of suspending pupils from school

[LEMisdisappointed]

Spurred on by the intellectual hothouse that is "my parents are aliens" where Mel was suspended from school for breaching school uniform rules, it got me wondering about this.

The government have recently changed the rules regarding holiday absences so no absecne during term time unless its life or death etc. This rule was passed, i assume, to ensure that all children attend school, especially from families that were lax about this sort of thing. Families which may have children who are more likely to be disruptive in school.

I hated school, but wasn't a naughty child, however i would have been delighted to be suspended! I mean, two weeks or however long off school. I should imagine that many children would feel the same way and some parents may not give a fig.

What does it achieve and isn't rather contrary in light of recent changes in the laws regarding unauthorised absence. I know a suspension is authoried but it would be as disruptive to a childs education (possibly more so) than a child being taken out for the reason of a holiday.

Just wondered

[MrsLouisTheroux]

'Internal exclusion' at my school works. The pupils hate it. They complete work set by subject teachers in isolation and have different lunch and break times. It's used when pupils are disruptive, persistantly break school rules, are rude or anti social.
If this doesn't work, pupils are sent home and excluded for up to 5 days. Their parents deal with the problem with the school and sometimes outside agencies become involved. They return after a meeting with the Head and are on 'contract' - a report that needs signing by teachers each lesson.
If this doesn't work and behaviour continues to disrupt other's learning, they are told to find another school.
Pupils rarely get past the 'internal exclusion' stage when a school's behaviour policy works.

Oh and YABU! :)

[paperclipsarebetterthanstaples]

Would you want to be the teacher supervising the group of teenagers (many of them bigger and stronger than many teachers) who had ALL been excluded for disruption / violence though?

[MrsLouisTheroux]

nkf Support is key for ASD, ADHD or other pupils with LD.
If a school invests in the correct level of support staff for it's pupils they can thrive. There is no need for children to suffer because of LD. The school should support them correctly. I agree that when schools fail to support their pupils (note 'schools' as in management & learning supprt not individual teachers) behaviour can deteriorate.

[burberryqueen]

'Internal exclusion' at my school works. The pupils hate it,,,,,,,, used when pupils are disruptive, persistantly break school rules, are rude or anti social
or for wearing the wrong texture of black trousers for example.....

[MrsLouisTheroux]

paperclip Pupil referral units are where permenantly excluded pupils go when no school will take them. My DH worked in one for years. Not all disruptive pupils are physically violent.

[MrsLouisTheroux]

burberry at your DC's school maybe? Not all.

[burberryqueen]

and that is not even true in our area about the PRU; pupils that no other schools will take i mean.

[burberryqueen]

yes IME of course mrstheroux

[MrsLouisTheroux]

Although having said that, constantly turning up in black jeans instead of trousers is 'persistently breaking school rules' isn't it? Never happens at our school if its a one off.

[MrsLouisTheroux]

Who goes to the PRU near you burberry if not excluded pupils who can't be placed elsewhere?

[tethersend]

The law has recently changed surrounding exclusions. Work must be provided from day one of an exclusion, and from day six alternative provision (not at home) must be in place.

It is now the parent/carer's responsibility that the student does not go out during school hours during the first five days of an exclusion.

[burberryqueen]

well my son was sent to one and there was not even any talk of him attending another local school. even the PRU staff were like...er...what are you doing here?

[tethersend]

*to ensure that

[MrsLouisTheroux]

burberry Possibly no places at other schools in area? Lack of consultation with you?

[burberryqueen]

all the local schools have places without exception. Certainly there was a lack of consultation with me, I was treated like rubbish being a single mother. IMO.

[nkf]

Sometimes kids get lots of support. Sometimes they get all the resources the school has to offer. A few students can take up a lot of time and energy and resources. Those things are not finite. Sometimes, it doesn't work. They don't like their mentor. They won't co-operate with whatever programme is put in place. They push and push and push against all the boundaries. They can't see the role their own behaviour plays in what happens to them. They don't much care about other people's feelings. They always prefer the quick immediate thrill over something more measured. Their school days are hard and I suspect they grow up to have hard lives. And sometimes, I believe, they have to go. They are beyond the resources of that particular school.

[tethersend]

"paperclip Pupil referral units are where permenantly excluded pupils go when no school will take them. My DH worked in one for years. Not all disruptive pupils are physically violent."

Many pupils at PRUs have not been permanently excluded, but are there as a result of a 'managed move' from mainstream school. The law on this has changed recently too, with students in alternative provision as a result of a managed move remaining the responsibility of their original school. Their exam results count towards their stats and any funding implications must be met by the original school and not the alternative provision.

This is in part to avoid what tends to happen in some schools- excluding students who need support with their behaviour in Y11 who they know are not going to get good exam results. However, it will almost certainly result in an increase in permanent exclusions.

[tethersend]

Unless a child has been permanently excluded then a mainstream place must be offered if one is available and is requested.

[tethersend]

*permanently

[burberryqueen]

reallly tethersend i wish i had known that at the time.

[nkf]

Did you not find out?

[nkf]

I mean, exclusion letters always tell you what your options are.

[burberryqueen]

well obviously not....actually i felt quite railroaded and they kept talking a different language when i was there.

[burberryqueen]

no those options were not laid out/made clear to me - i was told he was going to the PRU and that was it.
there was no exclusion letter as there was no exclusion per se.

[McNewPants2013]

I hated school, loved it when I got excluded.

Hated being sent to the isolation block.